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Pelikan - Best For Signature?

pelikan signature signatures

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73 replies to this topic

#21 DrCodfish

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 19:22

A big plus one for this comment from CNJ:

 

"I'm not sure anyone has mentioned this yet, but you should at least consider purchasing the pen from either nibs.com or Richardspens.com. Both sites are run by "nibmeisters," who will make 100% sure that the pen writes smoothly before sending it out to you."

 

Not only will you get a pen that is certian to write perfectly, tuned to your specifications, you will also get a live person on the phone to talk you through the process if needed.  Going this route adds a premium to the price but it relieves you of that nagging qiuestion "Is this how it is supposed to work?" if something does not seem as you had anticipated.

 

One way to take the sting out of the cost at least a little bit is to look at the pre-owned Pelikans at Nibs.com:

 

http://www.nibs.com/...pelikancont.htm

 

I am relatively new to FP's myself (a couple years and about 75 pens new) and have had excellent experiences with both of these vendors.  I see a couple M800's and a nice understated black M600 which migh add to that flair when you go to make those nice signatures, plus with many of these you get your nib of choice.  Oh yes, get your table napkin out when you open this site or you'll be salivating all over your keyboard.

 

Can't wait to hear your first impressions when you put your new pen to paper. l



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#22 Pterodactylus

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 19:55

Nothing can replace a personal test writing in a good shop with experienced stuff, especially when you are new to FPs.

 

A phone call is a poor replacement for it, and about which preferences should a newbie talk? ;)

 

When I read some posts a newbie must get the impression that he only gets a good pen when buying from 1 or 2 sources worldwide which is simply not true.

 

Oh my god..... I´m sitting on a underdeveloped continent as none of the only 2 good FP sources are located in Europe. ;)

The pens are made in Europe, but without magical tuning by a nibmeister they are only (bleep), not capable of writing a single correct letter..... I´m lost ...... :headsmack:

 

@NJGuy:

 

I think your plan is good and the best you can do.

 

The M200 or M215 are very good entry piston fillers with very good steel nibs.

I would say, try them also out, there is nothing wrong with them, they are great starter pens.

 

As already said, go to the shop try many pens and you will very soon see what you like and what you don´t like.

This is a highly personal thing very different from person to person.

 

Don´t forget to post your experiences when you got one :)


Edited by Pterodactylus, 27 November 2013 - 19:56.

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#23 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 20:08

A B might be more reasonable...they are wider on modern pens than vintage.

 

Defiantly take a look at that NY pen store....it's very well known.

Have them walk you through nib widths.

 

Goulets has that on-line service but some one will have to help you with a link.

You can look at this or that company's width for a nib and compare.

 

While you are at it look at the many beautiful 600's, there is a city series, a nature series, a real fancy red, green and or blue one. The nib is stiff enough to survive Conan. It's not a nail but a stiffer regular flex than vintage. It's modern so will be butter smooth.

 

You will have to do some studying for what ink is good for official documents...Noodlers.

 

What kind of impression you want to make with the thank you notes....something that is not black and too formal. We are living in the Golden Age of Inks.

There are two toned shading inks, and vivid mono-tone supersaturated permanent inks. You need both.

I have 11 greens about that in blue's. With out even trying I have 6-7 Blue Blacks...and each of course is different. Why have the same ink by another company.

There is a tone for any occasion.

 

For tips; go to ink reviews.....Sandy1 our ink guru has done a lot of first class work with inks, nib width and papers. It's astounding how changing a  paper o ra  nib width will change the tone of an ink.

 

Actually using a fountain pen is easy, hold it behind the big index finger knuckle, and it will float effortlessly in a small puddle of ink. 45 degrees is right after the big knuckle, 40 degrees is at the start of the web of your thumb.

35 degrees is in the pit of the web of your thumb. Any of those positions is OK. I let the weight of the fountain pen decide how far down in the web of my thumb a Fountain pen sets.

 

Main rule is unlike plowing the south forty with out a mule....like using a ball point. You grasp the fountain pen like it's a featherless baby bird.

Don't make bird paste.

 

The fountain pen will skate in it's little puddle of ink, with no more pressure needed than the weight of the pen.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#24 DrCodfish

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 21:46

Nothing can replace a personal test writing in a good shop with experienced stuff, especially when you are new to FPs.

 

A phone call is a poor replacement for it, and about which preferences should a newbie talk? ;)

 

When I read some posts a newbie must get the impression that he only gets a good pen when buying from 1 or 2 sources worldwide which is simply not true.

 

Oh my god..... I´m sitting on a underdeveloped continent as none of the only 2 good FP sources are located in Europe. ;)

The pens are made in Europe, but without magical tuning by a nibmeister they are only (bleep), not capable of writing a single correct letter..... I´m lost ...... :headsmack:

 

@NJGuy:

 

I think your plan is good and the best you can do.

 

The M200 or M215 are very good entry piston fillers with very good steel nibs.

I would say, try them also out, there is nothing wrong with them, they are great starter pens.

 

As already said, go to the shop try many pens and you will very soon see what you like and what you don´t like.

This is a highly personal thing very different from person to person.

 

Don´t forget to post your experiences when you got one :)

 

Pter said:

"Nothing can replace a personal test writing in a good shop with experienced stuff, especially when you are new to FPs.  A phone call is a poor replacement for it, and about which preferences should a newbie..."

 

I agree with this.  I defiitely think that the OP should get hands on pens if possible and did not mean to suggest that a phone cal is a good substitute.  I happen to live about 120 miles one way from the nearest shop that carries Pels so it's a challenge for me go test pens. 

 

"Oh my god..... I´m sitting on a underdeveloped continent as none of the only 2 good FP sources are located in Europe."

 

I didn't say that and it is not what I meant, I apologize if my comments suggested any denigation of Europe.  Again living out in the sticks I often have to rely on over the phone or online resources, for example.  I also rely on the advice of those wtih more exeprience here such as you Pter. you and most everyone else here are very helpful.  I recommended the two sites here in the US because I am here and have had great help and great products from both, and Ibelieve the OP is in the US as well. .

 

 

"The pens are made in Europe, but without magical tuning by a nibmeister they are only (bleep), not capable of writing a single correct letter..... I´m lost "

Again, sorry if I gave that impression, if so I once again apologize..

 

 

"The M200 or M215 are very good entry piston fillers with very good steel nibs.

I would say, try them also out, there is nothing wrong with them, they are great starter pens."

I could not agree more, I have several of both of these pens.  Actually I was going ot suggest that the OP consider a lower spec pen such as a Twsbi 1.1 stub just to get an idea of what this sort of nib might be like.

 

My original thought was that the OP ought to at least look at the mentioned websites to get an idea of what exists and what prices might be, then go to a brick and mortar and try them out to see what feels good.  I also think there is value in buying a well cared for used pen.

 

"This is a highly personal thing very different from person to person"

Truer words were never spoken.



#25 Pterodactylus

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 22:18

ngme.jpg
 

vjd4.jpg
 

(Pelikan 100N - EF ..... Rohrer & Klingner Scabiosa)


Edited by Pterodactylus, 27 November 2013 - 22:19.

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#26 Ghost Plane

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 23:58

+1 for visiting FPH & asking to test & discuss your intended use. Take a sample of the forms you sign & standard paper used by your office & be sure to talk inks. The best pen in the world can behave badly on lowest bidder copy paper. There are inks of all colors that will perform on nasty paper, so be sure to ask & test.

#27 Joe in Seattle

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 00:04

Just wondering: if he only uses the pan five or six times a month to write one or two natures wouldn't it dry out between uses?
"how do I know what I think until I write it down?"

#28 Pterodactylus

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 07:28

To my experience no.

I have often many pens inked up in parallel and sometimes some get not used for several weeks, up to months and normally they do not dry out in between (especially pens with screw cap).

What might happens is that the ink slowly evaporates (from the barrel/converter, depends on the pen and ink how fast it happens) and the ink gets darker, but especially quality pens even then start with confidence and immediately without any problem.

In that case it depends on the ink what happens.
Some inks do not change their properties at all, but some highly saturated inks become almost unusable.
E.g. when Noodler's Apache Sunset or Golden Brown sit in a pen for only a few weeks they become almost unusable, as it would not dry anymore. The ink writes almost normally but it sticks on the paper like glue which does not dry anymore.
Then the ink smears almost forever, even with a blotter paper you hardly can get it dry (behaves like sticky glue).
Others seem almost unaffected, like Pelikan 4001 or Rohrer & Klingner inks.

Edited by Pterodactylus, 28 November 2013 - 07:31.

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#29 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:10

Taking your office paper is good advice.

I went looking for a 'B' the MB M was 'B' on the paper in the B&M...brick and mortar....at home it was M on better paper.

I swapped the nib in on a B....it was a BB. :headsmack: :doh: Ghost Plane would love this pen.

With a Pelikan with in 5 weeks you can swap your nib in.

Do ask for in the middle of the tolerance if you do swap in nibs.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#30 alc3261

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 13:57

Nothing can replace a personal test writing in a good shop with experienced stuff, especially when you are new to FPs.

 

A phone call is a poor replacement for it, and about which preferences should a newbie talk? ;)

 

When I read some posts a newbie must get the impression that he only gets a good pen when buying from 1 or 2 sources worldwide which is simply not true.

 

Oh my god..... I´m sitting on a underdeveloped continent as none of the only 2 good FP sources are located in Europe. ;)

The pens are made in Europe, but without magical tuning by a nibmeister they are only (bleep), not capable of writing a single correct letter..... I´m lost ...... :headsmack:

 

@NJGuy:

 

I think your plan is good and the best you can do.

 

The M200 or M215 are very good entry piston fillers with very good steel nibs.

I would say, try them also out, there is nothing wrong with them, they are great starter pens.

 

As already said, go to the shop try many pens and you will very soon see what you like and what you don´t like.

This is a highly personal thing very different from person to person.

 

Don´t forget to post your experiences when you got one :)

Obviously there are "nibmeisters" in Europe (and elsewhere I'm sure).

The most prominent in the UK is Oxonian.



#31 alc3261

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 13:57

Obviously there are "nibmeisters" in Europe (and elsewhere I'm sure).

The most prominent in the UK is Oxonian.

He does not like to be called a "nibmeister" but he has tuned 3-4 of my pens. 



#32 Pterodactylus

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 14:58

Obviously there are "nibmeisters" in Europe (and elsewhere I'm sure).
The most prominent in the UK is Oxonian.


Yes, of course there are people who can tune a nib also in Europe

But on a flawless new nibs (and even there are faulty ones from every manufacturer, the majority is Ok) there is no need to tune something special.
Tines are aligned, they have no tooth, tipping grind is ok, writing smooth and have the factory default flow rate.

What do you expect to be tuned?
And based on which preferences of which user? (everybody wants something else)

What do you think a shop run by a Nibmeister is doing with each new pen?

I expect that every shop inspects the nib before shipping for correct tine alignment and to have no obvious scratchyness. (I know that not every shop is doing this, but the good ones are doing it).

And I bet that nothing more is done also by a nibmeister shop as long as you don't order something based on your special personal preferences, or buy a custom grinded nib.

When it come to a write test it already become problematic for a shop, as some people will claim that they got a used pen sold.

So IMO nothing can replace to go to a shop physically, test write pens and take exactly the pen you test writed when you like it.

When you have special requirements on the flow or want a custom grind the thing looks different, and even then a remote buy is not the best possible option.
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#33 kpyeoman

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 17:46

Hmm.  I'm not sure if I agree with several of the posts recommending an M800 or an M1000.  Yeah, they're big, bold, impressive pens, but to shell out $500-$800 for these pens to use less than a day a month for a few moments doesn't really make a lot of sense to me.  Maybe it's because I don't get the "signature pen" concept...documents are signed with one of the pens I have in rotation without a special dedication.

 

I agree with the suggestion of the M215.  I have this pen and it's very professional looking with the black and rings finish.  It's got good weight for a pen its size as well.  While it's not a "(bleep) pen," it has sufficient bling to be noticed.  It'll look good and get the job done for a heck of a lot less money (especially since you're new to pens and aren't sure if you're going to like it or not).

 

The broad nib would be my choice as well, given its intended purpose.



#34 NJguy

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 02:18

Maybe the M205 would be a better choice for what I'll be doing with it. So much cheaper too. Now, I wouldn't mind spending the extra couple of hundred dollars or so to get an M600 if it provides a better writing experience and finer output quality. Hey, I'm going to have it for the rest of my life. What do you all think?

 

I'll visit Fountain Pen Hospital and take some papers to test drive the various nibs. Stub, B, Firm is my initial starting point (I think I'm saying that right).

 

As for the ink, I think I'll play it safe and go with Waterman Mysterious Blue.



#35 proton007

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 05:53

^^

Since you're using it for signatures, I'd also recommend to take a look at a Cursive Italic grind. Purchase an M/B nib but get it customized by a nibmeister. CI nibs provide a very nice character, the line variation is subtle enough to be noticed, yet it lays down a generous amount of ink.


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#36 Pterodactylus

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 06:54

^^
Since you're using it for signatures, I'd also recommend to take a look at a Cursive Italic grind. Purchase an M/B nib but get it customized by a nibmeister. CI nibs provide a very nice character, the line variation is subtle enough to be noticed, yet it lays down a generous amount of ink.


I only can repeat myself again (hmmm should consider creating a text module).
Do you really think a newbie can write with a CI nib right away?

I don't think so, as it requires a precise holding and nib alignment not to cut into the paper, not to skip, not to feel scratchy.

@NJGuy
But you could also try a italic nib when you visit Fountain Pen Hospital, ask to try out the IB nib (of the M800).
It is the stock italic nib from Pelikan (so not in all cases a Nibmeister is needed to get a Pelikan italic nib).
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#37 proton007

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 10:50

I only can repeat myself again (hmmm should consider creating a text module).
Do you really think a newbie can write with a CI nib right away?
I don't think so, as it requires a precise holding and nib alignment not to cut into the paper, not to skip, not to feel scratchy.


Thats why I recommend the CI. Its not as sharp as a full I nib.

In a world where there are no eyes the sun would not be light, and in a world where there were no soft skins rocks would not be hard, nor in a world where there were no muscles would they be heavy. Existence is relationship and you're smack in the middle of it.

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#38 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 11:54

Stub would be better than a CI, for a noobie....actually, a regular nib would be best one don't have to hold it quite as exact...though I think if some one 'starts'  with a BB a good B stub would do as well.

 

Could lead to that's pretty , lets do more.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#39 NJguy

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 05:57

By the way, when I do purchase a FP, can I specify exactly what I want the nib to be? Like if I wanted it to be stub, BB, and firm?

 

I looked on the Fountain Pen Hospital website and if I was to order my pen there, it only gives me an option for a Nib Size - XF, F, M, or B. But there is no option for Shape (round, stub, italic) or Type (flexible, firm). What is the standard then?


Edited by NJguy, 30 November 2013 - 05:58.


#40 Pterodactylus

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 07:00

You can't specify how firm or springy it is.
Different nibs on different models are different.
There is an italic option for certain pens, like the 800 and the 2xx but (at least for Pelikan not for every pen).
Otherwise they all have round shapes.
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