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Rohrer & Klingner - Scabiosa


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39 replies to this topic

#21 tawanda

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 11:17

Thanks to al who somewhat allayed my irrational fear of i-g inks. :thumbup:
Its odd, as I don't mind giving other inks a go that produced mixed responses. I love Parker Penman inks, for example.

And I should love i-g inks because I do like as dry and ink as possible in my wider nibbed pens. (Not fussy on fire hydrants)

So, perhaps, I'll give them a go...
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#22 Sandy1

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 13:29

Thanks to al who somewhat allayed my irrational fear of i-g inks. :thumbup:
Its odd, as I don't mind giving other inks a go that produced mixed responses. I love Parker Penman inks, for example.

And I should love i-g inks because I do like as dry and ink as possible in my wider nibbed pens. (Not fussy on fire hydrants)

So, perhaps, I'll give them a go...

Hi,

I definitely like i-g inks. As mentioned elsewhere, when I was gifted with a MB149, it was bundled with a bottle of MBBlBk i-g ink that was labeled '149'. So I've been using that and other i-g inks in all my pens without a worry, I just practice good pen hygiene as mentioned and no problems.

And by coincidence, I too used the Penman inks, in my cherished Duofold, with no problems at all. (Parker pen + Parker ink = Happy S1, and MB pen + MB ink = Happy S1.)

I encourage you to look at the review of Salix I posted as well.

Best Regards,
Sandy1

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#23 FrankB

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 14:20

Thank you so much for the comparison of Poussiere de Lune and Scabiosa. I admit I am very surprized how dense the PdL is in this comparison.

Sandy1 wrote:

"As mentioned elsewhere, I found Scabiosa to be very elusive: both in trying to describe the colour, and trying to remember the colour when I'm not looking at a sample."

Heck, that is me with most inks! As I said, I have a terrible time discerning colors and remembering them.

#24 Gobblecup

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 18:09

This review, I know is quite old, and hasn't seen posting in some time, but I was very happy to see that you had done a review of Scabiosa!

It is one of my favorite colours, and I know since you're Ms. Blue Black, that this ink might strike you a "indecisive" and probably just strange, if not a marvel in its oddities and unusual lovely shading. I like to think of it as being decidedly mysterious, gleefully indiscernible. How ever you look at it, it surely is a lovely colour, and one you would be hard pressed to find a copy of. Thanks for another detailed and technical analysis. :clap1:


By the way, I had been thinking about getting a bottle, a big 100ml bottle, of J. Herbin's Poussiere de lune (thanks to reading a very convincing review of it).I had thought from seeing samples it looked something like Scabiosa, which I came to know first, and always thought of as a dusty purple. Now I am very happy to have run across your samples of each, because I don't think I need to buy the Herbin anymore. They're quite close it seems, and I think the great water resistance is a bigger plus to me than the silky nature of Herbin inks. In any case I may still try a sample of PdL myself, and decide for sure, but no more 100ml bottle now. :)

Edited by Gobblecup, 15 October 2011 - 20:16.

Gobblecup ~


#25 vistafan

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 18:17

Thanks for this review Sandy! I was on the lookout for a nice water resistant ink and this may fit the bill.I intend to use it for university notes and the colour is muted, making it rather restful on the eyes.

#26 sidewinderwcc

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 00:48

I hate your reviews! I want this ink so bad right now, and I cant find anyone that has it in stock!

Once again a beautiful review Sandy, thank you for taking the time to be so thorough and for once again making my bank account scream! :crybaby:

#27 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:39

Lalo paper check for dryness is neat. :notworthy1: :thumbup:
So one must have this paper as a litmus test of dryness.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

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#28 Sandy1

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:40

Hi,

To support ad hoc comparison of inks of similar colour, I have revisited Scabiosa to add more samples. These samples use much the same layout, papers, pens and imaging method as the current reviews.

As always, should one feel that a separate Post or Topic is required to depict a certain aspect of an ink, your PM will be welcomed. While new scans can be accommodated in due course, creation of even more new written material is unlikely.

-=-


NIB-ism:

LINK:
Posted Image
L → R: r⦿tring 600 + steel F nib; Waterman ? + steel M nib; Pilot Custom 74 + 14K 3-tine MS nib.


OTHER STUFF
Smear/Dry Times
Wet Tests
Posted Image


Written Samples - Moby Dick
Ruling: 8mm.

Paper: HPJ1124.
Posted Image

Paper: Rhodia.
Posted Image

Paper: Staples 20lb.
Posted Image

Comments:
  • Results are consistent with prior samples.
  • Staples 20lb. was not used in the initial review. Scabiosa does not show any feathering, or bleed- show-through with that paper. :thumbup:

======


Edited by Sandy1, 16 October 2011 - 12:42.

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#29 Sandy1

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:51

This review, I know is quite old, and hasn't seen posting in some time, but I was very happy to see that you had done a review of Scabiosa!

It is one of my favorite colours, and I know since you're Ms. Blue Black, that this ink might strike you a "indecisive" and probably just strange, if not a marvel in its oddities and unusual lovely shading. I like to think of it as being decidedly mysterious, gleefully indiscernible. How ever you look at it, it surely is a lovely colour, and one you would be hard pressed to find a copy of. Thanks for another detailed and technical analysis. :clap1:


By the way, I had been thinking about getting a bottle, a big 100ml bottle, of J. Herbin's Poussiere de lune (thanks to reading a very convincing review of it).I had thought from seeing samples it looked something like Scabiosa, which I came to know first, and always thought of as a dusty purple. Now I am very happy to have run across your samples of each, because I don't think I need to buy the Herbin anymore. They're quite close it seems, and I think the great water resistance is a bigger plus to me than the silky nature of Herbin inks. In any case I may still try a sample of PdL myself, and decide for sure, but no more 100ml bottle now. :)

Hi,

You're welcome!

Indeed, Scabiosa remains one of the more 'unmatched' FP inks, due in part to the colour, and the shading and charisma generated by the i-g content.

JH's PdL is quite another ink altogether, and I would not be so hasty to choose one in place of the other. (This is FPN after all!!) I must say that the swab comparison above does not tell but half the story - written samples seem necessary to depict iron-gall inks. Also, as JH offers PdL in the 100ml bottle, it would seem to have many supporters using large quantities.

I hope the additional Written Samples will support future comparisons to a greater extent.

Bye,
S1

The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.


#30 Sandy1

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:55

Thanks for this review Sandy! I was on the lookout for a nice water resistant ink and this may fit the bill.I intend to use it for university notes and the colour is muted, making it rather restful on the eyes.

Hi,

You're welcome!

Certainly Scabiosa has admirable water resistance, and is more than 'nice'.
(Just wait until you use it yourself! :bunny01: Whee!!)

With inks that offer high shading potential, it is possible for the shading to slow the task of reading. Consequently, the choice of a narrow nib with an absorbent paper would seem a good combo to enable comfortable reading at speed, yet maintain the understated nature of the ink.

When choosing the kit for personal letters, I will make use of that characteristic: If I want the reader to slow the pace, I will use a shading ink with at least an M width line. Emphasising line complexity, (wide Italic flex nib + i-g ink), is likely to result in a very slow read, so I will use such a combo only if a letter is brief.

Bye,
S1

The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.


#31 Sandy1

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 14:14

I hate your reviews! I want this ink so bad right now, and I cant find anyone that has it in stock!

Once again a beautiful review Sandy, thank you for taking the time to be so thorough and for once again making my bank account scream! :crybaby:

Hi,

Thanks!

Does your bank account have a safeword?

Bye,
S1

The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.


#32 Sandy1

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 14:29

Lalo paper check for dryness is neat. :notworthy1: :thumbup:
So one must have this paper as a litmus test of dryness.

Hi,

All the papers used are chosen for their differences. The G Lalo combines a warm base-tint, a non-absorbent surface, and texture. Those characteristics can be used to show ink opacity (show-supress the base-tint); ink wetness; and the ability to work with various nibs to generate the desired line quality on textured papers.

The texture just might impede the motion of a flex nib spreading / closing its tines. (Dependent on tipping?)

G Lalo is one of my 'on purpose' papers, which I really like to use with some Turquoise and Dark Blue inks.

Bye,
S1

The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.


#33 jpnyc

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Posted 08 February 2014 - 20:51

Sorry if reviving such a dead thread is a no no, but since this seems to be the definitive review of this ink, I thought it might be better to post here than make a new thread.

 

First,  many thanks to Sandy for doing such wonderful ink reviews.  This is the first time I've commented on one of them (actually, my first post here, period!), but I've decided to buy / not buy samples of at least a dozen inks because of the information presented in them.

 

Now for my question: I'm looking for an ink that is very dark, very distinctive, and with good characteristics for a lefty student (fast dry time, no nib clogging, will not ruin the page if I spill coffee or water on it, etc.).  This ink seems sort of unique in that it actually appears darker and less shade-y where the writing on the page is finer.  It looks to me like where the writing is on the bold end, it's like a slightly redder Diamine Damson, and where it's thinner on the page, it's often just a bit lighter than Eclipse.  Is this accurate?



#34 ENewton

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Posted 12 June 2015 - 15:09

I have dedicated a (Platinum Balance M) pen to this ink and use the pen every day at work.  I understand that if I wanted to change to another ink, I would have to do a thorough job of cleaning the pen first, but if I am going to refill the pen with the same ink, should I still go through the process of rinsing with diluted vinegar, then with water, on a frequent basis?  I am having trouble understanding how such a process can reverse the effects of otherwise having iron gall in a pen all the time. If a person were to overeat every day, fasting for one day would not counteract the effect of overeating on every other day.  Is the idea that even if I use the pen daily, tiny chunks of something are forming inside my daily writer and need to be washed away regularly?  



#35 Sandy1

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 21:15

I have dedicated a (Platinum Balance M) pen to this ink and use the pen every day at work.  I understand that if I wanted to change to another ink, I would have to do a thorough job of cleaning the pen first, but if I am going to refill the pen with the same ink, should I still go through the process of rinsing with diluted vinegar, then with water, on a frequent basis?  I am having trouble understanding how such a process can reverse the effects of otherwise having iron gall in a pen all the time. If a person were to overeat every day, fasting for one day would not counteract the effect of overeating on every other day.  Is the idea that even if I use the pen daily, tiny chunks of something are forming inside my daily writer and need to be washed away regularly?  

 

Hi,

 

As you intend to use the pen as a daily writer, I doubt the vinegar rinse is necessary all that frequently: so long as you don't let the ink dry-out in the pen and give the nib+feed a water rinse whenever you charge the pen, I reckon you'll be just fine. :) 

 

When I'm in the field I use an I-G ink in a rotring 600. For years I just used a plain water clean-up, and since using a vinegar rinse I've not seen a difference, but that pen is dedicated to I-G inks. (Should I absolutely need ink of another colour, I have a back-up pen that is dedicated to simple aniline dye inks.) I refill the 600 daily, rinsing the open nib+feed with water, dab it dry-ish, then flush the 'old' ink from the pen back into the bottle, then cycle the converter piston a few times - in effect flushing the pen with fresh ink. Followed by the usual routine of removing the excess ink from the section and nib+feed. If things were rather rambunctious, I might give the cap internals a clean-up, but most often that's a weekly task.

 

I reckon the vinegar rinse is a good thing to do if ink has dried-out in a pen and/or as a troubleshooting measure, and is a good idea (low cost no risk precaution) if one plans to switch to another type of ink, such as a cellulose-reactive dye, nano particle, etc.

 

There have been a few reports of residue in some converters, but to date I've not seen any pattern to such occurrences, nor that pens been damaged by that residue. Perhaps it is limited to converters made of a certain type of plastic, which is quite different than that of the feed+collector.

 

As ever, I hope to learn from those who use an ink in their daily writer. I'd likely be too distracted by the charms of Scabiosa, so my field notes would be effusive and endless instead of brusque and brief.

 

__ Edit to add: One thing about the Platinum Balance is that it has a gold-plated nib mount. I'm not sure if the metal under the plating is stainless steel, but if not it may show a bit of corrosion in the long term if the plating if damaged whilst capping the pen or encounters with the lip of glass ink bottles.

 

Bye,

S1


Edited by Sandy1, 14 June 2015 - 21:36.

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#36 ENewton

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 22:02

I appreciate the detailed explanation and advice.  I hadn't thought of rinsing the nib and feed with water on a daily basis.  I will start doing that, and will take care to protect the plating on the Platinum Balance.

 

Thank you! 

 

Edith



#37 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 18 July 2016 - 20:02

Quite a few years later B) ....I have a Pelikan Ibex, OF with a maxi-semi-flex nib that I'd had for a few weeks with out inking. I had been most pleasantly with the flex of the gold nib, not expecting it on a second tier pen. This was more ink the pen and see how it wrote...not an ink review.

 

In somewhere else I'd just mentioned the semi-maxi flex rates of the '50-60's Pelikan pens, I had the sudden urge to ink it. :rolleyes:

 

R&K made it out of my 50 or inks. Verdura a great shading green-green has had more than enough playing time; as had Alt Goldgrun...  and I couldn't decide between Salex and Scabiosa. Not quite in a blue mood...I went looking. In I always take a look at Sandy's reviews. I chose Scabiosa.In I did want some shading.

 

It is not a 'noticeably' dry ink, with a maxi-semi-flex nib, on better than expected  Rex Office's imported from who knows where into Germany 80g paper. I only bought it because of the little blocks, that I was supposed to use to learn to draw letters better.....sigh. One does have to do strange things like practice. :(

It has good coating; a better paper than expected at 80g. Because of the ease of tine spread I did not find it all that 'dry'.

The Rex Office didn't give me as much shading as expected...again....I think due to the wetness of the nib.

 

So I found some space in a filled Clairefontaine Veloute 90 g spiral book...It gave me a bit more shading, but due to the wet nib, not quite as much as expected or hoped.

 

There are times when semi&maxi-semi-flex are a bit wet, dimming shadowing. This seems to be one. Often a 'true' regular flex....semi-vintage or vintage nib will give more shading that the wetter semi-flex. (M is often a very good nib for shading in that 'true' semi-vintage & vintage regular flex.)

This appears to be the case....but the wetness of the nib, took away the 'dryness' of the ink.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#38 IndigoBOB

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 04:01

I love this ink.

 

Definitely requires a wetter writer.  I use it in my TWSBI Eco Broad, which allows me to prime the feed very easily with a twist of the piston and getting the various saturations I want.

 

Very unique color.

 

Very Beautiful and well done.  Not glaring in vividness, but with a subtle vibrancy that grays a little to a soft calm with a nuanced purple that has a gentle communicativeness without being too light or soft.  

 

Reminds me of one of my favorites, Diamine Lilac night, but has its own distinct uniqueness as well as having the quality of waterproofness.  

 

A beautiful color.



#39 ENewton

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Posted 26 September 2017 - 13:04

I also like this ink and tend to use it most at this time of year, when at least in certain climates the leaves also turn to rust and dust.  

 

Although it is not a wet ink, I do not find it especially dry.  I recently tried Robert Oster Barossa Grape, which has a similar look but is drier and less saturated than Scabiosa.  

 

I have used Scabiosa mainly in a Platinum Balance medium and have never had to prime the feed.  

 

I have not tried Liliac Night, but reviews make it look much bluer than Scabiosa.  Would you perchance be willing to post an image that demonstrates the resemblance you see?



#40 IndigoBOB

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Posted 27 September 2017 - 05:39

I don't have a picture, but I like how both shade.  The dusty color of the scabiosa reminds me of the grayish color of the lilac night, both lending to a softness in a different way that other more vibrant inks lack.

 

I would say that Scabiosa is a bit more forward in the hue of its color, while lilac night is softer, but both can be saturated to the point of a lovely dark purple that easily replaces any blacks.  If you want a black purple there is always something like Diamine Eclipse, which is very interesting:  Like a black with character to it.

 

While lilac night does have a substantial amount of blue there is a purple undertone to it that seems to keep it in the realm of indigo.  Scabiosa is more purple with a bit of orange to it.  So very different types of purple.

 

I like the composure of both ink colors and how the color isn't too energetic bur more relaxing, with Lilac Night being quite soothing, while remaining dark with a wet enough nib, Scabiosa has a certain liveliness to it's composure and a little more energy, not necessarily making it better, but simply having more of that characteristic.

 

I find Lilac night very good for cogitative work, meditative writing, and one of the more beautiful colors if you can appreciate the subtlety of it.  

 

I'm a big fan of Lilac night because it offers a sooting ink, with a lovely color, shading, but still being dark enough for legibility.  It's a calm color.  I haven't found that easy to find unless the color is so faded or grayed, but lilac night strikes a lovely balance for me and it's very well behaved.

 

Edit:  I would definitely say the Robert Oster Barossa grape closer resembles the scabiosa.


Edited by IndigoBOB, 27 September 2017 - 05:42.







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