Shellac Drying Time

[talkinghead]

Hi all,

 

Did a search here for "shellac drying time"...no luck...so.....

 

How long should one wait (drying time) before inking, for:

 

1. Shellac used for sac placement/seal ( I have the stuff from Woodbin)

 

2. Shellac Rosin based sealant used for section/threads (I have Ron Zorn's stuff)

 

I have finally bought the tools and the sac's etc. to do my own simple, sac replacements on lever fillers! YEEHAW!!

 

But I need you all to help curb my enthusiasm abit....if it was up to me, I would put the sac on, place the section back in the barrel...and be writing with the pen in an hour ...but I have resisted that!

 

What say ye oh wise and powerful Repair Gurus???

 

Rick

 

 

(edited to correctly ID Ron's sealant)

Edited October 5, 2011 by talkinghead

[ticoun]

i don't know exactly the drying time, but give it a few hours to set completely.

 

Ron's thread sealant is not shellac. it's a rosin based sealant, and it will not set. it's made to stay soft, but is sticky and thick enough to hold the parts in place. this one needs very little heat to get removed.

[kirchh]

I generally wait overnight after a sac replacement. It might not need that long, but I think that's certainly long enough, so that's my habit.

 

Zorn's section sealant is not shellac, and it does not harden appreciably. I believe there is no waiting period needed (other than the minute or two for it to cool down if the sealant or pen has been warmed to easy application or reassembly).

 

--Ddaniel

[talkinghead]

Thanks ticoun and kirchh!!

 

I'll edit the post re Zorns Section sellant.

 

Rick

[Ron Z]

Maybe a hour if it's a latex sac. Some say that you should let the shellac set a few hours if a silicone sac. I haven't found over night to be at all necessary.

 

As Daniel pointed out, the Sheaffer formula thread sealant that I make is not shellac. It's rosin based, and becomes stiffer as the temperatures drop.

[777]

I have always personally only waited 30 min. I've never had a problem doing that, and I have done many a pen.

 

But I suppose an hour would be safer.

[JefferyS]

Richard Binder's site gives it as pretty short (1 hour?). Rather than being the slightest bit concerned about it, I give it a couple of hours. Before I read Richard's site, I was waiting about 2 days.

[Ron Z]

The truth is that I've been known to ink up my pens and use them right away without any problems. But waiting a bit really is a good idea.

[777]

The truth is that I've been known to ink up my pens and use them right away without any problems. But waiting a bit really is a good idea.

 

Well, now I don't feel any remorse about doing 30 min.

 

But seriously, unless the j-bar is doing some good pulling on the sac, it's not going to pop off anyway. So, I'd say we're all safe, from 2 days to 10 seconds.

[Tom Heath]

Rick SOme good info above has been offered.

 

Another factor to consider is how tight the sac you are using fits the section.... Some are very tight

 

The amount of shallac applied has a lot to do with drying time.

 

I always use the Tom , Tug test... AFter about 1/2 hour , I will pull on the sac vigorously

if it says , we are good to go, any movement and I may pull it off , clean the section , mounting and try again.

 

Pen collectors may winse at this thought:

 

SOme years ago I bought some pen sac , from Vintage Collector dealer,Author Jonnathan Steinberg

at that time I asked him what adhesive he used, his reply was I never use adhesive, as long as the sac fits tightly.

 

I never trusted an unsealed sac , but that is one persons thought.

[PoetaFit]

I thought I might weigh in briefly as an amateur with a brief bit of experience I have had.

I let the shellac dry on my button-filler and then used it a few hours later, no problem.

However, with my twist-filler I let it dry overnight and it still popped off during assembly. I gave it a bit more than 24 hours and it seems to be holding much better. So it seems that the fill method will dictate drying time quite a bit.

[Paul80]

It depend on where you are looking, In the Parker Vacumatic repair book it says 30 minutes the majority of others say an hour and a few say 24 hours. I normally go around the hour mark although have not had any issues with those I only waited 30 minutes for.

 

Paul

[Brianm_14]

Based on years of experience in woodworking and the professional repair and restoration with glues and finishes of the wood of very valuable old firearms (including shellac), I learned to be very patient and allow ample drying/curing time. I conducted numerous experiments on scraps. Usually, I ended up just set everything aside overnight or for 24-hours. Some finishes I allowed additional days, especially if it was cool or wet weather. Maybe not needed every or even most times, but the result was uniformly improved -in fact, just great.

 

Full drying and ultimate strength of the bond typically starts quickly, and increases slowly over time. And Tom is right, it depends partly on the thickness of the application. If you add a small ring of shellac around the mouth of the sac as an extra measure, it seems it would be best to give additional time.

 

Chemically speaking, the final few percent of the drying time can take longer than the first 95%. It can take a while for that last little bit of solvent to migrate outwards.

 

Of course, those who repair for a living will not have the luxury of taking such time.

 

Sealing compounds, dependent on cooling and not drying for thickening, are much faster in setting-up.

[the_gasman]

Another factor to consider is how tight the sac you are using fits the section.... Some are very tight

 

...

 

I always use the Tom , Tug test... AFter about 1/2 hour , I will pull on the sac vigorously

if it stays , we are good to go, any movement and I may pull it off , clean the section , mounting and try again.

 

...

SOme years ago I bought some pen sac , from Vintage Collector dealer,Author Jonnathan Steinberg

at that time I asked him what adhesive he used, his reply was I never use adhesive, as long as the sac fits tightly.

 

I never trusted an unsealed sac , but that is one persons thought.

 

 

... unless the j-bar is doing some good pulling on the sac, it's not going to pop off anyway.

 

 

I shellac the sac on most of the my vintage pens but the two chosen for using registrar's ink [a Conway Stewart 28 and a Mabie-Todd Swam 3350] do not have any adhesive between either sac/section or section/barrel. This is because I cannot entirely dismiss the haunting thought that the iron-gall inks might gnaw at the pen's viscera. Although this vestigial fear is probably unfounded, I choose to disassemble these pens every few months (less often if they are in constant use, and more frequently if they have fallow periods) and give them a good wash, syringe, and ultrasound. I may well be doing more harm than I am preventing but at least it keeps me off the streets!

 

I do ensure that the sac makes a tight fit with the section nipple, if necessary using one size smaller than I would if using shellac. I also use Tom Heath's "Tom, Tom, Tug" test [i like the sound of that eponymous name for a test -- do I have to use a copyright sign?]. I haven't had an inky disasters ... so far!

 

Cheers,

Dave.

[Ron Z]

Pen repair and furniture repair and refinishing are related only in the word "repair." I agree that with furniture repair and applications where there is a thicker layer of shellac, longer dry times are desirable. But it really doesn't apply in this case.

 

The sac should be snug on a sac nipple, stretched a bit as you put it on. The layer of shellac is generally rather thin because it is squeezed and pushed forward as you put the sac on. The shellac will set up enough in a couple of minutes that the sac won't slide off the sac nipple unless you yank on it, and is secure enough for use after 30 minutes or so with a latex sac. I allow a bit longer for a PVC sac, and you don't use shellac for a silicone sac. Even when using shellac for sealing a 51 hood, the shellac sets up to where it is rather stiff in a 2-3 hours.

[Brianm_14]

Ron,

Your points are gratefully noted. (My analogy and phrasing were not as apt as I first thought.) By carefully watching as I pushed a new sac on, I could see the shellac was pushed forward, leaving a thinner coat remaining under the latex.

 

I no longer need to repair anything for even part of my living. I forget that gives me the great luxury of lazily setting many things aside overnight, as a matter of course, even when it is not at all necessary.

 

Brian