Extra Fine Nibs

[jzents]

I have come to realize that EF nibs are not all created equal. I have a Rotring core and a Lamy safari both with EF nibs. The Lamy seems to be a finer nib than the Rotring. However, I do not really think that even the Lamy is what I was wanting in an EF nib. Can you help me with a brand whose EF nibs are really EXTRA Fine. I love the Lamy in all ways except that I wish the nib was finer. I am willing to put up with some scratchiness to get a finer line. Thank you in advance for your thoughts! Cheers!

[Oranges and Apples]

Any Japanese pen from the big three (Pilot, Sailor, and Platinum) can satisfy your need for an extra fine.

[Brian C]

I once had an xxxf nib from John Mottishaw. Great nib. Smoother than you would think. I would suggest find a pen you like and get it ground how you like from one of the pros.

[Holypie]

Any Japanese pen from the big three (Pilot, Sailor, and Platinum) can satisfy your need for an extra fine.

 

This is pretty much the only option without going to get a custom grind. If you're willing to gamble, many Chinese pens also have very fine nibs, but the quality control is less strict than it is for Japanese companies.

[Mickey]

Platinum UEF (ultra-extra-fine) is about as fine as it comes without going to a dip pen. (The same nib is also available on Nakaya pens.) Remember, the paper, ink type, ink flow, writing speed, writing pressure, and (almost never considered) humidity all affect line thickness, too.

[jzents]

Any Japanese pen from the big three (Pilot, Sailor, and Platinum) can satisfy your need for an extra fine.

I was thinking that would be what I would here but wanted to make sure that I was not overlooking something. Thank you very much!

[jzents]

Platinum UEF (ultra-extra-fine) is about as fine as it comes without going to a dip pen. (The same nib is also available on Nakaya pens.) Remember, the paper, ink type, ink flow, writing speed, writing pressure, and (almost never considered) humidity all affect line thickness, too.

Thank you! Did not know about that size. Also thanks for the excellent caveat on line thickness. Cheers!

[jzents]

Any Japanese pen from the big three (Pilot, Sailor, and Platinum) can satisfy your need for an extra fine.

 

This is pretty much the only option without going to get a custom grind. If you're willing to gamble, many Chinese pens also have very fine nibs, but the quality control is less strict than it is for Japanese companies.

Did not know the Chinese made pens. I will look at that as an option. Thank you!

[jzents]

I once had an xxxf nib from John Mottishaw. Great nib. Smoother than you would think. I would suggest find a pen you like and get it ground how you like from one of the pros.

Still a bit of a newbie and had not thought of doing something as radical as having the nib custom ground. What are the search terms one would use to find someone who can do that? Custom Pens? Thanks and cheers!

[Brian C]

I once had an xxxf nib from John Mottishaw. Great nib. Smoother than you would think. I would suggest find a pen you like and get it ground how you like from one of the pros.

Still a bit of a newbie and had not thought of doing something as radical as having the nib custom ground. What are the search terms one would use to find someone who can do that? Custom Pens? Thanks and cheers!

 

Mottishaw, Binder, Dahl, Masuyama have their own websites. Oxonian and watch_art here on FPN.

[pajaro]

Some of the Esterbrook extra fine nibs are good. The price is often favorable, but the 9xxx extra fines have tipping, where the 1xxx nd 2xxx numbers have the nibs folded over.

[Mickey]

Platinum UEF (ultra-extra-fine) is about as fine as it comes without going to a dip pen. (The same nib is also available on Nakaya pens.) Remember, the paper, ink type, ink flow, writing speed, writing pressure, and (almost never considered) humidity all affect line thickness, too.

Thank you! Did not know about that size. Also thanks for the excellent caveat on line thickness. Cheers!

 

I recently purchased a Platinum President from John Mottishaw with a UEF and requested it be regulated for 4 of 10 wetness with a light hand. It's a little dry (and slightly scratchy) on some papers (requiring me to slow down), but on Clairefontaine (and the like) it (smoothly) puts down an admirably fine line.

Edited April 22, 2012 by Mickey

[XiaoMG]

Get a cheap Japanese EF to test the water. A good example for a low price is the Pilot Penmanship pen, which comes with a good modular nib. The cost is very low (under 10usd), and occasionally samples will be a bit on the dry and scratchy side, but most are pretty good and are a nice taste of what a Japanese EF is all about. If you like it, you have other paths that you can take, including swapping the nib into another pen like a Prera or 78G. There are some that are even finer, but you don't want to toss a bunch of money at a Saibi Togi or something just to find yourself frustrated at flossing paper fibers out of the slit.

 

For what it's worth, I too found a lot of EF nibs a bit chunky...now my daily carry is a Japanese F, and I usually have an EF nearby for some applications. Some of my F nibs flip over for those limited situations when I need very fine lines, and the F is still thin enough to be useful and rides nicely on less-cooperative papers.

[imadeadend]

I love my fine nibs, but I hate nibs with huge feedback. Whilst this may sound contradictory, there are several nibs I would class as true fines that are quite smooth.

 

First is my 14k fine sailor Sapporo mini. It's a really nice fine that puts down a really consistent line and never lets up. There is a hint of feedback that was more probounced, but daily use got it writing really well after a week or two. Sailors also come in an extra fine and the xxf Saibi Togi which is apparently super fine. The sailor F comes around half the thickness of my EF safari nib.

 

Second is my Pilot 78g fine. These nibs are available on several models including the Prera, and they are actually really nice little steel nibs that are thinner than the sailor even. The 78G is a 10 dollar pen, so get one anyways!

 

Pilot Custom 74 Fine. This is probably the greatest fine nib I own that makes a needle point width line on the page. It is 14k gold, and a great example of how to make a good fine nib. The line width is more extra fine than fine and has a very low amount of feedback to it. It's a perfect nib for fine fanatics!

 

The fourth I should add is my Pelikan 400NN extra fine. What I love about this nib is that it's truly extra fine, comparable in width to the Sailor or Pilot 78G nibs, but flexes to a full double broad width when pressure is applied. It has a great flow and doesn't skip a beat!

 

I am getting my Platinum 3776 EF steel this week and am eager to see how it fares! My first Japanese EF! I am very thankful to the big three in Japan for making such amazing pens with nibs that glide better than any western super fine out!

[georges zaslavsky]

vintage sheaffer lifetime, vintage sheaffer triumph , sheaffer feathertouch and inlaid nibs are among the best extrafine and fine nibs one can get. The waterman le man 100 ef and f nibs, vintage mb 146 and 149 ef and f nibs as well as parker fuofold flat top and vacumatic ef and f nibs are also very very good.

[Miketsheehan]

Sailor- unreal

[coleam]

For reference, I've found that my Lamy EF gives roughly the same line width as my Sailor Medium-Fine. A Japanese EF/UEF is approaching hairline width, which isn't terribly practical unless you have very small writing or do a lot of math.

[jzents]

Get a cheap Japanese EF to test the water. A good example for a low price is the Pilot Penmanship pen, which comes with a good modular nib. The cost is very low (under 10usd), and occasionally samples will be a bit on the dry and scratchy side, but most are pretty good and are a nice taste of what a Japanese EF is all about. If you like it, you have other paths that you can take, including swapping the nib into another pen like a Prera or 78G. There are some that are even finer, but you don't want to toss a bunch of money at a Saibi Togi or something just to find yourself frustrated at flossing paper fibers out of the slit.

 

For what it's worth, I too found a lot of EF nibs a bit chunky...now my daily carry is a Japanese F, and I usually have an EF nearby for some applications. Some of my F nibs flip over for those limited situations when I need very fine lines, and the F is still thin enough to be useful and rides nicely on less-cooperative papers.

When you say a Japanese F, you mean like a Pilot F for example? I looked at the Pilot Penmanship pen, like that idea. JetPens is currently out but I will keep an eye out for them. Sounds like a good idea to try before I plunge into a $100+ pen. Cheers!

Edited April 24, 2012 by jzents

[XiaoMG]

When you say a Japanese F, you mean like a Pilot F for example? I looked at the Pilot Penmanship pen, like that idea. JetPens is currently out but I will keep an eye out for them. Sounds like a good idea to try before I plunge into a $100+ pen. Cheers!

Yep...I have a few pens from the Japanese "big three", Platinum, Pilot, and Sailor, and I always have a Pilot F with me in the form of a Capless Decimo or a Custom 74. I have a bunch of 78G nibs as well (interchangeable with the Penmanship, Plumix, and more expensive Prera), and the better ones are excellent performers. I'd say go for the EF to see if it is what you're looking for or if it's just a bit on the weak side. Only the Penmanship will give you the steel EF nib, so I recommended it first. I actually rather like the black version, as the barrel can be sanded or otherwise given a satin finish that looks great. The clear version just looks toyish, in my opinion (though it might work as an eyedropper).

Edited April 24, 2012 by XiaoMG

[jzents]

When you say a Japanese F, you mean like a Pilot F for example? I looked at the Pilot Penmanship pen, like that idea. JetPens is currently out but I will keep an eye out for them. Sounds like a good idea to try before I plunge into a $100+ pen. Cheers!

Yep...I have a few pens from the Japanese "big three", Platinum, Pilot, and Sailor, and I always have a Pilot F with me in the form of a Capless Decimo or a Custom 74. I have a bunch of 78G nibs as well (interchangeable with the Penmanship, Plumix, and more expensive Prera), and the better ones are excellent performers. I'd say go for the EF to see if it is what you're looking for or if it's just a bit on the weak side. Only the Penmanship will give you the steel EF nib, so I recommended it first. I actually rather like the black version, as the barrel can be sanded or otherwise given a satin finish that looks great. The clear version just looks toyish, in my opinion (though it might work as an eyedropper).

Thank you for the details. I am definitely going to have to get a Penmanship pen. This sounds like what I am thinking I want. Inexpensive to try. Thanks for the information.