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Wahl-Eversharp Skyliner 50


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#121 Wahlnut

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 05:02

Yikes, That is no where near normal performance for our pens. It is behaving like it is starved for ink and using up what trickles into the feed faster than it can be fed more ink. That indicated a blockage in the feed channel. BUT when you turned the converter upside down and the ink did not run back to fill up the converter cavity is also not normal either. That ink may be very viscous to hold surface tension like that and not flow back and forth freely. Some old inks develop or already have heavy solid particles in the ink that can clog. Try a different ink and tell me what happens. If it is the same, I will be sending you a new nib section straight away. I can send you a new blind cap too if that part is not to your liking. And if you wish I will send you a whole new pen. And you can return yours at no charge and I will reimburse you the shipping.

The video while private on You Tube is very visible here on FPN and it is embarrassing to me that you are having trouble with the pen and for me to see it misbehave (in public). I was tempted to take this back channel to discuss privately, but now that the video is in open forum, I felt I should not remove it and go to PM so that all can see how we deal with a problem. So please tell me how you would like to handle this.
Syd
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#122 Drone

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 05:23

Video up (non-public/unlisted): http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be

You might want to watch full screen to see the details. For record, unless I was trying to flex the nib, I was writing with zero pressure.

Is there any reason I shouldn't have flushed the pen with J.B.'s Perfect Pen Flush (standard ammonia dilute + sulficants--if anything, failing to get that out of the pen should have made it too wet/runny).

This is my first time using iMovie or posting a YouTube video. I was using an iPhone with a GorillaPod wrapped around a glass mug. Haven't figured out how to flip the video yet...

I also got a closeup of the blind cap.


The video is telling...

There is definitely a flow problem going on there. Try using a cartridge instead of the converter. Just refill an empty cartridge with the same ink you were using in the converter (for comparison purposes) and give it a couple of pages of generous writing to settle-in.

Once a good cleaning and flush is ruled-out, if there are still flow issues I would next suspect the converter - especially on Pilot/Namiki pens and ANY pen from China. After that it's on to the nib and feed. A decent pen should not rely on the properties of a particular ink just to flow normally.

Is the clear barrel on the converter plastic or glass? Is there a small ball or spring in the converter that's free to move around?

If the converter is indeed the culprit, it can be replaced; or as I often do, just continue to syringe fill cartridges.

#123 johntdavis

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 05:47

Yikes, That is no where near normal performance for our pens. It is behaving like it is starved for ink and using up what trickles into the feed faster than it can be fed more ink. That indicated a blockage in the feed channel. BUT when you turned the converter upside down and the ink did not run back to fill up the converter cavity is also not normal either. That ink may be very viscous to hold surface tension like that and not flow back and forth freely. Some old inks develop or already have heavy solid particles in the ink that can clog. Try a different ink and tell me what happens. If it is the same, I will be sending you a new nib section straight away. I can send you a new blind cap too if that part is not to your liking. And if you wish I will send you a whole new pen. And you can return yours at no charge and I will reimburse you the shipping.

The video while private on You Tube is very visible here on FPN and it is embarrassing to me that you are having trouble with the pen and for me to see it misbehave (in public). I was tempted to take this back channel to discuss privately, but now that the video is in open forum, I felt I should not remove it and go to PM so that all can see how we deal with a problem. So please tell me how you would like to handle this.
Syd


Sid,

Thanks for responding so late.

Please, please do not be embarrassed. That was not my intent. I just knew I wouldn't be able to describe what was happening, so I made a video. I just deleted the link from the above post. I should have PM'd it. I wasn't as awake as I should have been when I uploaded it. I will pull the video off YouTube tomorrow.

That was terrible form, and I apologize profusely. I should not post things while exhausted.

I know this is a great pen and knew I had to have done something to set this off. The problem got progressively worse, which is part of why I was confused. I agree that rhis ink in particular is pretty sticky. Given how sticky it gets around the bottle cap, it wouldn't surprise me if it's clogged. I will experiment tomorrow and let you know how it goes. I'm betting this ink is headed for the do not use list. Second one this month.

I didn't want the blind cap replaced. I was just curious about how it is made. :)

Again, please accept my apologies. Your product and customer service are excellent, and I will be buying a Technic in the next six months. Thanks again for your help.

EDIT: video pulled from YouTube. Figured out how to do it from my phone. Please let me know if the link is still active.

Edited by johntdavis, 10 April 2013 - 06:00.


#124 OakIris

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 17:18

Well I looked at my blind cap through a loop and have no inconsistencies at all. Though I hope I am looking where you guys are.

As far as flex... It is not a vintage wet noodle kind of flex. I think it has a great a nib because you can write as you would normally all day without it feeling like the nib wants to flex. BUT if you want some line variation you can get it when you want. With any flex it is done on the down stroke. It certainly takes some practice when it is something you dont normally do. But there in lies the fun. Take some time to figure out what letters you want to have flex. For myself I usually will flex the first letter of a new paragraph. I practice my capital letters often and I look at the style other people use as well and combine what I like from there. Then continue on writing as I normally would.

So again, it's on the down stroke that you will find flexing easy. Going forward you will learn based on your writing style where you can flex and how much you can push it. REMEMBER that ink and paper change the dynamics of how it all works sometimes lol

Have fun and practice... Lord knows I need to! :happyberet:


Glad your blind cap is good; the very slight imperfection on mine doesn't bother me. Thank you about the pointers about how to flex the nib - I definitely need to start practicing! Someday I would love to get a vintage pen with a flex nib; the Skyliner will be a great introduction to semi-flex.

@Syd - I am loving my Skyliner; thank you so much for bringing back the Wahl-Eversharp Company! :thumbup: I am sorry that johntdavis has been having problems with his Skyliner, but I also think the ink he is using is the main culprit; hopefully a good flush and a different ink will fix everything for him! I didn't get a chance to see the now-deleted video that John made, but I am impressed by your offer to replace the pen, either part by part or in full.

I have posted this in a couple of threads, including this one, and still have no answers. On your website in the FAQs it says to not use soap when flushing one of the new Wahl-Eversharp pen. Why is this? What does the soap do to the "innards?" (I know the plastic isn't the problem as the FAQs also recommend using water and mild dish detergent to clean the exterior.) Also, John wanted to know if his use of JB's perfect pen flush, which contains ammonia, would harm the pen; I didn't see an answer to that, either.

Since a mixture of water and a drop of dish soap or a 10% solution of ammonia and water are commonly suggested as good and proper ways to clean a pen, (of course use of either depends upon the material the pen is made of) I would just like something definitive as to why or why not so that I can properly "care for and feed" my beautiful new pen!

Holly

ETA - Never mind about the soap and ammonia question! :headsmack: You already answered this in my other thread - sorry Syd! For those that wonder:

Regarding the Dish Soap. I recommended no soap because I can not be certain what soap a person will use. You would be amazed what people mean when they say "soap". I have been asked before about "soapy water"...like bar soap water. Tons of fats, oils, and waxes in a lot of soaps. I do not recommend people use any chemicals because 1) it is usually not necessary, and 2) I can not be certain what they will use or that the concentration they will use will not damage the pen. So, I err on the side of safety.

Now I am sure many pros and average pen users feel perfectly fine with using the traditional water/ammonia mix we all have used to clean pens for years. That is their own choice, but when it comes to me making recommendations for cleaning, that the whole world will try to do, I avoid opening Pandora's box. I don't know what dish soap you might use, but any with soft hand formulas have fats and oils, so avoid them for sure. Frankly I use dilute sudsy ammonia and water all the time.
Syd

I was surprised by the "sudsy ammonia" comment; most other posts I have seen about using ammonia recommend against the use of the sudsy formula ammonia.

Edited by OakIris, 11 April 2013 - 17:56.


#125 johntdavis

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 18:29

Glad your blind cap is good; the very slight imperfection on mine doesn't bother me. Thank you about the pointers about how to flex the nib - I definitely need to start practicing! Someday I would love to get a vintage pen with a flex nib; the Skyliner will be a great introduction to semi-flex.

@Syd - I am loving my Skyliner; thank you so much for bringing back the Wahl-Eversharp Company! :thumbup: I am sorry that johntdavis has been having problems with his Skyliner, but I also think the ink he is using is the main culprit; hopefully a good flush and a different ink will fix everything for him! I didn't get a chance to see the now-deleted video that John made, but I am impressed by your offer to replace the pen, either part by part or in full.

I have posted this in a couple of threads, including this one, and still have no answers. On your website in the FAQs it says to not use soap when flushing one of the new Wahl-Eversharp pen. Why is this? What does the soap do to the "innards?" (I know the plastic isn't the problem as the FAQs also recommend using water and mild dish detergent to clean the exterior.) Also, John wanted to know if his use of JB's perfect pen flush, which contains ammonia, would harm the pen; I didn't see an answer to that, either.

Since a mixture of water and a drop of dish soap or a 10% solution of ammonia and water are commonly suggested as good and proper ways to clean a pen, (of course use of either depends upon the material the pen is made of) I would just like something definitive as to why or why not so that I can properly "care for and feed" my beautiful new pen!

Holly


My blindcap doesn't bother me at all. I just wanted to make sure it was supposed to be that way and I didn't need to give the USPS the evil eye. Again. I wouldn't have even noticed it if I hadn't been staring so hard at the pen when I got it out of the box because it reminded me of my mother's old bicycle she had when she was in elementary school. It is exactly the same color. I thought it would be close when I got it--which is why I picked green and not blue--but it's an exact match.

Now I'm wondering how Syd formulated the body colors. Something tells me a very substantial amount of work went into getting it just right. :)

I'd heard people talk about flex vs semi-flex before but never really thought about what that meant. All my pens prior to this were not flexible at all. I only brought it up because I wanted to make sure I wasn't going to spring the nib. Having used a vintage flex at the Dallas Pen Show and been very impressed by the action as well as a little overwhelmed with how easy it was, I think it's probably best to start with semi-flex and get used to the action before moving on to a vintage-style flex.

(I've got arthritis and motor control problems, and I've always written with a heavy hand, so springing nibs is something I've always been scared of--one of the reasons I stayed away from vintage so long. It was only after I didn't destroy my Pilot Capless and proved to myself I'd learned how to write with a light touch that I really got into FP collecting. Still, I'm not used to pushing down on nibs so I was a bit nervous at first when I tried to flex. It took considerable force. But I knew it had to flex so assumed that was normal. That's why I asked. I wanted someone to tell me it was normal so I would stop worrying about springing the nib. Posted Image)

Holly, as you flex yours more, do you find the flexing gets easier? Mine sort of limbered up over the course of a single (flex-heavy) writing session the first night, and stayed limber.

As for the problems I was having with the pen, I never thought there was a thing wrong with the inner workings. I felt like it was something I did, because it was working perfect and slowly went wonky after I started to use it. Since it didn't give me any trouble until after I started flexing, I thought maybe I'd sprung the nib somehow or accidentally misaligned the tines, hence my earlier questions about how it was supposed to feel when flexed. As I said above, Syd's offer to replace it without even looking at it is customer service at it's best, and I really appreciate it.

I should have been clearer earlier that all my earlier questions and the video itself--which I removed, as I said above, because it was really bad form to post it in a public place and if I had been more awake I would have realized that--were posted in the spirit of "please help me figure out the stupid thing I have obviously done to this new pen." ;)

I pumped the brown ink I was using out of it last night. It went it as normal liquid ink, and when I pumped it out it came out with the consistency of melted fudge. It was thick and full of solids. I've never had an ink do this before ever, but I can't describe it any other way than saying the ink was literally solidifying. Needless to say, I am not happy with this ink and it is going onto my permanent do not use list, along with Noodler's Tanned Armadillo. Both are great inks, but they don't behave well in my pens. Tanned Armadillo nib creeps like water and left dried up little ink pellets all over the feed and nib on one of my Esties, to the point I'm going to have to sonicate it. I'm pretty sure it stained the feed too, which I'm certainly not upset about because the nib is almost 70 years old, or anything. Posted Image My Monteverde Brown ink, on the other hand, seems to be an evil living tar creature, ala Star Trek's Armus.

I've already decided to get a cheap dip pen of some sort to use with these inks. I don't want to get rid of them, but they obviously need special handling. I'll also have an excuse to dabble in vintage flex dip nibs, which I'm kind of lusting after thanks to some YouTube videos.

I flushed it out and used J.B.'s on it to make sure I got all the evil glue out, and flushed that, and let the nib soak overnight. Then I J.B.'d it again and flushed it again with water just about 30 minutes ago, dried everything off, and put it back together. After giving it some Pilot Iroshizuku Tsuki-yo, I am experiencing no flow problems at all no matter what I try, just like when I got it out of the box. Posted Image

I'll post a writing sample later. I'm really impressed with the shading on this blue-black ink with this nib.

So in conclusion:

1) This pen is awesome.
2) Syd's customer service is amazing and I again thank him profusely for his help.
3) I need to do a better job of making sure my ink has turned into something with the consistency of Nutella before I feed it into a pen. (On a serious note, are there any threads anyone reccomends for learning how to make sure an ink hasn't gone bad before you put it in a pen? I've owned the brown ink for a year and it was great when I got it. I'm not sure what happened.)

#126 Wahlnut

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Posted 12 April 2013 - 05:32

I am happy to read the last few posts. And I say a large Phew, that's a relief! when I read the last one. Thanks John!

We worked hard to get these pens right and when I hear that maybe something is not right I as Quality Control #1 guy here, get really interested in what could have happened. Nutella?! That's a good one and no of course the pen was not made to run on Nutella, nor fudge. Glad it worked out for you.

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New WAHL-EVERSHARP fountain and Roller-Ball pens

#127 johntdavis

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Posted 12 April 2013 - 18:19

I am happy to read the last few posts. And I say a large Phew, that's a relief! when I read the last one. Thanks John!

We worked hard to get these pens right and when I hear that maybe something is not right I as Quality Control #1 guy here, get really interested in what could have happened. Nutella?! That's a good one and no of course the pen was not made to run on Nutella, nor fudge. Glad it worked out for you.

Syd


Sorry it took me so long to report back. Didn't mean to leave you hanging. ;)

Now that I've gotten the coagulated evil out of the pen, it's going to be one of my daily carry pens for the foreseeable future. Everyone who sees it immediately asks about it. The body is eye-catching, to say the least.

...Does that mean you could design a pen that would run on chocolate?

Because I must say, that would be relevant to my interests.



#128 Wahlnut

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 21:02

Working on Hershey's now :rolleyes:
Syd "the Wahlnut" Saperstein
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