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Small Wahl


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#1 Pensee

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 20:13

[attachment=66154:Small_Wahl.JPG]

Hi everyone,

I'm not familiar with Wahl's, so these are probably FAQs.
My writing & low rez. pict probably don't view well so brief descript.

Very small pen. Only 3/8” diameter and 3-3/8” inches long (unposted.)

Cap: Wahl Pen / Gold Filled / Made in U.S.A.

Nib: Wahl #2 14k

The chevrons don’t line up. (Are they supposed to?)

Ring has a kind of diagonal ‘cut’ near where it comes full circle. Was this incision part of some sort of clasp or missing part?

Finally, does it have a name or model number?

Approx date of pen? From nib & writing sample I'm guessing 19-'teens' to 1920's?

thx

--Bruce

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#2 Roger W.

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 20:45

Anything Wahl is 1921 and later. It is the "check" or "unique" design and is generally suppossed to align but, that is really dependant upon when the end of the section hits the inner cap. In the earlier Wahl tempoint catalogue this was a No.204A or No.204AG (yellow gold or green gold). Yours probably dates from 1921-'22 as it is a hard rubber section which predates the all metal pen which started late 1922. Cut in the jump ring doesn't indicate anything.

Roger W.

#3 Wahlnut

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 06:12

Not to be a fussbudget or anything but I think the identification process for this pen makes a great opportunity to go through some details that may be of interest. I believe the number of this item is actually #321AW and was made around 1925-26. It is referenced on Page 29 of the 1925 Wahl Eversharp catalog. The product numer breaks down as follows: 3=pen length size in Wahl-speak, 2=nib size, 1=metal pattern -Check, A=Yellow Gold, and W="womens" or ring top to us. There are a few tell-tales to go by and I think it might be of benefit to the Forum readers to go over them in some detail..
1) The cap lip is not beveled as was the case with the mounted pens of the 1921-22 time frame.
2) Because the 204 was a god filled "mounted" pen it had the metal exterior covering a hard rubber under-barrel. The BHR inner barrel of that pen protrudes a small distance forward of the gold overlay to which the section was fitted.
3) The lever of the 204 pivots on a pin fulcrum mounted through the inner BHR pen barrel and the metal mount was slid over that. Bruce if you look at the lever of your pen, I think you will see the lever pivots on 2 prongs that are the tips of a little spring mounted in the lever cavity and that stick into 2 holes in the turn down flange of barrel metal of the lever slot.
4)Also the lever of the 1291-22 pens have a "spine" on their top surface.

As Roger says of the 204, the 321 was available as a Green gold or Yellow Gold. The one in the picture appears to be yellow gold, so the A after the number. It would AG if Green Gold as Roger correctly states

5) The name for this pattern was Unique in the 204 and Check in the 321. Same pattern just a name change for some unknown to me reason.

A small point of clarification about All Metal pens: All Metal pens came with either gold filled over BHR sections or bare BHR sections. The All-Metal moniker seems to refer only to the pen barrel and cap but not necessaily the section. In 1921 the All Metal Barrel pen had a BHR section, In 1922 it had a metal covered one and later on they came both ways. Until the All-Metal Pen the BHR inner barrel was there and took up some sac room. The big advantage to the All-Metal pens was the elimination of the BHR inner barrel, and the resulting much larger sac/ink capacity they offered.

Now, my dear Bruce, that may be way more information than you bargained for, or an indication that I have way too much time on my hands, but in the interest of full disclosure, there it is.

Syd

Edited by Wahlnut, 24 March 2010 - 06:44.

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#4 Shangas

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 06:38

A beautiful Wahl "Art Deco" gold-filled ringtop Vest-Pocket fountain pen, mid 1920s. A very very fine fountain pen.

Buy a pocket-watch and a Double Albert chain and this pen is right at home.
http://www.throughouthistory.com/ - My Blog on History & Antiques

#5 Roger W.

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 13:08

Syd;

Ya know, I just didn't remember when they went to the all metal pen if they all were all metal or not. You are undoubtably right.

Roger W.

#6 Wahlnut

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 15:17

Syd;

Ya know, I just didn't remember when they went to the all metal pen if they all were all metal or not. You are undoubtably right.

Roger W.


Even with catalogs sitting right in front of me, sometimes there are so many little detail variations that distinguish one model from another it is not easy to sort things out on first or even second glance. But between all of us who follow this brand or company we will eventually get it right.
Cheers
Syd
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#7 jbb

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 15:29

One of my favorite fountain pens!!! :cloud9: Enjoy!

#8 jde

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 18:35

That was all of interest to me, Syd!

*turning to page 29 of "General Catalog No. 104" and seeing what Syd saw*

Cool.
 
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#9 Pensee

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Posted 25 March 2010 - 00:57

Anything Wahl is 1921 and later. It is the "check" or "unique" design and is generally suppossed to align but, that is really dependant upon when the end of the section hits the inner cap.


Thanks for replies

“Check” pattern for ‘checkbook size. Easy to remember that way.

And problems seem so obvious once pointed. Tweaking the section a little has pattern matching up fine.

I believe the number of this item is actually #321AW and was made around 1925-26. It is referenced on Page 29 of the 1925 Wahl Eversharp catalog. The product numer breaks down as follows: 3=pen length size in Wahl-speak, 2=nib size, 1=metal pattern -Check, A=Yellow Gold, and W="womens" or ring top to us.

3) The lever of the 204 pivots on a pin fulcrum mounted through the inner BHR pen barrel and the metal mount was slid over that. Bruce if you look at the lever of your pen, I think you will see the lever pivots on 2 prongs that are the tips of a little spring mounted in the lever cavity and that stick into 2 holes in the turn down flange of barrel metal of the lever slot.

Now, my dear Bruce, that may be way more information than you bargained for, or an indication that I have way too much time on my hands, but in the interest of full disclosure, there it is.

Syd


A 321AW it is then. LF is as you described.

And not information overload at all. I like learning the stories & history behind pens.

Buy a pocket-watch and a Double Albert chain and this pen is right at home.


Don’t tempt me! Not sure about chains, but always linger around the pocket watches & jewelry cases where most of overlay & filigree pens are found at estate sales.

One of my favorite fountain pens!!! :cloud9: Enjoy!


Yes, “Love at first write.” :cloud9:

Tested nib at estate sale & that blew any chance I had of getting estate sale lady to come down on price (The delicate art of haggling is half the fun of going to such sales.)

Could only talk her down from $80 to $75 but figured nib was probably worth that much.

Just one follow-up question related to pricing that never thought to ask until now.

Is patina desirable in filigree or overlay pens?

How does that factor into ‘mint’ –vs- ‘near mint’?

No dents or scratches on this pen, but does have some patina. (I'd think any soft metal like Ag or Au would have some patina after 84 years.)

I ask because if Mint = 'can't tell pen has been used' then wouldn't any patina knock almost all filigree /overlay pens down a notch into 'near mint'?

Or maybe “mint condition filigree / overlay” is where those beautiful 5 figure pens come into play? Out of my league, but pictures of them nice eye candy.

thx

--Bruce

#10 C Feyen

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Posted 03 November 2010 - 20:24

I appreciate the help I found here identifying this pattern as check/unique. I have a beautiful gold Wahl with a #4 nib with this design. Unfortunately it has no cap. I would love to be able to locate the correct cap. The barrel is just a hair under 3" with a BHR section (11/16" long), barrel end 3/8" diameter. The lever has a raised 'hump' type design. There is no imprint on the barrel that I can find so am wondering how to tell if gold is yellow or green? I will try to figure out how to post a pic if you need it.
Thanks
Cynthia
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#11 simp

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Posted 08 November 2010 - 23:57

4)Also the lever of the 1291-22 pens have a "spine" on their top surface.


Is that difference the one shown in these two pens?

Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

(I'm not good at taking pictures, I hope it these photos can be clear enough, there is a full resolution version accessible starting from
http://www.fountainp...versharp_Photos)

I noted the difference between the levers but I ignored it could be used to make distinction about the dates. Thank for another useful piece of the Eversharp history.

Simone

Edited by simp, 08 November 2010 - 23:58.

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#12 Shangas

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 23:36

Hi Simone, I think you're right. Early gold Wahl pens had raised levers (pen on the left) but the later ones had flat levers (pen on the right). I have three Wahl pens, one ringtop, two regular. One of the regular pens has a raised lever, and the person I bought it from said it was from 1922. The other pen is from 1927 and it has a flat lever.
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#13 Roger W.

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 23:49

Hi Simone, I think you're right. Early gold Wahl pens had raised levers (pen on the left) but the later ones had flat levers (pen on the right). I have three Wahl pens, one ringtop, two regular. One of the regular pens has a raised lever, and the person I bought it from said it was from 1922. The other pen is from 1927 and it has a flat lever.


Shangas;

The Sheaffer licensed lever lies flat and that is the earliest one used in tempoints (1917-1921). The raised is somewhat later. The ads from 22-25 look like raised levers and '26 on look like long levers with the customary hump to it. I think the ads support your thoughts on this.

Roger W.






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