Lamy 2000 vs. Waterman Carene

[beluga]

Hello Emma,

 

 

I would have picked (another) Lamy 2000 without blinking an eyelid, but as you stipulated "heavy-ish" the Lamy might not be to your liking.

 

The Lamy 2000 does feel robust and is pleasing to hold, but it feels also fairly light due to its Makrolon construction.

Lamy nibs can be extremely smooth and - although two of my 2000's came in the mail and I could not try them beforehand - I was extremely pleased with the way they wrote right out of the box.

But more than Pelikan, Faber-Castell, Parker and some other brands, Lamy pens seem to reward writers who use only minimal pressure.

To me, this makes one of the pleasures of the Lamy 2000 that is effortlessly lays down a nice solid line with only a hint of pressure.

 

I have heard comments about leakage in the mid section and the little metal "ears" that hold the cap in place, but I found neither to be a problem.

According to a Lamy service representative, leakage may occur if the pen was taken apart and the small metal ring with the ears was incorrectly inserted during reassembly, or too much torque was applied.

With regards to the little ears; while I can feel them when I write, they never bothered me and they actually help me orientate the nib when writing.

 

 

Bleed-through; to my way of thinking it is primarily a function of ink and paper and only secondarily a function of the pen, where it is mainly related to ink flow.

Blue-Blacks (formulated to look like iron-gall ink) often work well because of their lower saturation, but if you are grading essays you may not have that option.

If it has to be red, I would consider one of the inks that are less saturated or flow less freely, like Herbin for example.

 

 

 

 

 

B

 

 

 

edit: typo corrected

Edited May 4, 2010 by beluga

[Scriver]

I have a Carene F nib that I find a pleasure to write with. It is a moderately heavy pen wth great balance and a smooth nib that works well for extended notetaking or drafting. I do not find it the best pen for editing, however, because the line is broader than I like for marginal notes or interlineation. For editing, I have found the Sailor fine nib (I use a large 1911) much better.

 

The filling system is mostly a matter of preference. To me, the Carene's C/C is a bit of drawback for extended writing, though with the countervailing benefit of making it easier to bring along when I travel (which is helpful for a note-taking pen). The smaller capacity of a C/C system is less of an issue for editing, since the net amount of writing tends to be less. The ability of the pen to put down a small, legible line is much more important, I think.

[InkyWinky]

Lets see. 8 Carenes for me, NO Lamys. That kind of sums it up. Carenes for deployment, Carenes for TDY, Carenes for note taking...

 

I know there's a huge contingent of Lamy addicts on this board. One hears the bleats daily. But as the owner of some $1000+ daily users, ONLY the Carenes remain in my stable alongside the high end pens. 'Nuff said.

 

 

Well said and 100% agreed!

 

I have both and the fully utilitarian Lamy never gets pocket time but my 5 Carene pens ( EF, F X 2, M, B ) are in constant rotation... evan against a stock of Pelikan M800/805, Visconti and Stipula. The Carene has a superb nib, puts down a clean, smooth, beautiful line and is a work or art to boot!

 

The Lamy... could be sold by Sears next to Craftsman wrenches and screwdrivers. A well-made tool, but a mere tool none-the-less.

 

Honda Accord vs. Nissan Ultima. Both are reliable and get you where you want to go, one does it with some sense of style, grace and panache. Maybe not quite a Jaguar but much less pure utility.

Edited May 4, 2010 by Powerbroker

[faustulus]

I have both -- each with a fine nib -- and don't think you can go wrong with either. I love my Waterman pens (Carenes, Charlestons, Philieas, Taperites, 52s, what have you). But that doesn't take anything away from Lamy. The 2000 seems to tend toward the broad side in almost all nibs I've seen. It holds a lot of ink and puts down a nice wet line. It is lightweight and tough. The piston filler holds a ton of ink, which is good because it puts down a ton of ink. The Carene is heavier. Its nib sizes are a bit more what most people would expect (a fine feels like a fine, a medium a medium). My version seems a bit drier than my Lamy, but it is by no means a 'dry writer'. It is heavier, and although it is physically more striking I worry about scratches more with it. The C/C filling system limits the ink a bit more, but with a dryer line it seems to last almost as long. As I said, either way you can't go wrong.

[Emma]

The votes are in, counting only those who expressed a preference. The Carene wins with 16 votes; the Lamy a close second place with 13 votes. The collective knowledge (annunciated here in a Ryan Seacrest manner) is:

 

Voters for the Lamy 2000 say:

 

The Lamy has a much bigger ink capacity

That it’s a great work pen for long periods of writing

That the filling system is better than the Carene’s c/c

That it’s reliable and indestructible (the Carene’s finish can wear with use)

That it has a smooth nib

That it’s a well-made workhorse tool

Best price: Pengallery (no affiliation)

 

Voters for the Waterman Carene say:

 

That this is an all round superior pen to the Lamy

That its heavier weight makes it a more balanced writer

That it’s more reliable than the Lamy (that reportedly leaks)

That the F nib is better than the Lamy EF/F which both run wide

That the Lamy can be an overly wet writer

That the Lamy is only a well-made workhorse tool

Best price: Pen Seller on ebay (aka J.M. Lewertowski)

 

My conclusion? To buy a Lamy 2000 EF nib for my workhorse pen to mark essays; and, to reward myself for a term of marking this summer, a Waterman Carene EF nib in Amber - a prettier finish for a superior pen.

 

I knew I’d end up getting both :embarrassed_smile: (but didn’t realize I could until I saw the discounts at Pengallery and Penseller)

Edited May 5, 2010 by Emma

[Ghost Plane]

We're champion enablers :ltcapd:

[jmpennifeather]

The Lamy 2000 is a great wet writer and could be the answer to your prayers.

[mstone]

Waterman Carene is a meticulously designed beautiful pen.

 

Lamy 2000 looks like Anna Oxa.

Huh. I've always thought the carene was a fairly ugly knockoff of shaeffer's inlaid nibs, with a truly hideous back end, whereas the 2000 is an inspired and classic design. But I guess it's all a matter of taste so I'll refrain from speaking in absolutes...

[Breck]

Waterman Carene is a meticulously designed beautiful pen.

 

Lamy 2000 looks like Anna Oxa.

Huh. I've always thought the carene was a fairly ugly knockoff of shaeffer's inlaid nibs, with a truly hideous back end, whereas the 2000 is an inspired and classic design. But I guess it's all a matter of taste so I'll refrain from speaking in absolutes...

 

I'm with you, but de gustibus non est diputandum, I suppose.

[pkoko]

The Lamy 2000 looks like any regular pen around $10; especially with the cap covering the nib. It is meant to be a working person's pen. It does that really well.

[mstone]

The Lamy 2000 looks like any regular pen around $10; especially with the cap covering the nib. It is meant to be a working person's pen. It does that really well.

It's meant to be a functional pen, not a blingy pen. There is a load of difference between a 2000 and a $10 pen, for someone who can recognize and appreciate the engineering. If the carene lasts 50 years I'll take it back and admit that it's timeless rather than an ugly knockoff of a superior design. :blink:

[pkoko]

The Lamy 2000 looks like any regular pen around $10; especially with the cap covering the nib. It is meant to be a working person's pen. It does that really well.

It's meant to be a functional pen, not a blingy pen. There is a load of difference between a 2000 and a $10 pen, for someone who can recognize and appreciate the engineering. If the carene lasts 50 years I'll take it back and admit that it's timeless rather than an ugly knockoff of a superior design. :blink:

 

I have a Lamy 2000 myself and I know what a great writing instrument it is; I am just debating looks and appearance to casual people. I have no doubt in my mind the Lamy 2000 will last many many years and in some cases the original owner. I have one and I know that; see my many recommendations for it as a workhorse pen.

[goodpens]

Looking for a comparison between these two pens, I was very glad to find this old thread.

 

Does anyone who owns both pens have experience with them in high altitude environments? Im wondering which handles altitude and pressure changes better (i.e. no leaking or burping). Thanks.

[Keyless Works]

Wow this is an old one.

 

I've had both. They are pretty different pens. The Lamy 2000 is a modern classic, the tip material is squarish (may be a problem for some) and the quality control is much worse than Waterman's. The Carane, apart from it's looks is a boring pen, but it is reliable and well made. If I was worried about reliability and pressure changes it would definitely be my first choice of the two by a mile.

[Tweel]

One possible advantage of the Carène in falling air pressure might be the feed, which has a relatively large buffering capacity (it'll hold about a converter's worth of ink) and is encased in a shell with a small breather hole. I have a Carène (not an L2K), but have no idea whether the design has ever saved me from an inky pocket.

 

Oh, and I agree with Keyless Works that it's very solid and well-made, but I don't find the factory italic on mine boring at all -- it's very nice.

Edited February 13, 2019 by Tweel

[Honeybadgers]

the 2000 every time. The carene is beautiful, but the 2000 is just classic. Especially an EF..

 

I went for a 2000 F kind of afraid of the sweet spot issue, but wound up later on selling my F and buying an EF. A lamy 2000 EF is a pretty wet EF, so it will still be a nice, satisfying line, but I don't worry about writing on cheap paper.

 

I don't find the 2000 too light at all. It's a medium weight pen. the stainless steel section makes it very nose-forward, which I also like. It's an easy pen to write for hours with.

[Tweel]

the 2000 every time.

 

Hmm. Every time what?

[Tseg]

I have both. I would use the L2K on the factory floor, using the Carene at a lunch meeting with the executives. Both of mine write fantastically. The reservoir on the L2K is cavernous.

 

The L2K has slipped from my hand as the Macrolon is a very dry material and there are no edges on the pen to catch hold once the slip begins. The Carene lacquer has a bit more stickiness to it. The Carene ‘step’ is insignificant, but is a snag point should the pen start sliding out of hand.

 

I do find myself having my L2K inked more, but that is partly because I have wonderful Bold Oblique nib in, whereas the Carene has a less colorful Fine nib in use.

[thx1138]

I have both, Broad 18k lamy 2000 and Carene in medium and broad. Both brands are as near perfect as you get in fountain pens. Different, yes, but brilliant.

[pajaro]

Both the Lamy 2000 and the Carene are cute and attractive pens. I have a few of each. I think both are a bit heavy. Both are reliable. I use each infrequently. Every time I use a Lamy 2000 it is full of ink and it writes. When I use a Waterman Carene I often find the ink has dried up. Both write nicely.