My First Pelikan, Questions

September 1, 2013

Hi fellow fountain pen appreciaters

I'm about to get back to writing with fountain pens and to celebrate I would like to buy a new one.

I did a lot of research and I'm thinking Pelikan Souverän M800 or M600, but I still have a few questions and so I still can't decide.

First of all I would prefer a black-green one, but I'm worried about inks staining the inside and thus discolouring the body. I tend to use blue-black inks 80% of times (pelikan, lamy and waterman) but I would probably use it with violet, turquise and brown ink every now and then, for the fun of it

Would black-blue be better for it or that is not an issue?

I am also a bit concerned how will the green tranaslucent body look filled with blue (or even brown, violet) ink. Any opinions/ expereiences?

Since they are rather pricey (but I found a great deal in a nearby shop) the one there is probably quite old. I heard Pelikan had an era with lots of faulty nibs, is there a way I can filter these out at teh shop before I buy it? I'm far from an expert, unfortaunately.

(For example date of manufacture or so?)

I'm inKlined to think thqat the F nib is the one for me, as I read they are rather thick.

I loved the smoothness of the medium parker frontier nib I used, but I found the line too thick. On the other hand the Lamy F, while the thickness is perfect, just doesn't leave a continous line with my speedy writing.

(Though that lamy also makes an annoying scratchign noise, maybe it's faulty? )

Also is there a checklist I should do before and after buying it? (Apart from celaning it after buy.) Since this is big money for me I would like to be extremely careful and find any possible faults and defects.

Apart from the questions above I would happily welcome any advice and pointer about them or concerning my quest for a new fountain pen.

I would like to remain in that price range, the 800 is already straining my budget.

Many thanks for your help and advice

(As introduction: I'm new to this forum, but I'm not totally new to fountain pens, I used them before, altohether for a few years. (At high school but when one got stolen I stopped using them for the fear of loosing them.)

But I count a s newbie. I used my pens with much joy though but I never realised taht there was an itnernational community of fellow fountain pen appreciaters

Edited September 1, 2013 by BCL-2

September 1, 2013

-Most FP inks don't stain. I've never used the Noodlers Bay State Blue inks, but I've heard they can stain.

-See if the shop will let you write with the pen first. If they won't, just buy your Pelikan from Richard Binder at www.richardspens.com. He'll tune your nib for you, and it will write like a dream, guaranteed. There is not real era of "bad" Pelikan nibs of which I am aware. I've been through a ton of Pelikans, and some of them wrote poorly, some great. Buying from Mr. Binder will ensure you get a fantastic writing pen.

-The difference in terms of weight and balance between a 600 and 800 is pretty large. The 800 is much heavier due to its metal internals, the 600 much lighter. Both are fantastic pens, I like both of them. If you can't handle both in person, and aren't sure about using a heavier pen, go with the 600.

September 1, 2013

Welcome!

There are some early Pelikan's that had a really fragile plastic collar around the nib and feed that is prone to breaking. I've had it happen. But a reputable pen repair person can fix that for you . I'd also recommend Rick Propas for purchasing a no-fail Pelikan.

Let us know what you get!

September 1, 2013

Welcome!

I second the idea of purchasing from either Propas or Binder....they are both great!

Beyond 'appreciators' you will find that we are 'enablers' !

September 1, 2013

I wouldn't worry too much about the ink staining. Shouldn't be a problem in a well cared for pen so long as you don't let the ink dry in the barrel. Of course red ink or inks with red pigments are more likely to stain than the blue-blacks that you mention. These pens looks fine to me, regardless of the color of ink in the barrel. My favorite look is when I'm inked up with a green ink.

Past nibs from Pelikan have been somewhat of a hit and miss from what I've read. Personally, I've generally been fortunate and cannot complain about poor quality. May be worthwhile trying to dip it in the store and see how it writes. There isn't a way I know of other than trying it to detect a poor nib from a good one.

In Pelikan, F nibs are my preferred widths. I find the M's just a touch broad. I think you would be happy with F as they are generally smooth. No real check list other than ink it up and use it. These pens are generally very durable and should serve you well.

Regarding the M600 vs the M800, this is probably the biggest step in the Souveran line up. The M800 is noticeably larger and heavier. Ideally, it's best for you to handle both pens before purchasing to see which you prefer. I like all of the Souveran line and can write with any of them size wise but some people are very particular about which size fits them better. Given the investment, you should try before you buy as the M800 isn't cheap. Good luck with your purchase.

September 1, 2013

I agree with all that has been said above.

In addition to Binder and Propas, you might also consider John Motishaw, A pen from any of these three vendors will be a bit more special than from a B&M seller or someone over the internent. You will likely pay more for a pen from these three but it will come as ready to write as it could possibly be, and in the odd prospect that you might have an issue, all three will stand behind the sale and work with you until you are satisfied. I know this because though I am sort of new to the FP hobby/obsession myself I have purchased from all three, and I am very glad that I have.

You mentioned a great deal in a nearby shop, and that may be a great reason to buy there. As you noted prices for these things are significant, but price is also only one consideration. Next time you head back to the shop, ask questions: Will they help you (and how) If you have a problem with the nib in your pen? Will they let you try one or both of these pens (in their shop, maybe just dipped) to see which pen and or which nib you prefer? Having someone local to help you out if you have issues is valuable, But buying locally without much support is another thing.

Pelikans are extremely easty to clean and unless you slip into the vintage pen markert (watch out, it is a slippery slope!) they are not at all prone to staining. With a Green stripe the color of the stripes will appear the same regardless what color ink you have in the pen. Most ink colors will just look like dark ink in the pen, you will have to hold the pen to the light to get any sense of the ink color inside.

I agree that the jump from the M600 to the M800 is a big one, in cost and in size. But the pens dimensions are different and a little deceptive until you pick both pens up. The M800 is just slightly longer, not very noticeable unless you place the two side by side. Once you pick them up and use them the differences are maginified. The M800 is not only noticebly heavier, the increased girth is also very palpable. I like writing with my M600 posted, but the M800 is much better in the hand un-posted. The M800 gets lots of rave reviews, the M600 is I think the under appreciated second cousin.

I agree that if you can get to a brick and mortar store to feel the difference you ought to. Bonus points for a dip test.

As you have seen, the world of Fountain Pens is a big tent, but a new Pelkan would make a great present to yourself to start (or restart) your odyssy.

September 1, 2013

Many thanks for your advice and for the warm welcome.

I have given the "nibmesiter way" serious thought at the beginning, (both because of the nib adjustment and as at oken of my appreciation for their sites, which helped me greatly) but the decisive issue was the 30% import tax on anything above 50$ value here, which makes it just too expensive. I could get the brand new M800 for just 366$, which makes it really very painful to "import" one from a nibmesiter.

Is there maybe an european place I could check out?

As almost all of you said, I too think the question of 800 vs 600 can only be really decided when I handle them. I read the excellent advice here somewhere that I should "blind test them" to see which one talks to me. The significant weight difference will hopefully make it a clear case.

I must admit that I'm drawn to the brass internals, it appeals to me much more than the plastic. But the already very favourable price of 366$ of the M800 is still straining the budget, so that can be an issue.

I shall see which fits my hand better and then

EDIT: How would you compare the pelikan 800's M to the MB 146's M?

Ah Edit 2: Is there any significantly better pen I might have overlooked in the price range? I know it's very much a question of taste, so what I mean to ask is there sth a class above for the price? I sure didn't find but I still thought it's best to ask people who are more knowledgeable

Edited September 1, 2013 by BCL-2

September 2, 2013

Hi BCL-2,

I dont't know where the nearby shop is but if you are in Budapest or somewhere near to it, try Hungaropen in Szentendre (you can call them also). They were the official importers of Pelikan but they are not anymore so they are are selling out their stock. It has a drawback as they are not willing to manage the 30 days nib exchange Pelikan normally offers for anyone buying a new pen but they let you try the pen when buying. I don't know if they have M600 or M800 any more - I myself bought a beautiful pre '90 M800 a month ago for 60000 Ft (its about 200 euros) which is a very good price. Originally I hesitated a lot as I prefer fine and extrafine nibs and they had only an M nib but this old, springy nib is incredible. When I decided to buy it I thought I can exchange the nib (etc. here) for a finer one or ask a nib expert to refine it but at the the moment I think it's so beautiful that I keep it for a different type of writing.

What concerns your original question: my every-day writer is an M600 with an EF nib and it is perfect for that purpose, but I feel the new M800 also fantastic, perhaps a bit even more comfortable - I use both pens posted. It's possible that it depends a bit on what do you use the pen for: at the moment I use the M600 with the EF nib for notes and the M800 with the M nib for free writing sessions.

By the way I have also a question to all the experienced fellows: Would you recommend to make the beautiful old style M800 nib refined by some expert (in my case perhaps Oxonian is the best possibility being in Europe) or should I keep it untouched because its incredibly smooth, springy and perfect only a little bit to wide for my habits but I see a possibility to change my habits a bit because the nib is so good.