Where do fakes stop?

[meanwhile]

In another thread I said that I believe:

 

...mechanically complex pens very rarely get faked. Faking is more likely with the level of prestiege and price, less likely with the amount of engineering that is required to make a pen. I really doubt that there is such a thing as a fake VP - with it having an unusually shaped metal body and a retracting nib. I'd even be surprised if the retractible version of the MB Boheme got faked much.

 

Would people agree with this?

 

According to my theory, the most likely pens to be faked are (surprise!) Mont Blancs of a resonably conventional appearence. Funky shaped MBs like the Kafka are much less likely to be faked than Meisterstucks or von Karajans, and the retractable version of the Boheme probably isn't faked at all. Sailors will get faked more than Pelikans because of their simpler fillers. And Vanishing Points and Snorkels won't get faked at all (but does anyone fake vintage pens?)

 

Obviously, pens which have "official" Chinese clones are most likely of all to be fakes.

 

What do people think? Has anyone heard of a fake VP? How about a Kafka or a modern Pelikan M Series?

[Michael Wright]

I'm no expert, but it seems that a lot of MB "fakes" are more cases of trade mark infringement, since they're not close replicas of any particular pen, but have the magic snowdrop.

 

It seems the most pernicious fakes at the moment are pseudo-Sonnets. The latest piece on them, by Bill Riepl in Stylophiles, makes it sound like you could write with one of the fakes for a year without realising it was a stumer. This is a bit odd, as the pens are medium priced, and the counterfeiting is done with great care.

 

Apparently there's also been a plague of bogus S.T. Duponts. These are more understandable, given the price they go for.

 

Best

 

Michael

[london]

I think if the original product has a high value - and is well recognised as being high value (or simply well recognised) and the public want one, the product will get copied. There is also the aspect of how easy to fake the item is - that is, what cost is involved in making a fake. The blaggers also just tend to slightly alter things that are too complex to make. For example, if Pelikan fakes exist, I wouldn't be surprised if they are cartridge pens!

 

So it just becomes a common marketing/manufacturing question - does the market want them?/how much can we make them for?

 

Consequently, blaggers love items that are most distinguishable by their logo. You simply apply the logo to anything and can pass it off. That is, take any black pen and apply a birdsplatt to the top and it'll sell.

 

(and, I've seen fake Kafkas on ebay in the UK)

 

- Mark

[london]

Michael is right. In the UK, many of these 'fakes' would simply be infringement of trademark, aka 'Passing off'. Then we can start on the whole area of copyright, intellectual, patent etc etc

 

- Mark

[Lemur]

Sometimes the are rather "idiotic" fakes appearing on auction sites.

On a Swedish auction site I´ve seen a MB "Franz Kafka" roller ball.

It´s quite "amazing" that people try to sell such obvivous fakes, as the Kafka don´t exist as a roller ball.

 

 

Regards

Ingmar

[yarek]

I've seen some MB fakes. Those were Boheme and Franz Kafka LE. Although I don't know much about Mont Blanc, I do think the nibs were different from those I have seen here on FPN. There were also no papers, guarantee and everything else you get when you buy LE pen from Mont Blanc.

The price was funny. Could buy Franz Kafka LE for 50$ for BP and FP.

 

I've seen also fake Sonnets.

 

I do agree with you Meanwhile. I guess that making a fake of VP would be to complicated. I think that people who want to buy such a specific pen like VP would have no difficulty in telling wheather it is a fake or not.

 

Would you agree?

[KCat]

I do agree with you Meanwhile. I guess that making a fake of VP would be to complicated. I think that people who want to buy such a specific pen like VP would have no difficulty in telling wheather it is a fake or not.

 

Would you agree?

i basically stated this same opinion. It would be costly to "fake" a VP I would imagine. Certainly you couldn't do it with the same mechanism for the very low prices you see on most fakes. In all likelihood, it would have to sell for about the same as a true VP just to recover manufacturing costs since it is not a simple tube with a cheap feed and nib attached.

 

And I imagine the demand is not there even though among FP folks, it is a very popular pen - for the same reasons said here WRT brand recognition and "prestige".