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Why are gold nibs so desirable?


BladeArcher

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I asked a very similar question this morning in the Pelikan forum. A retailer is offering an M200 with the option of changing the nib to a 14 carat M400 nib. Even at a discounted figure the gold nib increase the cost of the pen by 70%. As a Newbie my question was is it worth it, because 70% is a big increase?

 

In my ignorance I expected to receive a simple yes or no answer. But I can now see it is much more complex. If I understand this thread, the decision to buy gold seems to involve a lot more than simple function. Fashion, for want of a better word, seems to be more important.

 

Therefore, as a Newbie who (currently) values function over form can I conclude from this thread the following?

 

1. The performance of a pen, is dependent more on design than the materials used?

2. To get a pen that performs well, I am better off reading reviews than worrying about the material used for the nib?

3. The money I save from not buying a gold nib could be better spent on a professional nib tuner (if needed)?

 

 

Thanks

 

 

 

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I once took my pen to the Pen Doctor and he said that Steel Nibs are hard to grind down to EF size. Gold nibs on the other hand are much more malleable. Hence a lot easier to make in EF and F. Sadly my earlier steel nibs which were F writes like M in Gold nibs.

I don't get that. When you grind a nib down, you should only be grinding the tipping material, which is harder than either gold or steel. That's why pens have tipping material, to prevent the nib from being worn away. I don't understand why it would be easier to grind a gold nib since you're actually grinding the gold part of the nib.

The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. -- Herbert Spencer, (1820-1903) British author, economist, philosopher.

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I asked a very similar question this morning in the Pelikan forum. A retailer is offering an M200 with the option of changing the nib to a 14 carat M400 nib. Even at a discounted figure the gold nib increase the cost of the pen by 70%. As a Newbie my question was is it worth it, because 70% is a big increase?

 

 

I bought my Pelikan 200 from a retailer that offered that option, and had the chance to try the normal M200 nib alongside the M400 gold nib. I ended up choosing the non-gold version - just preferred the feel of it in that pen. Try both, if you can .....

 

I have got some vintage pens with wonderful gold nibs in though.

I chose my user name years ago - I have no links to BBS pens (other than owning one!)

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Why are gold nibs so much better than nibs made from other materials? Are they more durable? Do they write better? Is it the flex gold has (although many gold nibs are quite stiff)? I have some gold-plated steel nibs (I assume a strictly aesthetic feature) that write as well or better than my gold nibs. So, why is a gold nib so highly prized in a fountain pen?

 

regards,

Blade

 

 

Strictly from a performance point of view, I do not believe that MODERN DAY stainless fountain pen nibs are in any way inferior to solid gold nibs.

 

And the end of all our exploring

Will be to arrive where we started

And know the place for the first time. TS Eliot

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This issue has been discussed and discussed and discussed in the past.

 

The springiness of a nib is a function of the material, design, and manufacture.

Because gold is softer (by a factor of about 2) than stainless steel it is inherently springier.

The added work to make a SS nib as springy as a gold nib adds labor cost and material costs (as in heat treating the SS).

IMHO its easier to just start with gold in the first place.

 

My gold nibs have more give or are softer if you will than my SS nibs.

I prefer the softer feel of the gold.

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Gold nibs are used on more expensive fountain pens. Those pens write better than cheapies.

Not always.

 

Almost always!

 

I do have to say that the Waterman Phileas pens with steel nibs that I have (adjusted by Richard) write wonderfully! I really like them.

"God's not interested in operating a brownie-point system - he's only interested in loving and forgiving those who are brave enough not to deny what they've done. . . brave enough to be truly sorry, brave enough to resolve to make a fresh start in serving him as well as they possibly can" Susan Howatch

 

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A soft metal is not automatically springy. The two characteristics are not automatically self inclusive.

And the end of all our exploring

Will be to arrive where we started

And know the place for the first time. TS Eliot

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I like the springiness and corrosion resistance.

 

Also, many steel nibs are engineered to be manifold nibs, and I'm a big loather of nibs that stiff.

 

My favorite nibs, though, are titanium.

deirdre.net

"Heck we fed a thousand dollar pen to a chicken because we could." -- FarmBoy, about Pen Posse

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The story I've always heard is that gold nibs are supposed to be a bit smoother than an identical steel nib. Having used a few downright buttery steel nibs, I'm not sure that's the case, though it might have been thirty or forty years ago.

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I believe gold nibs get "worked in" to the way i draw. My oldest gold nibs are used to the way i lay down my line work. These are 10-15 year old gold nibs that i have used for almost all that time. My iridium or steel nibs that i have had the same amount of time are great BUT NOT "worked in" like the gold ones. I think since gold is softer it gets used to you. Just my opinion and why i pay more for gold.

www.stevelightart.com

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A soft metal is not automatically springy.

The Modulus of Elasticity of gold is approximately 83 GPa and of 304L Stainless Steel is 200 GPa.

The lower the Modulus of Elasticity (the slope of the Stress/Strain curve) the greater the deflection for a given force (as long as the material remain elastic, i.e. until it reaches Yield.).

Therefore, it takes 41.5% (83/200) the force for displacement of gold verses the equivalent nib cross-section of Stainless Steel. And since the yield point isn't reached (i.e. the material is still elastic) the gold or steel with "spring" back.

Edited by Glenn-SC
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The Modulus of Elasticity of gold is approximately 83 GPa and of 304L Stainless Steel is 200 GPa.

The lower the Modulus of Elasticity (the slope of the Stress/Strain curve) the greater the deflection for a given force (as long as the material remain elastic, i.e. until it reaches Yield.).

Therefore, it takes 41.5% (83/200) the force for displacement of gold verses the equivalent nib cross-section of Stainless Steel. And since the yield point isn't reached (i.e. the material is still elastic) the gold or steel with "spring" back.

 

Holy Moly, having read this post, my brain just died.

 

All I wanted to say was that I have no steel nibs that are remotely as smooth as my worse gold nibs.

Though, I will say that some of my steels are my faves for everyday use.

Thanks

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Why do some people seem to have no idea that nibs are "tipped". Pretty much everything that has to do with the area of the nib that contacts the paper has NOTHING to do with the base metal of the nib. Untipped nibs are a different story however.(The only untipped gold nibs I have seen are those that have been smoothed to the point of no return...)

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Why do some people seem to have no idea that nibs are "tipped". Pretty much everything that has to do with the area of the nib that contacts the paper has NOTHING to do with the base metal of the nib.

I agree that the nib meets the paper on the iridium (or whatever they use these days) and that has the greatest effect on how smooth the nib moves over the paper (glides or has tooth) and, of course, the line width and flow characteristics.

 

But I'm sorry, saying that the base metal has no effect on flex or feel of the nib is like saying your car's suspension has no effect on how it handles because only the tires touch the road.

 

And if what you say is true you just put all those "nibmeisters" out of business! :roflmho: :thumbup:

Edited by Glenn-SC
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We're not saying we don't know they're tipped. I think though that the effort that goes into tipping a gold nib would probably have more care put into it. I know part of what you're saying is that the feel of a nib has to do with a variety of factors. (14/18Kt, med/fine nib etcetera.)

Thanks

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The Modulus of Elasticity of gold is approximately 83 GPa and of 304L Stainless Steel is 200 GPa.

The lower the Modulus of Elasticity (the slope of the Stress/Strain curve) the greater the deflection for a given force (as long as the material remain elastic, i.e. until it reaches Yield.).

Therefore, it takes 41.5% (83/200) the force for displacement of gold verses the equivalent nib cross-section of Stainless Steel. And since the yield point isn't reached (i.e. the material is still elastic) the gold or steel with "spring" back.

 

Science wins again! :D

 

Thank you for posting that. It's always good to know why something behaves the way it does.

 

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Two points:

 

1. No one makes true "flex" nibs anymore. So, the flexibility argument is moot.

 

2. When you write, only the iridium touches the paper. All other things being equal, the nib could be made out of zinc, tin, whatever as far as smoothness goes.

 

It's psychological.

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The contacts on the video card in my computer are (probably) 24K, at least on the surface. Why? Gold is one of the least reactive metals, thus the "shiny", even in naturally occuring nuggets. Good for electrical contacts. This is why it has been prized, besides the fact that it is rather rare. In fact, the only thing that will dissolve gold is "aqua regis", a mixture of sulphuric and hydrochloric acid that will produce gold chloride. The corrosion resistance of gold is much greater than any steel, even stainless, which producers will tell you is really only stain-resistant. Being around the ocean, I can tell you I have seen lots of corrosion of stainless steel, and even more of plain or galvanized steel, and even some of silicon bronze!

Glenn-SC has answered the Modulus of Elasticity question admirably, but this only means that stainless steel nibs can be made much thinner that one of equal flex made of gold. And if the inks you are using are not excessively corrosive, there is no good reason for a gold nib, other than the bling factor. This is even more the case if we take tipping into account, a gold tip would wear quite readily, which may make the nib wear in to your writing style but also would mean a short useful life to the nib. Though I can see the romance of leaving a thin trail of gold with every word you write. :)

"... for even though the multitude may be utterly deceived, subsequently it usually hates those who have led it to do anything improper." Aristotle, Athenian Constitution, XXVIII:3 Loeb Edition

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As mentioned before, I am a complete newbie who knows nothing from nothing but I can't help wondering if there is another way of answering this question.

 

To use a car analogy, this discussion seems to be like trying to decide which it the better car, one that uses an aluminum or steel body. You get exactly the same discussions in mountain biking, should I buy a titanium, steel or aluminum frame.

 

In reality, what really informs is the test drive. A professional motoring journalist driving the car and making a comment on the performance of the whole car.

 

Surely it must be possible for the experienced fountain pen users to use (test drive) gold and steel nibs from the same pen makers and then making a judgment on the difference between the nibs. We would then be able to understand if the difference in major or minor. Once we know that we can factor in our own preferences for anti corrosion, bling or whatever.

 

 

 

 

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Going back to the 30's and 40's the advent of the fast drying, but corrosive inks like the Parker "51" ink made the use of a gold nib necessary. The visual element was not a concern with pens like the "51" as you can only barely see any of the gold, it is mainly the tipping on show.

 

However, quality pens have always had Gold nibs, so therefore the more expensive the pen the more the buyer is going to demand a Gold nib, or at least a Gold Plated nib so that the pen looks 'expensive'. However as as been said here, a well set up nib writes as the user wants irrespective of the material. It is the qualities of the design and manufacture that are going to affect the writing ability more than the material. However is is probably easier to manipulate Gold in the small quantities required for a quality nib and therefore, taking the man time into account, it may well be cheaper to manufacture a gold nib as opposed to one in stainless steel.

Obi Won WD40

Re vera, cara mea, mea nil refert!

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