Pics Of Your Kullock Fantasy 51's!

[jor412]

I just stumbled upon this while surfing, more Kullock pens at pentique, but this Kama Sutra model has pretty cool detailing in the cap.

[NABodie]

A prime example: eBay item 160648921227 just listed as original Parker demo, but it's a kullock pen. Bidding starts at $149.00 so hurry and don't miss out on the "beautiful rare demonstrator Parker 51"

[Glenn-SC]

Well, he dropped the words "rare"!

[pajaro]

It might be difficult to see this at this point, but the Kullock clear demonstrator pens might someday come to be worth more than your genuine Parker demonstrators. It all depends on supply and demand. There are bound to be diferences between the originals and the Kullock pens. IMHO if you are sufficiently ignorant of the items in the market that you buy a Kullock clear 51 demonstrator or a 51 with the demonstrator hood by Kullock thinking you are buying a rare Parker original, then it's your ignorance that leads you down the garden path, but then the value of the Kullock might someday be higher. If someone passes off a Kullock as a Parker original, what are you going to do if you buy an item where there are imitators of the originals? It is a risky area in which to venture, and caveat emptor.

 

I have none of these, and I do not like any of the Parker clear demos or semi-demos. I do like Kullocks colored demos. Color! You should be glad there is anyone around willing to make this stuff anyway. I am grateful to Kullock for making the yellow pens I have. I also like the Kama Sutra cap I have, even if it isn't fitting to show it on a sanitized network because of the depicted sex act.

Edited September 8, 2011 by pajaro

[Rockyrod]

I have none of these

 

And that is why you are not worried.

[NABodie]

Hummmmmm out of that sellers 14 purchases from Kullock you think one was a demo barrel and a demo hood for another? I don't know sounds like fraud to me. :hmm1:

[pajaro]

I have none of these

 

And that is why you are not worried.

Do you collect anything besides pens? Experts in each field are confronted by situations like this, and they generally figure out how to tell the difference between official production and later remakes, even with the same machinery. What you need is enough known samples of each to compare. That would be expensive. There are plenty of smart pen experts, and they will learn to tell the difference. These items are only of interest to specialists anyway, not the general public. So, the real market will be Parker pen specialists, who will likely know the difference. The Kullock pens might come to be of greater value anyway because of smaller numbers and quality differences. There might come to be greater demand for the Kullock pens because of their place in a body of work--people aiming to complete collections of Kullock pens. The Parkers might be lost and forgotten in a sea of Kullocks.

 

I believe you are wringing your hands over nothing, and I think you know it.

 

 

 

 

[NABodie]

pajaro, on 08 September 2011 - 06:04 PM, said:

 

 

The Kullock pens might come to be of greater value anyway because of smaller numbers and quality differences. There might come to be greater demand for the Kullock pens because of their place in a body of work--people aiming to complete collections of Kullock pens. The Parkers might be lost and forgotten in a sea of Kullocks.

 

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that to happen!

[Glenn-SC]

I can't believe you are condoning counterfeiting pen parts!

What if Mr Kullock starts making MB "replacement" parts and pens?

Would that be OK?

 

The reason someone does not mark their product that is a copy of the original is not because they are worried that theirs will be worth more, it's because the original is worth more.

If Mr. Kullock believed that his parts will be more valuable than the original parts then he would mark them so that others would see the value of these parts and want to buy more of his parts.

 

Mr Kullock should take a lesson from Chris Thompson, who imprints his "replica" Duofolds as "REPLICA". (I have a Mandarin Yellow Thompson Duofold)

I have no issues with not marking "fantasy" colors since there there is no concerns of getting these confused with originals.

But, if "Kullock's" indeed become the valued pen of the future, then Mr. Kullock will want to mark everything he manufacturers to "raise his stock".

[Rockyrod]

There are plenty of smart pen experts, and they will learn to tell the difference

 

I believe you are wringing your hands over nothing

 

If the Kullock parts were marked then we not have such a problem to contend with. I will give him his due and say he has some fun things, blue demo 51's and such. But it would be better had he shown pride in product by marking it as his work.

 

I am not wringing my hands, I am clicking away at a Jotter.

[pajaro]

The Parker 51 clear demonstrators are not exactly the most valuable Parkers. They seem to be about the only Kullock creations that you have trouble telling from a Parker. It's not as if Kullock counterfeited date codes and created fake single jewel Nassau green 51 Vacs with rare caps. He just made some clear plastic hoods, barrels and caps. He might not have the resources to stamp the plastic.

 

Actually, since you who are complaining about Kullock not marking his parts for your benefit, the problem is actually exclusively yours, because you seem to lack the expertise to tell original Parkers from Kullocks, with the implication that your wealth in the form of pens is being undermined by Ariel Kullock's production of new parts that can be used to create a demonstrator, and that he markets demonstrators made with a mix of old and new production parts with the express intention of what exactly? You have made such a big deal about this that maybe you should sue him, if you think your case has any standing.

[Rockyrod]

The Parker 51 clear demonstrators are not exactly the most valuable Parkers.

 

Really? Where do you find your cheap original demonstrator "51"'s at? I would like a few instead of the overpriced ones that occasionally show up on ebay.

[NABodie]

It's not about clear demonstrators at all. That just happened to be the first Kullock pen I saw for sale with misleading info in the item description to make potential buyers think they were getting some rare Parker pen instead of a Kullock knock off.

 

Maybe you haven't noticed Kullock selling rod stock in original colors from the same supplier as Parker originally used. Have you noticed all the new old stock Kullock seems to always be selling on Ebay. No probably not. I'm sure you aren’t concerned about people getting ripped off thinking they got a RARE pen when all they got was a Kullock. I'm also sure you don't give a rip about people fraudulently describing these pens as originals. I'm sure you don't give two cents about the newbee who gets ripped off and leaves the hobby when its pointed out to him, because Fountain People are in his/her opinion, dishonest cheats.

I'm very glad you don't mind having to be led by the opinion of another when it comes to the authenticity of your pens. OF which they may or may not be able to tell the difference between the real and the fake. How silly of us all to be concerned because an EXPERT may be able to tell us.

 

Of course none of this concerns you, till you get burned on one of them, but I'm soooooooooooooooooooooo happy you like your little yellow Kullock 51, Enjoy!

 

Oh and I like my yellow one as well. It's Yellowstone, Double Jewel, 1945, and it is all original Parker!

Edited September 9, 2011 by NABodie

[Brian C]

My only Kullock ~ http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/munsonhsr/kullock/DSC_0001copy-2.jpg Phil ~ following directions and posting a photo

That's GREAT! What's it called? Didn't see that on the Kullock website.

[Glenn-SC]

Actually, since you who are complaining about Kullock not marking his parts for your benefit, the problem is actually exclusively yours, because you seem to lack the expertise to tell original Parkers from Kullocks, with the implication that your wealth in the form of pens is being undermined by Ariel Kullock's production of new parts that can be used to create a demonstrator, and that he markets demonstrators made with a mix of old and new production parts with the express intention of what exactly? You have made such a big deal about this that maybe you should sue him, if you think your case has any standing.

How about him selling "Parker 51 First Year Aluminum Jewels" on eBay?

It was only after I question him if these were "original" Jewels or "new production" did he admit that they were new by him that "looked just like the First Year cap jewels" did he change the auction description.

That's not right.

 

And if he can mark caps with his initials, as has been shown, he can mark barrels.

[jor412]

ANM, the aero demo was a regular body but a clean hood. No colors to worry about matching. However I did an experiment and found a way to tell the difference between Kullock and the "real deal" from Parker. Look at the difference in the tap of the threads. Kullock is on the right and the Parker is on the left.

 

 

 

 

I really don't want to get in the middle of this discussion, but as a newbie:

 

1) The above pics are quite useful. I certainly don't have the expertise to tell the difference. Thanks!

 

2) I did want to see more samples of Kullock's fantasy pens.

[Rockyrod]

I did want to see more samples of Kullock's fantasy pens.

 

I totally agree with that. Kullock makes some of the more fun looking and brite color 51 style pens around. The blue shaded demo Vac's are cool looking.

[Rockyrod]

It's Yellowstone, Double Jewel, 1945, and it is all original Parker!

 

Too bad it isn't single jewel. Someday....eventually.......you can rub my nose in the pic when you get it and I will be happy for you.

[NABodie]

I'm just a rookie at this pen collecting, but I've got an eye out for one!

[jor412]

I did want to see more samples of Kullock's fantasy pens.

 

I totally agree with that. Kullock makes some of the more fun looking and brite color 51 style pens around. The blue shaded demo Vac's are cool looking.

 

I didn't used to be drawn to the 51 but now I have 2 and they write great. It's interesting to see different interpretations of the original streamlined design. And yes, variations in color are fun in contrast to how totally functional the pen is.