Affordable Luxury Pens That Are Ideal For Taking A Copious Amount Of Fast-Paced Lecture Notes?

[Ike Levens]

At the moment I'm not interested in buying another fountain pen. In terms of parkers / cross's I heard that the writing quality of the refills went down because they changed manufacturing procedures throughou the years. Anyone know if a really well-writing ink refill from a company that produces luxury/fine-writing pens?

There are at least 3 manufacturers I know of that make refills for cross pens. I have two made by Penatia in my backpack at the moment. (They'll be sitting there a long while, I imagine, since I stopped using the pen I got them for.) I used to go through about 3 of those refills each year, since I only used one pen for the first three years of college. I don't remember what its called, but it looks like this.

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2820/8777238594_d20b0f9463.jpg

It had a clip when I bought it, but it broke off and either cross has discontinued the pen or Staples stopped carrying it, but I kept using it. It's the most comfortable BP I've found to date, but it doesn't hold a candle to a FP.

[The Duck Hunter]

Look at a Retro 1951 rollerball.

[orfew]

I don't think it makes much sense to go for expensive pens for 'lecture note' taking.

I have to respectfully disagree. I use my MB 146 and 147 to take notes. They accomplish the task very well. I find that no one notices my fountain pens at all so possible theft is not really an issue.

[Nashten]

I suggest you try learning fountain pens a bit more. I was the same way and when I got my first one, I didn't think they were for me.

But after leaving it for a while and using rollers and ballpoints and pencils... Something inside me whispered "you like using fountain pens!"

As others above have said, Cross refills are not the best. I won an awesome Cross Sauvage Blue Crocodile/Azurite and while the pen looks fantastic, writing with it was a pain after using fountain pens for a while.

TWSBI pens are a bit of a hit and miss as far as I've read. I don't have one so I dunno. But if you want a luxury fountain pen made by a good brand, the Waterman Carene has some good reviews about it. The inlaid nib might be your fancy for fountain pen writing. But also, the Pelikan Souveran series will never let you down either. Fantastic reviews on them and they come in sizes from small to huge.

Take your poison on the Pelikans. Large hands or small, or medium, they're there for you.

 

Addition: The Pelikan Souverans come in ballpoints too! And they're as luxury-oriented as their FP counterparts.

Edited May 22, 2013 by Nashten

[Runnin_Ute]

As an avid ballpoint user, get something that uses Parker refills. I have had excellent but inconsistent results using the Parker gel refills (sometimes they skip badly, otherwise perfect) or the Schmidt easy flow 9000 refills (I don't find them quite as smooth as a good Parker refill). There is a fair number of manufacturers using this same pattern (not necessarily in every pen): Aurora, Monteverde, Montegrappa, Visconti, to name a few.

 

I also have several centuries, though none made after about 1990. I don't use them anymore because the currently manufactured cross refill are, IMO, trash. I haven't sourced a Cross refill that I liked yet.

 

A quick google search turns this up (I'm in no way affiliated):

http://www.coloradopen.com/category/parker-style-ballpoint-refill-pens

 

Look into finding a local pen shop where you can get a feel for weight, size, and construction. I haven't used anything that takes Parker refills that isn't made by Parker (bunch of Jotters and a Sonnet). I will warn you that over the years, I have broken the lower section off a number of jotters.

Agree with the Parker refill thing 100%. Every Cross bp I have ever tried never wrote as good as a comparable (or even less expensive) Parker. I started with Parker Jotters with the lower section plastic - broke a few - especially if used in cold weather. Jumped to an all stainless Jotter. My favorite Parker ballpoint of all time was a Made in UK Parker 45 Flighter (flat top).Only nice bp I have ever lost.. Still wish I had that pen. The pen I used to replace it (Latitude I think) just isn't the same.

 

Only thing better? My fountain pens.

[huhjunn]

Well, I do want to use fountainpens and I was told that they would fit my note-taking needs. But after I spent 81 dollars (CAD) on a disappointing TWSBI 580 (+Noodler's Black) I felt like all fountain pens were the same. Twsbi was nice enough to send me a new F nib, which did indeed write much smoother, but my hand just got easily fatigued. Plus, fountainpen inks aren't waterproof which is a huge risk. If I were to spill water on my notes, or if the rain were to seep through my bag on a rainy day, I'd be in big trouble. Furthermore, I can't highlight my own notes because it will smudge the FP ink.

It may be the stubbornness in me, but I find it a huge nuisance to have to relearn how to hold and write with a pen, as is the case with using FPs. I would be willing to get a Lamy Safari which I hear has great reviews, but I'm afraid that my experience, even with a new/different FP, will be the same and that I will have wasted money (again) in the end.

I did my research for the TWSBI 580 before I bought it, and I even got the opinion of persons on this forum. Yet still, to my desmise, I was largely unsatisfied with my purchase. I'm in no way bashing FPs. All I'm saying is that they aren't for me (at least I think they aren't).

[J English Smith]

I like the Lamy 63 refills and Schmidt rollerball refills for smoothness. The refills I am using more and more are Pilot G2 refills, which are smooth but have a little tooth. They are cheap but good and fit a wide variety of pens, sometimes just needing a spacer (I cut erasers as needed, usually). I don't like the Parker gel refills. For Fisher pens, the Eversharp refills are better and make a decent fine point. I personally like the Lamy and Parker regular ball refills the best of the main line ballpoints. The MB refills can be good but are getting to be too expensive - fortunately, I have lots of stock to use up for awhile there. The Retro roller refills are pretty good too. Sheaffer refills are ok, write a long time but the blue is pretty pale compared to Parker. Good luck, yes, go to a large pen store and play; this is very individual and hard to quantify for another person...

Edited May 22, 2013 by J English Smith

[markh]

I used to work as a reporter for a daily paper and took lots of notes. I still occasionall freelance, and still take lots of notes. All as fast as possible.

 

I always used a fountain pen. The action of the nib on the paper (when the nib is well adjusted and tuned) helps provide tactile feedback to the muscles in your hand, allowing faster and more continuous writing with less fatigue.

 

Pens for rapid note taking are:

 

Very fine - finest possible that write smoothly. It turns out that a well tuned/adjusted nib can be very fine and still write well. Finer line allows smaller writing, which is faster writing. Fatter nibs require larger letters so all of the loops aren't closed, which means slower writing.

 

Good flow - more ink lubricates the movement of the pen, and assures a constant line.

 

Very stiff - stiff nibs write faster and more smoothly than nibs with any flex. I'm not only referring to vintage flexible nibs - modern nibs that are soft slow me down. Stiff as as 10penny nail is fastest.

 

Very light - the mechanics of the pen mean faster movement and less fatigue when there is less force and inertial required to make the pen move. Almost all vintage pens (which were intended for real writing, not just as ornamental jewelery) were quite light compared to many modern pens.

 

Long - enough to write comfortably without posting. This makes the pen lighter and better balanced. This further reduces strain on tthe hand, and allows faster writing.

 

I also hold the pen somewhat farthter away from the contact point than some people. On most pens with a separate section, the section is too short for me, and I end up holding the pen on some part of the body. Holding the pen further up means that less hand movement is needed to move the nib, which means faster writing with less strain (assuming, again, perfect tuning and adjustment).

 

My favorite note-taking pen is a Sheaffer Triumph nib Snorkel, marked with a Gregg symbol for shorthand. As you might imagine, shorthand requires fast writing, and the pen has all of the charactaristics mentioned above. There are other pens that I also use. For vintage, Parker 51s are great, especially with fine nibs. I think a modern Lamy Safari with a fine or x-fine point matches the criteria, and I'm sure there are others.

 

Heavy pens with lots of metal in their constuction take more work and energy to move, and slow me down. Fine for jotting a note, but too much work for rapid notes.

 

 

I guess everyones hands are different - that's what works for me......

.

 

 

 

 

[Stratman351]

I don't think it makes much sense to go for expensive pens for 'lecture note' taking.

 

Agree. A TWSBI 580 or Vac 700 is ideal for this.

[NedC]

If you're looking for a ballpoint I'd suggest a Ballograf Opus or Epoca, the Opus has the advantage of taking a wide variety of refills with no modification whilst the Epoca uses only the Ballograf or Fisher refills but the Ballograf ballpoint refills are truly superb, far better than any ballpoint refills I've used except of the Caran d'Ache and they're less expensive the the C d'A. Caran d'Ache 849 metal series a very nice but they might be a bit thin, you could also try their Alchemix pens which are a bit thicker and more luxurious looking.

[huhjunn]

If you're looking for a ballpoint I'd suggest a Ballograf Opus or Epoca, the Opus has the advantage of taking a wide variety of refills with no modification whilst the Epoca uses only the Ballograf or Fisher refills but the Ballograf ballpoint refills are truly superb, far better than any ballpoint refills I've used except of the Caran d'Ache and they're less expensive the the C d'A. Caran d'Ache 849 metal series a very nice but they might be a bit thin, you could also try their Alchemix pens which are a bit thicker and more luxurious looking.

 

If you're looking for a ballpoint I'd suggest a Ballograf Opus or Epoca, the Opus has the advantage of taking a wide variety of refills with no modification whilst the Epoca uses only the Ballograf or Fisher refills but the Ballograf ballpoint refills are truly superb, far better than any ballpoint refills I've used except of the Caran d'Ache and they're less expensive the the C d'A. Caran d'Ache 849 metal series a very nice but they might be a bit thin, you could also try their Alchemix pens which are a bit thicker and more luxurious looking.

Damn, the Ballograf Rondo looks like one of the pens I used in high school which I so dearly loved. Unfortunately I couldn't find a refill for it... Are there any companies similar to Ballograf? I would buy their pen and refill in a heartbeat but shipping is a killer... 12 dollars...

[Ike Levens]

Well, I do want to use fountainpens and I was told that they would fit my note-taking needs. But after I spent 81 dollars (CAD) on a disappointing TWSBI 580 (+Noodler's Black) I felt like all fountain pens were the same. Twsbi was nice enough to send me a new F nib, which did indeed write much smoother, but my hand just got easily fatigued. Plus, fountainpen inks aren't waterproof which is a huge risk. If I were to spill water on my notes, or if the rain were to seep through my bag on a rainy day, I'd be in big trouble. Furthermore, I can't highlight my own notes because it will smudge the FP ink.

 

It may be the stubbornness in me, but I find it a huge nuisance to have to relearn how to hold and write with a pen, as is the case with using FPs. I would be willing to get a Lamy Safari which I hear has great reviews, but I'm afraid that my experience, even with a new/different FP, will be the same and that I will have wasted money (again) in the end.

 

I did my research for the TWSBI 580 before I bought it, and I even got the opinion of persons on this forum. Yet still, to my desmise, I was largely unsatisfied with my purchase. I'm in no way bashing FPs. All I'm saying is that they aren't for me (at least I think they aren't).

 

This is Noodler's Black ink in a pilot 78G fine on cheap paper under a faucet. Before:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8406/8786091432_a7f37fac68.jpg

During:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8416/8786099570_66d6fc29ff.jpg

After:

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2885/8786110976_f33bd9b6a9.jpg

The paper is ready to disintegrate, and the ink hasn't moved at all. I'd definitely not be worried about Noodler's black in the rain, if they paper survives, your notes will survive.

I used to work as a reporter for a daily paper and took lots of notes. I still occasionall freelance, and still take lots of notes. All as fast as possible.

 

I always used a fountain pen. The action of the nib on the paper (when the nib is well adjusted and tuned) helps provide tactile feedback to the muscles in your hand, allowing faster and more continuous writing with less fatigue.

 

Pens for rapid note taking are:

 

Very fine - finest possible that write smoothly. It turns out that a well tuned/adjusted nib can be very fine and still write well. Finer line allows smaller writing, which is faster writing. Fatter nibs require larger letters so all of the loops aren't closed, which means slower writing.

 

Good flow - more ink lubricates the movement of the pen, and assures a constant line.

 

Very stiff - stiff nibs write faster and more smoothly than nibs with any flex. I'm not only referring to vintage flexible nibs - modern nibs that are soft slow me down. Stiff as as 10penny nail is fastest.

 

Very light - the mechanics of the pen mean faster movement and less fatigue when there is less force and inertial required to make the pen move. Almost all vintage pens (which were intended for real writing, not just as ornamental jewelery) were quite light compared to many modern pens.

 

Long - enough to write comfortably without posting. This makes the pen lighter and better balanced. This further reduces strain on tthe hand, and allows faster writing.

 

I also hold the pen somewhat farthter away from the contact point than some people. On most pens with a separate section, the section is too short for me, and I end up holding the pen on some part of the body. Holding the pen further up means that less hand movement is needed to move the nib, which means faster writing with less strain (assuming, again, perfect tuning and adjustment).

 

My favorite note-taking pen is a Sheaffer Triumph nib Snorkel, marked with a Gregg symbol for shorthand. As you might imagine, shorthand requires fast writing, and the pen has all of the charactaristics mentioned above. There are other pens that I also use. For vintage, Parker 51s are great, especially with fine nibs. I think a modern Lamy Safari with a fine or x-fine point matches the criteria, and I'm sure there are others.

 

Heavy pens with lots of metal in their constuction take more work and energy to move, and slow me down. Fine for jotting a note, but too much work for rapid notes.

 

 

I guess everyones hands are different - that's what works for me......

I would just replace very light with not too heavy, and add has a comfortable section to this list. Its a good list.

[kazoolaw]

If you really don't want use a FP after all this advice...

 

Chase the refill. Look at a ball-, roller-, gel-refill that you like and then troll the secondary market for something to hold it. There are a number of manufacturers that make refills to fit a number of pens. The refills are fungible, each as lacking in character as the next one.

 

Why don't you get a nice Parker Jotter, classic BP in a number of styles and stick a gel-refill in it.

 

Good luck on your classes,

 

gary

Edited May 22, 2013 by gary

[CharlieTurtle]

I would strongly recommend a Lamy Safari, I've now managed to covert two people to FPS with these - the grip means you hold them pen right whether you want to or not, and for one of the friends, who has a muscle condition, that has actually reduced hand fatigue a lot.

 

If you insist on a ballpoint, get one with easily available refills.

[Elizabeth in NJ]

Furthermore, I can't highlight my own notes because it will smudge the FP ink.

 

Of course you can highlight your notes. Do you run the highlighter over the words or really scrub away at it? Just try some ink samples and see how they behave.

 

I just tried running a pretty wet fat highlighter marker over a bunch of inks on cheap copy paper and 28 lb. digital color copy. The results:

 

No smudging:

Montblanc Blue Black (old formulation)

R&K Fernambuk

PR Sonic Blue

PR Midnight Blues (but in an EF so there wasn't much ink on the paper)

 

 

Smudged a bit

PR Avacado

Diamine Ancient Copper

Diamine Chocolate Brown

 

Smudged more

PR Tanzanite

 

My entirely unscientific conclusion is that inks with higher saturation are more likely to smudge, but it depends on the ink.

 

An iron gall formulation may be perfect for you because it chemically bonds to the paper or something of that nature.

 

 

 

 

It may be the stubbornness in me, but I find it a huge nuisance to have to relearn how to hold and write with a pen, as is the case with using FPs.

 

Where did you get the idea that you would have to relearn how to hold and write with a pen? With most pens, all you have to do is hold it so the nib is on top-ish and lighten up on the pressure.

[huhjunn]

 

Of course you can highlight your notes. Do you run the highlighter over the words or really scrub away at it? Just try some ink samples and see how they behave.

 

I just tried running a pretty wet fat highlighter marker over a bunch of inks on cheap copy paper and 28 lb. digital color copy. The results:

 

No smudging:

Montblanc Blue Black (old formulation)

R&K Fernambuk

PR Sonic Blue

PR Midnight Blues (but in an EF so there wasn't much ink on the paper)

 

 

Smudged a bit

PR Avacado

Diamine Ancient Copper

Diamine Chocolate Brown

 

Smudged more

PR Tanzanite

 

My entirely unscientific conclusion is that inks with higher saturation are more likely to smudge, but it depends on the ink.

 

An iron gall formulation may be perfect for you because it chemically bonds to the paper or something of that nature.

 

 

 

 

 

Where did you get the idea that you would have to relearn how to hold and write with a pen? With most pens, all you have to do is hold it so the nib is on top-ish and lighten up on the pressure.

People told me that I was holding it "too steep" and that I should "look up" ways to hold it the "right way." Also, I take back the whole, not waterproof thing, as I tested Noodler's black on cheap paper. But on my moleskine pocket book paper, it never dries. And I don't scrub it when using a highlighter, but there is light smudging. I guess I'm a bit of a perfectionist. However, I still get some hand fatigue and its difficult for me to write with an FP.

Edited May 22, 2013 by huhjunn

[TWRDO]

 

Do you have any recommendations for which sherpa I should check out? Thanks

 

The one you like the looks of best. They're basically a pen holder that will work with a wide variety of disposable pens, which act as "refills." http://www.sherpapen.com/

 

If you're not going fountain pen, it's the refill that matters most. The only aspect that really matters with the pen itself is if it's comfortable for you to use. (And aesthetics, if that's a concern.)

[Elizabeth in NJ]

People told me that I was holding it "too steep" and that I should "look up" ways to hold it the "right way." Also, I take back the whole, not waterproof thing, as I tested Noodler's black on cheap paper. But on my moleskine pocket book paper, it never dries. And I don't scrub it when using a highlighter, but there is light smudging. I guess I'm a bit of a perfectionist. However, I still get some hand fatigue and its difficult for me to write with an FP.

 

Sorry you didn't like your TWSBI or Noodler's Black, but sheesh. If your date to the Junior prom wouldn't put out, would you swear off women forever? You had one less-than-stellar FP experience, and now you are committing to the equivalent of a lifelong exclusive relationship with your hand.

 

 

http://i.imgur.com/fQ3DFtrl.jpg

[huhjunn]

The thing I don't like about my fountain pen (TWSBI 580) is that it does not glide on the paper. Even if I put almost no pressure on the nib, it still feels like it digs into the paper, so I have to apply more energy in trying to make it move. This is despite the fact that I put in a brand new F nib from TWSBI.

[CharlieTurtle]

The thing I don't like about my fountain pen (TWSBI 580) is that it does not glide on the paper. Even if I put almost no pressure on the nib, it still feels like it digs into the paper, so I have to apply more energy in trying to make it move. This is despite the fact that I put in a brand new F nib from TWSBI.

 

Perhaps try a broader nib.