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Still Not Getting The Hang Of Sailor Naginata Togi

sailor naginata chinese japanese

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16 replies to this topic

#1 MimiToto

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Posted 16 March 2015 - 17:08

I bought a naginata togi back in september of 2014, after 6 months of trying, I'm still not comfortable or finding a nice surprise with the nib.

 

I tried to practice chinese penmanship with it, which is what the nib was designed for, but I find it much harder to use than a regular or soft nib, even a Noodler flex was easier to do asian calligraphy with. Or the stroke just looks odd. Am I using it wrong?

 

Anyone have any advice on how to properly use the naginata togi? Or tricks to control the nib more easily? 

 

Giving this another 6 months and if nothing works, I'm probably going to sell it. :(

 

 



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#2 Algester

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Posted 16 March 2015 - 17:30

start low angle then slowly move to a higher angle (as your pulling the nib) also follow the stroke pattern if your using chinese calligraphy else it will look odd assuming your right handed as well

Edited by Algester, 16 March 2015 - 17:31.


#3 Dr.Grace

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 00:18

I have never found the NT nib good for Chinese characters; they just don't give brush-like strokes. I think the fude or concord style nibs are much better for that.


These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

#4 Downcelot

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 01:38

My motto is simpler; it's your pen, it's better write the way you want it to or ... the high way.

 

I think you have to understand the nature of the nib before you start to have expectation. NT is designed to give different line thicknesses depending on the angles of writing. It is a less variety version of the zoom nib. If you are thinking of getting different line variations on the down-stroke, might as well getting a vintage flex nib with a round tipping, that does the trick better imo.



#5 Dr.Grace

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 19:14

My motto is simpler; it's your pen, it's better write the way you want it to or ... the high way.

 

I think you have to understand the nature of the nib before you start to have expectation. NT is designed to give different line thicknesses depending on the angles of writing. It is a less variety version of the zoom nib. If you are thinking of getting different line variations on the down-stroke, might as well getting a vintage flex nib with a round tipping, that does the trick better imo.

 

 

I agree with your motto, definitely. But I disagree with your other comparison: I had a Zoom nib, which I didn't like, and now have a NT-MF. The NT produces more line variation than the zoom. The zoom writes a much broader line, with only a little variation according to pen angle.

 

A flex nib might be worth trying out, but in my experience flex nibs also are not so well suited for Chinese characters.


Edited by Dr.Grace, 17 March 2015 - 19:16.

These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

#6 Jeff_H

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Posted 18 March 2015 - 02:15

Let me start by saying I've never tried to write Chinese characters with my NT's.

 

However, I own five NT nibs, four in MF and one in M. They all write just slightly differently, and give different line widths. I don't get a huge amount of line variation from any of them, however, regardless of the one I choose, imparts a certain character to my handwriting that no other nib does; be it Japanese or German... high end of low end.

 

The Naginata-Togi nib is simply the best writing nib I've ever found. Maybe give it a go as a writer in English.


I enjoy MB 146 pens, Sailor, Pilot and Platinum pens as well. I have a strong attraction to dark red and muted green ink, colors I dislike for everything but FP ink. I also enjoy practicing my handwriting and attempting to improve it. I love the feel of quality paper under a gold nib.  


#7 danrodcard

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Posted 20 March 2015 - 00:35

Should not be used more like a brush? The pen should change angle along the stroke

#8 Frank C

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 07:39

Lots of good advice above. The nib is made to vary the line width by changing the angle of incidence of the pen with the paper. I use mine for writing English, too. It is not a nib for everyone. 


"One can not waste time worrying about small minds . . . If we were normal, we'd still be using free ball point pens." —Bo Bo Olson "I already own more ink than a rational person can use in a lifetime." —Waski_the_Squirrel
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#9 Chrissy

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Posted 24 March 2015 - 07:59

I would like to see pictures of the pen and the nib if you have any



#10 rudyhou

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Posted 30 March 2015 - 08:37

you're not the only one who is having a hard time trying to get used to or to like the use of naginata-togi nib.  i think this is one of those nibs that are not for everyone.  i personally think that we should get a nib that works well with how we write, not changing the way we write in order to enjoy the use of the nib.  this being said, i do like many of sailor pens due to their design, and end up buying more despite my hand still not agreeable to sailor's nib performance.  


-rudy-

#11 Frank C

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Posted 30 March 2015 - 09:36

you're not the only one who is having a hard time trying to get used to or to like the use of naginata-togi nib.  i think this is one of those nibs that are not for everyone.  i personally think that we should get a nib that works well with how we write, not changing the way we write in order to enjoy the use of the nib.  this being said, i do like many of sailor pens due to their design, and end up buying more despite my hand still not agreeable to sailor's nib performance.  

 

I have to agree with you. My Naginata Togis get very little ink time. I just have so many other pens whose nibs I prefer. I do like the Naginata Togi and the story behind them; I just find other nibs more useful. My Sailor King Eagle Pen almost always has ink in it. It is a very unique nib. 


"One can not waste time worrying about small minds . . . If we were normal, we'd still be using free ball point pens." —Bo Bo Olson "I already own more ink than a rational person can use in a lifetime." —Waski_the_Squirrel
I'm still trying to figure out how to list all my pens down here.

#12 jeffkoch

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 22:38

 

<snip>  My Sailor King Eagle Pen almost always has ink in it. It is a very unique nib. 

I think the greatest line width variation* with pen angle is probably found in the Sailor Cross Music nib.   It is closely related to the 2-layer Sailor Cross Point nib and its big brother, the aforementioned Sailor King Eagle 3-layer nib.  The Sailor Cross Music is a Sailor Cross nib which has been ground to be much finer on the down stroke, and it has been ground to have a rocker like the Sailor Zoom nib, which creates line variation with pen angle.  But because the Sailor Cross Music is like two Zoom nibs stacked, the rocker is much longer -- like a pairing knife versus a chefs knife.   



#13 Keyless Works

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Posted 03 April 2015 - 03:31

I only write in English but I love the feel of the Naginata Togi.  I have only had mine for a short while but it's one of my favorites. 

 

dsc_0849-e1428024464364.jpg?w=1150dsc_0852.jpg?w=1150&h=836



#14 Frank C

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Posted 03 April 2015 - 13:59

I only write in English but I love the feel of the Naginata Togi.  I have only had mine for a short while but it's one of my favorites. 

 

 

 

Your photos of the Naginata Togi nib do a good job showing its shape. Line width varies with the angle of the pen relative to the paper being written on. "N-MF" on the side of the nib is short for "Naginata, Medium Fine". 


"One can not waste time worrying about small minds . . . If we were normal, we'd still be using free ball point pens." —Bo Bo Olson "I already own more ink than a rational person can use in a lifetime." —Waski_the_Squirrel
I'm still trying to figure out how to list all my pens down here.

#15 Karmachanic

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Posted 17 November 2018 - 11:50

you're not the only one who is having a hard time trying to get used to or to like the use of naginata-togi nib.  i think this is one of those nibs that are not for everyone.  i personally think that we should get a nib that works well with how we write, not changing the way we write in order to enjoy the use of the nib.  this being said, i do like many of sailor pens due to their design, and end up buying more despite my hand still not agreeable to sailor's nib performance.  

 

Greetings,

 

Liking the idea of these nibs, I find myself with a vague wish to purchase one at some undefined time in the future. So I've been diggig around looking for users experiences.

 

In the past, when I did such things (gave it up 20 years ago), I had the good fortune to drink many exquisite vintage wines. Each with different characteristics, that best paired with differing suitable foods. I wouldn't have even entertained the thought of restricting myself to one vintage, from one vinyard. For me nibs are similar. Exhibiting different characteristics to be enjoyed for themselves.

 

Sometimes one takes out the Quattroporte, sometimes the Turbo Carrerra. Depends. Conid with a Ti cursive italic or Pro Gear with NT. Different experience.

 

Anyway. Back to trying to find the average line width of a M NT nib held at a 45ºish angle.


Edited by Karmachanic, 17 November 2018 - 13:12.

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#16 minddance

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Posted 17 November 2018 - 13:30

feel free to explore different angles, up down left right, to get the most out of these pens.

even the normal nibs respond very well to different angles.

#17 TheDutchGuy

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Posted 19 November 2018 - 10:03

 

I wouldn't have even entertained the thought of restricting myself to one vintage, from one vinyard. For me nibs are similar. Exhibiting different characteristics to be enjoyed for themselves.

 

 

Exactly!







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