I'm looking to design some nibs

[GouletPens]

Here's a bit of my background, and I'm being completely open and honest here. I started making pens because I have a good acumen for it, and I didn't know squat about 'commercially made' pens at all when I started. It's been almost 3 years now, and though I've made over 700 of them, most have been rollerballs, and most have been 'gift' pens with almost no focus on fountain pens at all. After attending the DC FP Show this summer, I became intrigued with fountains and dove in head first. Since then I've started also selling for Exaclair, all fine Clairefontaine and J. Herbin products which I love and have had good success thanks to the great folks here at FPN. I've been getting a lot of feedback from my customers (many of you) about my pens, and although they are pretty and well-made, I am a little bit lacking in my offerings for nibs. Ideally, and I think this is the dream of every pen maker, is to have my own nibs made for me. Now I'm smart enough to know that I can't make them myself, so I'm looking for a source for great quality nibs that, in their performance, will match if not exceed the aesthetics of my pens. I've since learned that Bock in Germany is one of the biggest nib makers out there, so I thought they might be a good place for me to start looking. The bottom line is here, that I recognize that nib knowledge and expertise is now my biggest shortcoming as a pen maker, and I desperately want to remedy that because I am ALL ABOUT offering the best quality products to my customers. I am open to BRUTALLY honest feedback about my pens, and I greatly value the knowledge and experience of all the members here. Please, let me know what qualities you truly desire in your nibs. The best kind of feedback for me would be if you could take a look at my website, www.GouletPens.com, and answer me this question: "I would buy one of your pens, if only it had (blank)". Since I know you all will tell it to me straight and help me to be a better pen maker, use "FPN" as a coupon on my website and get yourself 10% off your total order, as a thank you from me. Alright, so let's hear it!

[tfwall]

You might post a similar call for technical expertise over in the Pen Turning subforum.

 

Brian Gray, in addition to being a pen maker himself, has an interest in nibs and could be a good resource for you as well.

[GouletPens]

You might post a similar call for technical expertise over in the Pen Turning subforum.

 

Brian Gray, in addition to being a pen maker himself, has an interest in nibs and could be a good resource for you as well.

I thought about posting it in the pen turning subforum, but my intention with this post at least is not to hear from other pen makers, but to hear from experienced pen users. I'd like to hear what particular nibs people like, don't like, and why. The more I know about what fountain pen users like, the better information I'll have when it comes to actually start 'nib shopping', especially if I'm looking for custom grinding and not-so-common sizes. If I'm better off in the Pen Turning section, I'll scamper on over there....

[Bobby Check]

Bock has produced some superb nibs for some great pen makers such as Tibaldi in the 1990's and Visconti.

 

If you wish my comments, then here are my personal opinions:

 

I write with fountain pens all day long. Sometimes I will take 60 pages of notes with a FP.

 

If a pen is not a great writer, I can lose patience quickly.

 

I must say that I prefer that the pen be perfectly balanced and NOT have a metal section.

 

In my personal opinion too many premium pen makers produce pens that are too long for a full day of writing. In my opinion a pen that is too long, writes a little slow.

 

For me the pen should be between 5 3/4" to 6 3/4" long when posted.

 

The section is where tiny differences in diameter affect the feel of a pen. For me approximately ½" is just right.

 

In an ideal world it would be nice to allow the customer a choice of diameter of sections.

 

While we are talking dreams, it would be nice to be able to adjust the balance of the pen. Nakaya and Conway Stewart do it.

 

Of course, all at an affordable price.

 

Gool luck!

 

Bobby

Edited November 27, 2009 by Bobby Check

[tfwall]

I don't think you'll be able to get custom nibs at good price without placing a huge order, well beyond what you could reasonably use.

 

So, I think it will come down to picking a good quality product from one of the big manufacturers and using them as is.

 

As for size, that is (mostly) an aesthetic choice that you as the craftsman has to make. Except for some of the truly enormous nibs, most write the same among a given line. So, it doesn't matter what size it is, as much as it matters that you using a higher end product from a reputable maker.

Edited November 27, 2009 by Chemyst

[manolo]

My personal feelings:

 

no metal sections (they get slippery). I doubt I will never buy a pen with a metal section.

 

no substantial steps on the body of the pen. They can disturb the grip being uncomfortable. Different people grip at different heights, so this must be taken into account too.

 

not too much weight.

 

not gold trim (my taste), or at least option to select gold/silver trim.

 

About the nibs:

 

they must write as they are supposed to, i.e., an F should be a true F, not thicker as a medium. Binder has a very good reference chart in his web.

 

Stubs and cursive italics are interesting and demanded by experienced users.

[ToasterPastry]

Brian:

 

Even before you found FPN, I had been wanting to tell you how fortunate you were in having the tools to create the "perfect pen." I don't know if such an instrument exists, but I keep looking for one.

 

I think there are three types of people who collect and use fountain pens: 1) Those that pretty much use the fountain pen as an ink-to-paper distributor; 2) Those that like the romanticism of using a fountain pen; and 3) Those who admire the workings and design of an instrument.

 

I think those that fall into category number 2 like the 'bling' of the pen. I pretty much fall into category number 3. But I find myself jumping between all three categories. I have been collecting pens for over a year. I find that nibs are important, but they are not the be-all and end-all of the pen. I have had some amazing no-name "Warranted" nibs, and lousy Sheaffer nibs. While I think the nib is probably the most important part of the pen, the feed is a very close second.

 

Over the last 125 years, people have developed some of the most amazing designs for pens. Now I'm writing with two pens, the Moore 94-A (see my review in FPN), and the Mabie Todd Eternal 44. Amazing pens. Amazing designs, and under appreciated. If I had the ability to create a perfect pen, I would make the size of a Mabie Todd Eternal 44 (or 46), I would have a Waterman nib (1920s), or maybe an Eversharp Personal Point nib system, a clear red Waterman 100-year pen blind cap, a Parker Vacumatic or Dunn filling system, and a Aurora 88 design. Maybe it would have a magnetic cap-holding system. The furniture would be gold, but very understated. The color would be black, with maybe a splash of color. The material would be celluloid. The body would be machined out of rod stock. I would have an ink-window in it. There would be no cartridge-converters!!!!

 

A person would pick up that pen and just admire it for years to come.

[jmkeuning]

I don't have any wood pens fountain pens. I've never been attracted to them.

 

I suppose that cellulose-reactive inks will stain a wood pen if the ink finds it's way through the finish. Which could look kind of cool actually, a sort of ink-o-log.

[offbase]

Does Schmidt make gold nibs? They might be easier to deal with than Bock for smaller orders.

[Paddler]

"I would buy one of your pens, if only it had (blank)".

 

Resin or acrylic body; screw cap; no radical shoulders; resin, acrylic, or HR grip section; light weight; forward balance unposted; simple filling system (international cartridges ok, lever fill ok); open upturned nib, very slightly springy, gold or steel, very smooth at 50 degree writing angle, broad line width, 7/10 wetness.

 

Paddler

Edited November 27, 2009 by Paddler

[rookieboyliu]

As for grip, it must be able to be gripped all day long and not become slip shod after 5 minutes of use and sweat. I believe the majority of FPNers here who have experienced a metal grip would appreciate pens which has better control, especially for those who write constantly and sweat profusely. I hear resin does wonders.

 

As for filling system, that would really depend on every individual's preferences. Generally, as the prices of the pen goes up, people expect a filling system that isn't converter/cartridge, since they did invest into a piece of art, and converters are simply too basic. However, if the price is somewhat low range, then it's best to use converters, since that would help keep price down. So if the price is going to be above $100, I would suggest using converters, as generally, people who're willing to spend over $100 on a pen appreciates complexity and ink volume in their pens.

 

As for nib, I personally have no knowledge of brand names. However, I, like everyone else, appreciate a nib which is flexible for artwork and durable for logevity. Having a steel nib would obviously keep the price down, but may turn down gold fanciers. However, increasing the value with a gold nib, and you may be turning down simple investors. My suggestion would be to choose a brand name which could produce both flexible steel and gold nibs, and create the pen so that it could be simple to change nibs between steel and gold nibs. That way, you could attract both kinds of collectors, and if a nib fails, it would be simple to replace.

 

Balance is a major issue. From all the threads I've read, having a heavy pen is mostly always a bad case, while having one light as feather doesn't give a sense of investment either. Therefore, I would advise a pen which could range between light-medium to medium weight, and keeping balance a notable issue.

 

edited because I don't proofread enough

Edited December 4, 2009 by rookieboyliu

[Ghost Plane]

The weight and diameter variances in pen preferences are easily gotten around by offering a variety of styles for those who want narrow pens as well as those of us who prefer large, heavy pens.

 

The nib is going to be the crux of the matter or all the rest won't matter.

 

I suspect we may have to send Brian to a pen show and let him FEEL the nibs we're raving about, so he'll understand why the stubbed B of the Montblanc has so many followers, why 1.3 stubs and OBB appeal to a certain contingent, stare at those XXFs that send users like me screaming in the opposite directions while many swear by them, and to learn the difference between a nail of a nib, a hint of flex, and what keeps so many of us coming back to certain nibs and pen makers.

[GouletPens]

This is all such great information for me. I'm going to take my time before developing my own nib. I definitely want to do my homework, learn exactly what the differences are between all the different nib types, and try them out for myself. If you look around the forum, you'll see right now I'm working on compiling a large Clairefontaine order from France, and that will undoubtedly take up a considerable amount of my time (in addition to my 50+ pen backlog of customer orders for Christmas, and my regular paper and ink business). Once the baby comes in late Jan, oh just forget it. I'll be a walking zombie for sure, but boy what an exciting time. As a pen maker, I certainly have time on my side, so I'm going to do it right, learn everything first, and work to develop pens that will be pleasing to the true enthusiasts here on FPN.

[sumgaikid]

Since you're interested in nibs,how about oblique-style nibs with flex?

 

The type of pen I'd like would be made of celluloid(I think that David Nishimura of Vintagepens.com

is working with bringing back a form of celluloid),have a concave section like the vintage German pens,

(non-metal of course,but the section in the same color as the pen)an inkwindow(both long and short)

and have a piston-filler for a filling unit(BTW,not a converter). And of course,oblique nibs.

 

 

 

I don't ask for much....................

 

 

 

 

John

[GouletPens]

Since you're interested in nibs,how about oblique-style nibs with flex?

 

The type of pen I'd like would be made of celluloid(I think that David Nishimura of Vintagepens.com

is working with bringing back a form of celluloid),have a concave section like the vintage German pens,

(non-metal of course,but the section in the same color as the pen)an inkwindow(both long and short)

and have a piston-filler for a filling unit(BTW,not a converter). And of course,oblique nibs.

 

 

 

I don't ask for much....................

 

 

 

 

John

 

Phew, wow. Yeah, that one might take me a little while to develop I understand all the preferences though, though there are huge challenges for the handmade craftsman with certain aspects of a pen like this. I'm going to take note of all of this though, and work to develop each technique as I am able. I figure I have about 40-50 years of pen making experience ahead of me, by then I might be there

[staceyaj]

I'd echo some of the same things that others have said - a more gradual line between barrel and section and more non-medium nib options. My usual preference is for fines and extra fines. While a heavy pen is sometimes nice, I find that I use my lighter pens a lot more. So, I've learned that less metal fittings are better for me. The actual material of the pen body isn't important (wood, acrylic, celluloid, etc.), but it has to be attractive. Also, It helps if it is different or unique (like the circuit board - I would buy a fountain pen made of it).

[Silvermink]

Factory stubs are always a big draw for me.

[Ghost Plane]

Colors. Rich, incredible, rarely seen in pens colors. Look at the gorgeous stuff Conway Stewart puts out.