Please Help With Feed Starvation Waterman Man 100

[Mister John]

I recently picked up a NOS Fontainbleau Man 100 in Havana Brown from a shop in Kralingen while visiting. The pen is a wonderful writer when dipped, but I discovered on my return to the states the there is a problem with the feed taking ink from the converter to the nib. Specifically, it doesn't do so unless forced.

 

The pen will draw ink from a bottle, so the feed is not totally blocked. But the pen won't write unless I force ink into it by twisting the converter. Then, once the ink from the twist is used up, the pen stops writing again.

 

I tried repeatedly flushing the feed with a syringe and water doe travel through the feed, so it is not totally blocked. I also soaked the feed overnight in a water/detergent mixture. Today it is soaking in a water/ammonia mixture.

 

What can I do to fix this? Please help!

[jar]

Fill with a water detergent mixture. Empty. Fill with your desired ink.

 

Switch to a cartridge. See if the problem continues.

 

Switch to a wetter ink. See if the problem continues.

 

Send pen to be serviced.

[Mister John]

Thanks for the help. I believe I solved the problem. It's something I've never encountered before, so perhaps others can benefit from hearing it. When I placed the converter onto the pen, I made sure to get a good, tight seal. Apparently, I made it too tight and must have caused some sort of vacuum whereby the force of the vacuum overcame the force of gravity in pushing the ink downward. Once I loosened the converter on the nipple, the ink flow was restored and the pen now works perfectly.

 

I'd be curious to know the exact physics behind this phenomenon.

[Piro_Flipper]

Just in case yours proves to be a temporary solution: I had this problem with my Waterman Carène. The solution for me has been to add small amount of dish washing detergent to my inks. This way it becomes easier to for the feed to draw ink from the reservoir (converter). Be careful not to overdo it though, otherwise your pen will start writing wider than it's supposed to.

Another thing I did to reduce the surface tension of my inks was adding a ball from a cartridge to the converter. I think this helped a bit as well.

[jar]

Thanks for the help. I believe I solved the problem. It's something I've never encountered before, so perhaps others can benefit from hearing it. When I placed the converter onto the pen, I made sure to get a good, tight seal. Apparently, I made it too tight and must have caused some sort of vacuum whereby the force of the vacuum overcame the force of gravity in pushing the ink downward. Once I loosened the converter on the nipple, the ink flow was restored and the pen now works perfectly.

 

I'd be curious to know the exact physics behind this phenomenon.

 

That's very, very unlikely to be the solution. Push that converter back in right now. You do not want an air path related to the converter.

[Mister John]

First, thanks for the help. I knew I could count on my FPN friends to help out.

 

My loosening solution did prove to be only temporary...and surprisingly messy as well. Eventually, the pen reverted to its no flow state. With tweaking, I could get it back working for awhile before it would fail again. As a result, I abandoned this approach though i am very intrigued at the physics of this situation. My guess is that the only real solution is to ship the pen off for repair.

 

Before going the repair route, however, i want to understand what is going on. Ive never seen anything like this in more than 20 years of playing with pens.

 

This led to a series of more controlled experiments. I pulled the nib and feed unit from the section to isolate the effects of the interaction between the unit and the converter. I filled the converter with Waterman Blue and I then "wrote" with the pen using only the nib unit with attached converter. No section, barrel, etc. to contaminate the findings. Here are the results:

 

1. With the converter fully sealed in place, there is no flow whatsoever.

 

2. Pulling the converter out so that it is only lightly in contact with the nipple instantly restores flow, but is messy and fussy. Eventually, ink seeps into some critical spot and then flow abruptly stops.

 

3. I tried half tightening the converter as well. This created a secure seal but not as tightly as when properly positioned. The result is the same as full tightening, no flow whatsoever.

 

Robustness checks:

 

A. Got the same results repeating the experiment using Skrip and Quink.

 

B. Got the same results filling the converter half way and one quarter of the way.

 

C. Got the same results adding a fraction of a drop of dish detergent to the converter.

 

D. Got no feed under any circumstances when using a cartridge instead of a converter.

 

E. Got the same results using an alternate Waterman converter.

 

F. Got proper ink flow using a loose fitting international converter instead of a Waterman converter. This is not a good solution though since the international converter does not allow the barrel to fit on the pen nor is it secure.

 

Conclusions: The seal between the nipple and the converter is critical. A good seal produces no ink flow. A poor one sometimes produces flow, but also produces leakage.

 

The fact that the feed sometimes works and that it permits both air and water to be forced through it suggests that it is not a blockage of the nipple or the path to the end of the nib that is the source of the problem. The fact that ink flows when the seal is poor but not when it is good suggests the air return is the source of the problem. When the seal is bad, the leak must be acting as a substitute air return channel. Since ink also leaks out via this channel, it eventually gets blocked as the ink ends up in the wrong place.

 

Based on this hypothesis, the solution is to unblock the air channel, but this is unlikely to prove easy since it is not dried ink or other easily cleaned stuff that is the likely source of the problem since the pen is NOS. the only things I can think of are bad nib-feed clearance (too little clearance I suppose) or some sort of mfg defect in the feed itself. Yeesh

 

some sort of pressure differential created with a good seal that counteracts the capillary force causing ink to flow from the converter into the feed.

 

The mystery is the identity of this opposing force. This would then suggest possible solutions to the problem.

 

 

 

 

4. I then tried a number of robustness checks, repeating steps 1-3 with Skrip and quick with the same results.

[olivier78860]

Since the pen is quite old, it is possible that your converter is defective.

I had the case with a NOS S.T. Dupont Montparnasse (about the same era); the converter seemed to be ok, but when disassembling it, I noticed the piston's seal was pressing too much against the converter wall.

I replaced the original converter with a recent Parker one (because of the adapter's format) and it worked better.

 

Since you removed the nib and feed, you could also check the ink conduit is empty. Using a toothbrush and rubbing it on the feed under warm tap water could be useful.

 

Last but not least, it could be the feed's fault - provided the nib doesn't have baby bottom - as I had similar issues with a Parker Premier. Changing the feed (they use the same one on the Kultur) solved my problem. You could also (delicately) enlarge the ink conduit with a thin boxcutter's blade, but as this operation is irreversible, do it if nothing else works.

 

So in my opinion, change the converter and clean the ink conduit on the feed with a toothbrush. If the pen isn't working better, send it back, but insist on the problem in your message, as aftersales services usually don't ink the pen, but just dip it in ink.

[Mister John]

I'm quite sure the problem lies with the feed. I tried two different converters, including a new one I bought recently, with the same result. Moreover,dipping the pen produces a clean, smooth line with no skipping or any of the usual problems associated with baby bottoms. The tricky bit is getting to the feed. I need to summon the courage to pull the nib from the unit so as to expose the ink conduit and permit proper cleaning. I know that, from reading about Man 100 units on the web, that, in principle, the nib pulls out of the unit, but it does not come out easily. I first tried the gently nudge method with no result, then I tried the Lamy scotch tape technique, again to no avail. Clearly more force will be needed, but this is a scary prospect.

 

Any advice?

[jar]

Did you:

Fill with a water detergent mixture. Empty. Fill with your desired ink. Test.

 

Switch to a cartridge. See if the problem continues.

 

Switch to a wetter ink. See if the problem continues.

 

Send pen to be serviced.

[Mister John]

Did you:

1. Fill with a water detergent mixture. Empty. Fill with your desired ink. Test

 

2. Switch to a cartridge. See if the problem continues.

 

3. Switch to a wetter ink. See if the problem continues.

 

4. Send pen to be serviced.

 

Answers:

 

1. Yes. No dice. As well I soaked in ammonia/H2O, also with no result. I suspect this is b/c the blockage is some sort of mfg issue with the air intake in the feed rather than dried ink, which is rather unlikely given that it is NOS.

 

2. Yes. The problem is, if anything worse in this case since there is no jiggering with the cart that makes the pen work. By contrast, I could get jigger a converter and get it to work for a little while.

 

3. Tried Waterman, Skrip, and Quink with no success. Is there anything wetter than this?

 

4. Not yet.

[gaijin94]

If you are having problems getting the feed and nib out of the section, you may like to try two rubber fingers, the ones that bankers use to count money. One on your thumb and one your index finger gives you more grip on the feed and nib which results in less brute force needed in pulling them out. Sorry if this is common knowledge, but I came up with this when I was cleaning my old FP for the first time.

 

Interested to find out what the problem is.

 

Best of luck !

[Mister John]

Well, I got the nib free from the feed and inspected the whole thing. Cleaned the feed like crazy but didn't find anything out of place or out of sorts. Put the thing back together, but with no change in the outcome. The air return still seems to be blocked. It must be somewhere in the path from the nipple to the ink channel since things are obviously fine everywhere below that.

 

How do I clean this path?

[Mister John]

Well, after more effort at trying to solve this problem, I'm giving up. In my final attempts, I managed to successfully remove the nib and expose the feed completely. I then engaged in a massive cleaning effort, using a toothbrush and condensed air to blow out any dust, gunk, loose plastic, etc. Reinstalling everything, the problem remains though it has changed in character somewhat. Specifically, if you shake the pen, it will deposit a small amount of ink in the feed. This is enough to write for about two paragraphs before things run dry.

 

But you can hasten the running dry process if you wish. Specifically, if place the pen so that the nib is pointing upward, all the ink seems to immediately drain out of the feed and the pen almost immediately dries up. Subsequent shaking then restores it to operation for another couple of paragraphs.

 

Does anyone have a theory about what might cause this behavior?

[Namo]

I am experiencing exactly the same problem and followed almost an identitcal path as yours. In addition, I tried to change the feed for an ebonite one coming from a compatible Waterman Strong model. I changed the nib too just to be sure. I even bought another section, incl. the inner part. I am still experiencing flow troubles. The problem must be a fabric problem IMHO. Too bad, I just love the pen.

[Pennata Penna]

How do I clean this path?

I was amazed by the capability of the feed of retaining old ink. I spent hours and many water change (to remove heat generated) in the ultrasonic cleaner before it was free of ink cloud. Since you're already comfortable taking the nib apart, then I suggest to buy a new feed, it shouldn't be too expensive.

 

Iroshizuku are wetter. Good luck.

 

Tony

[TimGirdler]

My thought is that there's something goofy with the nib, perhaps the taper, that is interrupting the necessary capillary action.

 

After you've filled the pen or dipped the pen, the feed is likely saturated with ink. As you write, the ink on the feed comes out and gets to the paper, etc. But, if the taper of the slit is off, inverse or even neutral, ink will not flow down the slit of the nib to the paper.

 

As I haven't seen the pen, this is only "theory" at this point. There are indeed other things that may cause the flow problems. But this might give you one more thing to trouble-shoot.

 

Ideally, the nib should have a taper like this: Tip < Section (sorry for the crudity of the example). The slit should narrow as it gets closer to the tip.

 

Also, how wide is the gap between the tines? If the tines are jammed together, the pen will have difficulty writing, though it wouldn't necessarily be a feed problem. But, the challenge here is this: There might be other problems masquerading as a feed problem. That's a real challenge--and not easy to diagnose without seeing and playing with the pen.

 

Contact me if you'd like. I'd be interested in looking at your pen.

 

Tim