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Nib Service Denied Because I Use Noodler's Inks?


notebookeresq

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Are there any inks that COULDN'T be damaging?

 

Baystate blue is well known, yes. But to label an entire brand bad is silly. I recently had a pen stained by Pilot/Namiki blue. Yes, Pilot blue. Ink I was told was super safe. Stained pen. It happens, it's INK. It is meant to leave color behind.

 

You're not the only one who has had a little trouble with Pilot Blue. It does stain some pens. There are nicer non-staining blues to be had in my opinion.

 

Anyway, the Noodler's thing has been going on for a while. I know of a few people who don't repair pens that have seen Noodler's ink. I personally don't use the ink as it uses some ingredients that we haven't seen before, and I'm not certain of its long term effects. Many dyes are organic compounds that aren't very polar, and I'm not surprised if they do dissolve plastics in sufficient concentrations. That said, just find someone else who does repair pens that have seen that ink, but in the future, keep in mind that use of any ink including Noodler's is at your own risk.

 

Dillon

Do you have knowledge of the compounds used in the inks? It sounds like you do, care to share?

 

I suspect it is not the dye but the carrier that attacks the plastic because the dye will likely be present as a minor component in the formuation. But I can only speculate since I have no knowledge of the formulation or the chemicals used.

 

At this point we can only speculate. I don't have hard data, but I have clues as to what compounds and dyes are actually used and why they are doing what they do. As far as I can tell, the concentrations used in these inks is a lot higher than anything else I've seen. High enough to make damage from the dye viable I would think. Some of them are in over saturated solutions such that when it gets cold, the dye crystals precipitate out of the solution. If you heat up the ink and swirl, it dissolves once more. I also don't know what I should reveal in the course of trying to reverse-engineer these inks to figure out what is in them for my personal curiosity. I certainly don't want a cease and desist letter or a lawyer at my doorstep.

 

I can tell you that this kind of dye concentration is enough for a few bottles of ink. You can dilute without much appreciable effects in color. Some of the dye is also suspended as crystals in solution due to the high concentration and heavy amounts of surfactants. One should really hire a chemist to make these inks properly. I also know that you are chemist and such things would grab your curiosity. I doubt that the problem is so much the carrier as I know what is usually used as a carrier. I have to figure out though if there is an easy way to measure or determine what carriers they are using. Many of the things used as carriers are present in high concentrations many times higher in the production of fountain pen feeds. Other chemicals are present in higher concentrations in washes used to kill and remove certain things from fountain pens in the course of certain repairs and cleanings. I also wonder if they are using other ingredients that aren't normally found, but I haven't figured out how to look for them.

 

If I do figure anything out, I don't know what I can reveal backchannel or otherwise.

 

Dillon

Stolen: Aurora Optima Demonstrator Red ends Medium nib. Serial number 1216 and Aurora 98 Cartridge/Converter Black bark finish (Archivi Storici) with gold cap. Reward if found. Please contact me if you have seen these pens.

Please send vial orders and other messages to fpninkvials funny-round-mark-thing gmail strange-mark-thing com. My shop is open once again if you need help with your pen.

Will someone with the name of "Jay" who emailed me through the email system provide me an email address? There was no email address provided, so I can't write back.

Dillon

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This so-called nibmeister singles out Noodlers and PR inks as the only bad inks out there. Perhaps he is anti-American.

Doubtful, but how does one draw this conclusion from the available data?

 

If we take well known American ink brands that didn't sell pens at the same time as only being Noodler's and Private Reserve, and not counting the organic stuff yet, that's 100% of the American ones. I take it that the nibworker hasn't banned Diamine, Akkerman, De Atramentis, Herbin, or anything else not American.

 

Or other inks that are made in America but were less saturated.

 

Dillon

Stolen: Aurora Optima Demonstrator Red ends Medium nib. Serial number 1216 and Aurora 98 Cartridge/Converter Black bark finish (Archivi Storici) with gold cap. Reward if found. Please contact me if you have seen these pens.

Please send vial orders and other messages to fpninkvials funny-round-mark-thing gmail strange-mark-thing com. My shop is open once again if you need help with your pen.

Will someone with the name of "Jay" who emailed me through the email system provide me an email address? There was no email address provided, so I can't write back.

Dillon

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...keep in mind that use of any ink including Noodler's is at your own risk.

 

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb204/EnvoyC/FP/ink_risk.jpg

 

This made my day, except that I will continue using ink in my pen. Thank you. :P I will take responsibility for any damage that occurs.

 

Dillon

Edited by Dillo

Stolen: Aurora Optima Demonstrator Red ends Medium nib. Serial number 1216 and Aurora 98 Cartridge/Converter Black bark finish (Archivi Storici) with gold cap. Reward if found. Please contact me if you have seen these pens.

Please send vial orders and other messages to fpninkvials funny-round-mark-thing gmail strange-mark-thing com. My shop is open once again if you need help with your pen.

Will someone with the name of "Jay" who emailed me through the email system provide me an email address? There was no email address provided, so I can't write back.

Dillon

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This so-called nibmeister singles out Noodlers and PR inks as the only bad inks out there. Perhaps he is anti-American.

Doubtful, but how does one draw this conclusion from the available data?

 

If we take well known American ink brands that didn't sell pens at the same time as only being Noodler's and Private Reserve, and not counting the organic stuff yet, that's 100% of the American ones. I take it that the nibworker hasn't banned Diamine, Akkerman, De Atramentis, Herbin, or anything else not American.

 

Or other inks that are made in America but were less saturated.

 

Dillon

Aside from the very new Scribal ink company, what other inks are still in business and made in the USA?

 

Geez, I bet this anti-American alleged nibmeister worked abroad for most of their professional life, too.

 

 

 

(for those who are unaware, I am merely joking.)

Edited by Lloyd

"Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination."

Oscar Wilde

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Some of them are in over saturated solutions such that when it gets cold, the dye crystals precipitate out of the solution.

 

It's true that many (most?) of the bulletproof Noodler's inks see things fall out of solution, but you can go a long time trying Noodler's colors without touching one with a cellulose reactive dye in it. I've yet to see any of my regular (non-cellulose-reactive) Noodler's inks need shaking up, and I do check. The bulletproof and partially bulletproof inks attract a lot of attention because many people are looking for the properties these inks have, but it's a perfectly reasonable and complete brand of ink, IMO, even if you avoid all of those.

Edited by mhosea

I know my id is "mhosea", but you can call me Mike. It's an old Unix thing.

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I'm likely among the unaware, as I still don't get the anti-American connection.

 

Getting upset over which pens a vendor will repair based on his/her choice of ink is like getting upset at someone that doesn't like fish ordering a salad at a seafood restaurant.

San Francisco International Pen Show - The next “Funnest Pen Show” is on schedule for August 23-24-25, 2024.  Watch the show website for registration details. 
 

My PM box is usually full. Just email me: my last name at the google mail address.

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One thing FarmBoy *seems* to be unaware of here is that he isn't the only FPN member who sometimes posts utterances he doesn't literally mean. However, it does take all kinds, so Lloyd has added to his most recent nationalistic posting a statement in small letters that may clear up his intention. For some of us, at least.

 

Still, I must also entertain the idea that FarmBoy understood from Moment One that Lloyd was kidding, but is stirring the pot a bit, as is his wont. When I was young I was advised that I've got to learn to tolerate the ambiguities. I still haven't quite learned.

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Didn't we have the Noodler's jingoism discussion recently?

Now we are into the Noodler's Anti-Americanism debate.

Oh, and that (in)famous Burning Rome thing...

 

Lovely.

 

Why am I not surprised to see this thread veering down this alley yet another time...

 

--------

 

@Dillo:

that's interesting to read (and fortunately concentrated on the matter). R. Binder has made quite similar remarks (I can't find it at them moment). It would really be nice to have a thorough chemical analysis of the inks. Unfortunately I'm not a chemist, but I would be very interested in more information.

But I fear that then a no-nonsense debate wouldn't be possible, again...

Greetings,

Michael

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This off subject, but can you share in the process of developing an exact dimension of a particular nib grind that suits you?

 

 

Best Regards,

Mikale

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Can you give me your recipe for dilute water?

 

Dilute water exists? What is it diluted with?

 

Carbon Dioxide... and then usually mixed with scotch or rye whiskey

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I think it's the synthetic newt juice...

 

That's why I only juice with organic newts.

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Didn't we have the Noodler's jingoism discussion recently?

Now we are into the Noodler's Anti-Americanism debate.

Oh, and that (in)famous Burning Rome thing...

Apparently in the fine print it says it is all just a joke.

 

Let me guess the punch line; the unnamed nib person reads here and has added a few names to his list?

San Francisco International Pen Show - The next “Funnest Pen Show” is on schedule for August 23-24-25, 2024.  Watch the show website for registration details. 
 

My PM box is usually full. Just email me: my last name at the google mail address.

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Can you give me your recipe for dilute water?

 

Dilute water exists? What is it diluted with?

 

Carbon Dioxide... and then usually mixed with scotch or rye whiskey

 

I usually just toss in an ice cube or two and let it melt... best way to dilute water, and doesn't precipitate.

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Apparently in the fine print it says it is all just a joke.

I'm not so sure if all agree to that...

For me the whole thing is really a joke, I would have no problems doing business with him (if the need arises), so I can see that lightly.

Greetings,

Michael

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I think it's the synthetic newt juice...

 

That's why I only juice with organic newts.

Are these available at Whole Foods this time of year? Will locally raised, free-range newts suffice if the organic ones are on back order?

"Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination."

Oscar Wilde

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This topic is closed.

 

The purpose of the Repair forum is to ask, and answer, questions about repairs and repair techniques, and to discuss repair techniques, materials that impact repairs etc. Discussion about whether or not you like a repair person or nib tech's choice to work on a pen or not, does not fall within that description.

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