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Sac Glue?


jlischka

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I've got several Esterbrooks with bad or no sacs and just received a shipment of new replacement sacs. The question now is what kind of glue should I use to glue the sacs onto whatever you call the part the sac is attached to. I've heard that orange shellac was used originally. Where the heck would one find orange shellac today? If not shellac, then what?

 

Joe Lischka

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I will advise to use only shellac. You can buy a quart can in the US from many woodworking suppliers. Or, an ounce or two from:

 

http://www.simcom.on.ca/woodbin/

 

or:

 

http://www.tryphon.it/catalogo.htm

 

Instructions here:

 

http://www.richardspens.com/ref_info/sac_replacement.htm

 

Enjoy,

 

Ron

"Adventure is just bad planning." -- Roald Amundsen

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Even better, get some dry shellac flakes. Dissolve some in alcohol to get the correct viscosity (medium paint thickness). Otherwise, the shellac will do dead in a year or so.

 

It's also available from Pendemonium in a small bottle, I believe.

 

Peter

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Giovanni Abrate has formulated his pen sac cement from several carefully chosen varieties of shellac for the express purpose of being used to glue pen sacs (and other parts). I've used commercial shellacs and other brands of pen sac cement, and I now use only Giovanni's stuff. It isn't as cheap as hardware-store shellac, but it has put a stop to annoyances like pens with silicone sacs that used to come back because the ordinary shellac wasn't good enough.

sig.jpg.2d63a57b2eed52a0310c0428310c3731.jpg

 

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Giovanni claims a >10 year shelf life, too. Hardward store shellac has a 6 month to 3 year lifespan.

"Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination."

Oscar Wilde

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Simple, cheap and maybe get yourself inside a real business:

Try yor local hardware or paint store (if there are any left in your area)- Bullseye Orange Shellac - a buck or two for a pint. This will last you 10 years if you keep the lid on like your dad taught you to. If you leave the lid off, go back down and buy another can from Frank.

Get "specially formulated shellac" for refinishing a fine violin.

This ain't rocket science or nuclear engineering.

There is no down side to this simple solution.

 

Jack

"All the Federales say,

We could have had him any day

We just let him slip away

Out of kindness, I suppose.'"

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Giovanni claims a >10 year shelf life, too.  Hardward store shellac has a 6 month to 3 year lifespan.

One should note that the shelf life refers to the unused product, and that the negative aspect of passing the shelf life is that drying time increases - so it is relatively easy to determine ehrther your shellas has passed a reasonable shelf life - it dries too slowly to be of use to you.

 

As is the case with many many products, you can buy the one with the stated performance, or just use the one most easily available. Test before returning the pen to service. The poster suggesting the shellac flakes was right on, mix what you can use in a reasonable time - the rest of the flakes will last indefinitely.

 

A stronger mix will last longer.

 

Gio's mix is good, lasts a loooong time and makes a lot of sense, but those with an independent spirit won't be disappointed with their choice if they heed the advice above.

 

It's largely a personal choice thing guys....

 

regards,

 

Gerry

Edited by Gerry
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Dry shellac has a more or less indefinite life. Once dissolved in alcohol, it begins to change -- among other things, it picks up water from the air.

 

The result is that it becomes rubbery when "dry" and never aquires the normal hard, slick character. Nothing will stick properly, other finishes applied on top will wrinkle, or worse, slip. The BullsEye is normally used as a primer, good shellac sticks to almost anything and will bind varnish, etc to things it normally won't stick to.

 

Old shellac never gets really hard, unlike fresh shellac In alcohol it appears to partially polymerize, resulting in the "never dry" effect.

 

Shellac that will not completely revert to hard, dry material won't hold a pen sac on!

 

Peter

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  • 3 years later...

Thank you for the explanation, everyone, I've been wondering how long shellac would last, and if it was any difference in the available brands. Most useful.

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I recently bought orange shellac flakes in a wood art supplies shop. I was amazed about the amount of it I could get for 0.50EUR (about 2/3 of a dollar!). I have enough to glue pens for a life, don't remember the weight (it is a quite light stuff) but it fills a pipe tobacco box. Given its light weight I can send some in a letter so you have a sample of what you need.

In my current rotation:

Pelikan 400 Brown Tortoise/14K Fine/J. Herbin Cafe des Iles

Lamy 2000/14K Medium/Lamy Blue-Black

Sailor 1911 Large burgundy/21K Naginata Togi Medium/Diamine Oxblood

Montblanc 146/14K Fine/Montblanc Racing Green

Rosetta blue/Steel Pendelton cursive italic/Pelikan Royal Blue

Delta Passion/18K Broad/Diamine Syrah

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I had quite forgotten my original comment but I would indeed like to see a sample of the orange shellac flakes. My address is: Joseph Lischka, 264 Lakeshore Road, Fort Erie, Ontario L2A1B3 Canada. Thank you very much!

 

I recently bought orange shellac flakes in a wood art supplies shop. I was amazed about the amount of it I could get for 0.50EUR (about 2/3 of a dollar!). I have enough to glue pens for a life, don't remember the weight (it is a quite light stuff) but it fills a pipe tobacco box. Given its light weight I can send some in a letter so you have a sample of what you need.

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I had quite forgotten my original comment but I would indeed like to see a sample of the orange shellac flakes. My address is: Joseph Lischka, 264 Lakeshore Road, Fort Erie, Ontario L2A1B3 Canada. Thank you very much!

 

I recently bought orange shellac flakes in a wood art supplies shop. I was amazed about the amount of it I could get for 0.50EUR (about 2/3 of a dollar!). I have enough to glue pens for a life, don't remember the weight (it is a quite light stuff) but it fills a pipe tobacco box. Given its light weight I can send some in a letter so you have a sample of what you need.

 

maybe next time send me a Personal Message (PM) instead ;)

In my current rotation:

Pelikan 400 Brown Tortoise/14K Fine/J. Herbin Cafe des Iles

Lamy 2000/14K Medium/Lamy Blue-Black

Sailor 1911 Large burgundy/21K Naginata Togi Medium/Diamine Oxblood

Montblanc 146/14K Fine/Montblanc Racing Green

Rosetta blue/Steel Pendelton cursive italic/Pelikan Royal Blue

Delta Passion/18K Broad/Diamine Syrah

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What about the "sac cement" that Fountain Pen Hospital sells? http://www.fountainpenhospital.com/images/accessories_images/tools/250PX/PENREP11.jpg

 

Is that a cement or a shellac? Does anyone here use it?

With apologies to FPH for snagging the picture, I'll probably be buying a bottle later this week.

 

thanks,

Tim

Tim

 timsvintagepens.com and @timsvintagepens

 

 

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What about the "sac cement" that Fountain Pen Hospital sells? http://www.fountainpenhospital.com/images/accessories_images/tools/250PX/PENREP11.jpg

 

Is that a cement or a shellac? Does anyone here use it?

With apologies to FPH for snagging the picture, I'll probably be buying a bottle later this week.

 

thanks,

Tim

Shellac.

San Francisco International Pen Show - The next “Funnest Pen Show” is on schedule for August 23-24-25, 2024.  Watch the show website for registration details. 
 

My PM box is usually full. Just email me: my last name at the google mail address.

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What about the "sac cement" that Fountain Pen Hospital sells? http://www.fountainpenhospital.com/images/accessories_images/tools/250PX/PENREP11.jpg

 

Is that a cement or a shellac? Does anyone here use it?

With apologies to FPH for snagging the picture, I'll probably be buying a bottle later this week.

 

thanks,

Tim

Shellac.

 

Yep, same for the products sold by Tryphon and Wood Bin. Take a half pint can of shellac, eighty or so tiny bottles, and a pipette or eyedropper, and spend an "enjoyable" hour trying not to get shellac on the threads and inserting little brush caps into all those tiny bottles, then label and sell -- there's a good reason the tiny bottles sell for almost as much as a half pint can, if you can find the latter. OTOH, I figure the one I got from Tryphon will last me a year or so, by which time I'll be ready to spring for some flakes and a can of denatured alcohol.

Does not always write loving messages.

Does not always foot up columns correctly.

Does not always sign big checks.

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ZI -- Well, maybe I won't get the "sac glue" after all! Might be better if I get some flakes and make my own...

thanks for the tip.

 

Tim

Tim

 timsvintagepens.com and @timsvintagepens

 

 

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ZI -- Well, maybe I won't get the "sac glue" after all! Might be better if I get some flakes and make my own...

thanks for the tip.

 

Tim

 

Given that the pre-mixed product (Zinsser is the brand I've heard of) will last at least a couple years, I'm not sure it's worth getting flakes (which are significantly harder to find) unless you do a great deal of sac work (and then you'll use up a half pint before it expires). The only advantages flakes have are that you can control how dilute the mixed shellac is, and the shelf life timer doesn't start until they're dissolved -- but at $5 to $7 for a half pint can every couple years, it's not that much of a hardship to buy a new can every so often, and the Zinsser product is perfect for sacs right out of the can. Trick is, you can't buy the half pints unless you find a real woodworking store like Klingspor's -- Lowe's doesn't carry anything smaller than a pint, and I'm pretty sure Ace in my area doesn't, either. Fortunately, there's a Klingspor's not far from me -- when my tiny bottle runs out, I'll probably try them.

Does not always write loving messages.

Does not always foot up columns correctly.

Does not always sign big checks.

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And $5 or so for Giovanni's (Tryphon) that last 10 years...

 

Why bother with anything else?

 

There is SO MUCH OTHER PEN REPAIR STUFF that is Hard Already without making the mindless stuff difficult.

 

Bruce in Ocala, FL

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Yeah, that is sort what I decided...made a few calls and couldn't find the half pint anywhere in Manhattan, and have to do jury duty this week, and it's six block from Fountain Pen Hospital, so I bought the $5 bottle today. Onward...

 

Tim

Tim

 timsvintagepens.com and @timsvintagepens

 

 

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Ron Zorn sez:

 

BTW, Sheaffer used Zinsser shellac - there was a gallon can sitting in the repair center.

 

 

Link

 

John

So if you have a lot of ink,

You should get a Yink, I think.

 

- Dr Suess

 

Always looking for pens by Baird-North, Charles Ingersoll, and nibs marked "CHI"

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