Vere Foster Civil Service Script

[caliken]

I can testify that the hand is highly legible, clean, attractive, and free from unnecessary ornament. It also appears to be a very quick hand, as suitable for a note taking as formal correspondence. I see a real kinship between the Vere Foster CSS and this form of Spencerian, both as to their shared round hand ancestry and their objectives.

 

Very interesting, Mickey.

 

It is possible to see an example of Michael Sull's "American Cursive"?

 

caliken

[Mickey]

I can testify that the hand is highly legible, clean, attractive, and free from unnecessary ornament. It also appears to be a very quick hand, as suitable for a note taking as formal correspondence. I see a real kinship between the Vere Foster CSS and this form of Spencerian, both as to their shared round hand ancestry and their objectives.

 

Very interesting, Mickey.

 

It is possible to see an example of Michael Sull's "American Cursive"?

 

caliken

 

Mr. Sull's book is entitled "American Cursive Handwriting" and, as near as I can tell, it is a modernized interpretation of the Spencer method, as one might expect from him. The book includes a history of cursive in America and the method, itself. Here is a link to a promotional page which includes a sample page.

 

http://spencerian.com/americancursivepromotion.html

 

Sadly, the sample page is pretty low resolution, but I think you may still be able to see enough to get the idea.

[caliken]

Mr. Sull's book is entitled "American Cursive Handwriting" and, as near as I can tell, it is a modernized interpretation of the Spencer method, as one might expect from him. The book includes a history of cursive in America and the method, itself. Here is a link to a promotional page which includes a sample page.

 

Thanks for that.

 

Ken

[myyrkezaan]

Looks like pages 7 & 8 in the copy book are duplicates.

[myyrkezaan]

Another vertical writing style and book:

 

http://www.archive.org/stream/theorypracticeof00jackrich#page/94/mode/2up

[Mickey]

Another vertical writing style and book:

 

http://www.archive.o...age/94/mode/2up

 

Interesting, but if anything, it looks to my eye slanted slightly to the left, about as much the cursive I wrote in school slanted to the right. (I wrote slightly more upright than I was taught.) It also clearly demonstrates what I perceive as a fault when compared to round hand, i.e., that the letters are broadened to keep the natural spacing from appearing excessive. Still, I think this could be a handsome first hand for students.

[myyrkezaan]

It does seem to slant back a bit, which is interesting because in the book he talks about those parts needing to be absolutely straight .

There is a mention of a speed comparison writing a poem, vertical was 24m and slant 30m.

[Brioche]

Ken, do you know if the pictures of the book are under any copyright? I'd like to do a pdf for us, but I don't know about the legal side.

I volunteer over at Distributed Proofreaders (pgdp.net) that prepares books into ebooks. They are then uploaded to Project Gutenberg. The cut-off date we use is 1923 for books published in the U.S. The date should or could be more recent but there is legal stuff going on about copyrights and public domain. Distributed Proofreaders has decided to err on the side of caution.

 

Distributed Proofreaders Canada uses different rules as does DP Europe.

 

You could also search for the book at Project Gutenberg. If you find it, I think it's safe to assume that it is in the public domain and therefore legal to distribute.

[Flake]

I love this! I was barely taught cursive in school and I think this is something im going to have to learn.

[texaspenman]

This looks like a great script for formal writing with a fountain pen. Very cool... thanks for sharing it!

[texaspenman]

I can testify that the hand is highly legible, clean, attractive, and free from unnecessary ornament. It also appears to be a very quick hand, as suitable for a note taking as formal correspondence. I see a real kinship between the Vere Foster CSS and this form of Spencerian, both as to their shared round hand ancestry and their objectives.

 

Very interesting, Mickey.

 

It is possible to see an example of Michael Sull's "American Cursive"?

 

caliken

 

Mr. Sull's book is entitled "American Cursive Handwriting" and, as near as I can tell, it is a modernized interpretation of the Spencer method, as one might expect from him. The book includes a history of cursive in America and the method, itself. Here is a link to a promotional page which includes a sample page.

 

http://spencerian.co...epromotion.html

 

Sadly, the sample page is pretty low resolution, but I think you may still be able to see enough to get the idea.

 

 

This looks like an interesting read and a neat technique!

 

 

[Nozzy]

Thank you for helping me to identify the script I must have been taught at school in the UK in the 50s/60s! I am an artist and illustrator who likes typography and drawing using a dip pen. I have done calligraphy in the past. I don't tend to stick with 'conventional' lettering though, I enjoy playing around with it, see here Jane Gerwitz.

 

I've also enjoyed finding this site!

[shadowsforbars]

Thank you for helping me to identify the script I must have been taught at school in the UK in the 50s/60s! I am an artist and illustrator who likes typography and drawing using a dip pen. I have done calligraphy in the past. I don't tend to stick with 'conventional' lettering though, I enjoy playing around with it, see here Jane Gerwitz.

 

I've also enjoyed finding this site!

 

Thanks for the link, I enjoyed seeing your work, it is reminiscent of the work of one of our other members, Mathias. Many years ago I visited the Gallery in Saltaire to see the work of David Hockney showing at the time. I had a very pleasant day in the gallery and surrounding area.

[peterpen53]

At school in the UK in the 1940s, I was taught Vere Foster Civil Service Script which was a simplified form of Copperplate (Roundhand). It was written with a straight pen fitted with a moderately flexible dip nib.

 

As it is written upright or at a slight slope with only a moderate degree of flex, it can written easily with a fountain pen. It was intended as an everyday handwriting style, with as few pen lifts as possible and, as ascenders, descenders and the x height are all the same, especially lined paper is unnecessary - any normal, lined paper will do. The 45 degree hairline ligatures give the lettering a nice sense of open space making it extremely easy to read.

 

It was designed specifically to be written easily at a reasonable speed and, as such, is just as useful today, as personal handwriting. This is a page from the manual showing some basic minuscules.

 

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd289/caliken_2007/VFCSS700.jpg

 

The entire book was kindly found and downloaded by hardyb in April last year.

 

IMO this is an attractive script which lends itself to modern usage with a fountain pen when fitted with a moderately flexible nib.

 

Any comments are welcome.

 

caliken

 

I'm a bit late to this thread but at first sight this script reminds me of what I was taught in school here in the Netherlands in the early 60s. I don't have a name for it and there were also some differences:

- we wrote much more slanted;

- the lowercase r, t, x and z were different. The r was more like a 'cursive' r, while the above seems much more like an 'italic' r. The z had no descender and the t very much resembled an uppercase A in this script while the x had 2 connected loops in the lower left and upper right;

- the uppercase letters are all very similar with the exception of the Q (I would still be very hard pressed to see a Q in a very large numeral 2), the H contained 2 connected loops in the lower left and upper right, as did the X, while the Z again had no descender but a distinct 'wave' in the lower horizontal.

- the dip pens we used would undoubtedly have had some flex ability but we did not apply it and we wrote purely monoline.

Unfortunately I would hardly be able to give you a sample of my 'school script' as I have converted to an italic-based script and am really very pleased that my muscle memory has managed to totally 'forget' the script I was taught in school.

Would I have been taught this script as you have shown it I might possibly have retained it in some form as it is indeed very attractive for daily writing. However, some 30 years ago I found a booklet in my father's library that contained writing samples by Edward Johnston, Alfred Fairbanks and their followers and that was how I wanted to write.

 

 

Cheers,

Peter

Edited March 12, 2012 by peterpen53

[metwin1]

I'm curious about Vere Foster's medium script and the bold script. Does anybody know if these books are also in the public domain, and if they are available?

[Nimmireth]

I've started practicing this as an everyday penmanship style. I'm especially fond of the capital M,N, and S. While I use the letter forms, the slant and rhythm are my own. I also like the ascender and descenders on the numbers. Numbers written like that always seem so pretty to me.

[HildyZ]

I am an American and I write a more-or-less Palmer script. I have never liked the Palmer "r". My natural handwriting is narrow, and my "r's" disappear into almost an "i". I am stealing that Civil Service "r". That is the "r" I have been looking for all my life.

[Mickey]

<br />I am an American and I write a more-or-less Palmer script.  I have never liked the Palmer "r".  My natural handwriting is narrow, and my "r's" disappear into almost an "i".  I am stealing that Civil Service "r".  That is the "r" I have been looking for all my life.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

 

There is an alternative, particularly when one's handwriting is small: add a tiny loop to the upper left corner of the 'r', a loop so small, that it is, for all practical purposes, invisible. Mostly, the loop (direction change, really) is a device to slow you down enough in the left corner to produce the correct geometry in the rest of the letter. Your problem, in musical terms, is that you're "dropping a beat." Making that invisible loop will put the missing beat back into your writing and correct the letter form.

 

Give it a try.

[HildyZ]

I know exactly what you're talking about. If I had listened to Mrs. Andersen in the third grade and produced the letter as we were supposed to, I wouldn't have these problems now, right?

[2GreyCats]

Great examples, Columba Livia.

 

I find the lineage fascinating.

 

<snip>

.... Needless to say, we knew nothing about the emergence of Spencerian or Palmer or the American "Golden Age of Penmanship". Equally, I doubt very much if many across the great divide had even heard of Vere Foster and his influence on writing in Britain.

 

And so from the same source, two distinctly different, isolated styles of pointed pen script evolved.

....

caliken

 

You're all going to think this is a silly question, but how are they distinctly different? In what ways? Could someone discuss these two styles in comparison? I've looked at Vere Foster's script here on FPN, and I was taught Palmer method in school; they appear similar to my eye...