I've largely given up on finding the One True Ink (although the search has taught me to grok blue-blackness). I've made peace with the demons of acidity and alkalinity (after determining that, for my purposes, they're unlikely to hurt me any). And I can read reports of others' experiences with bulletproof inks without twitching (much). I really should be able to sigh deeply and use Waterman's for everything. But.

I had the good fortune to be able to attend the DC show this year, where I spent quite some time at the ink-testing table. I tried several of Noodler's regular inks, and purchased Midnight Blue. I love the color and subtle shading, and I've had no significant difficulties with the ink: no creep, no staining, no converter vapor lock. But I have one little, insignificant problem, hardly worth mentioning. I wouldn't even bring it up if my left palm weren't mottled blue.

I tend to use less-absorbant papers for many purposes. Nothing fancy, just Apica notebooks and Gold Fibre pads. The Midnight Blue dries fully on these papers, but it takes a while. Long enough that, every few pages, I forget, flatten a page, and slightly smear a paragraph or two.

I'm thinking of diluting this ink with a little distilled water. The rule of thumb I see most often here is to try about 3:1 ink:water. But I've read conflicting reports of the effect of such dilution on flow (which is fine as it is) and drying time. So, am I barking up the wrong tree, thinking I can improve the ink for my purposes by adding some water? Will the shading go from subtle to extreme? Yes, I could just try it, and I probably will anyway, but I've learned that the FPN consensus is usually accurate and can save me some grief.

I want to emphasize that I think this is a great ink. I wouldn't even consider such messing about if I didn't love the color or had to overlook any peculiar behavior. There's nothing to fix here except its performance on certain paper which I've grown to like.

Well the more water the less concentrated the dye so the more clear stuff that needs to evaporate off before the ink is dry.


Kurt

In my experience, water is more viscous than ink. Also, water isn't necessarily more volatile than ink.

I have a few Private Reserve inks that are pretty saturated and work very well when diluted. It's important though not to dilute the ink too much because you will lose the lubricating properties. The pen might start skipping or take a long time to start.

I'm not sure what Kurt is trying to say, but it sounds like he implies that adding water will cause ink to take longer to dry. Not true. I'm no chemist or physicist... but think about it. Ink does not just dry, it also soaks into the paper.

Imagine an ink that has very little water and is like gel or jelly. It is going to sit on top of the paper like a blob, and it will never dry. Add some water, dilute it, it soaks into the paper, and dries.

So, yes, adding water can help increase dry time. I dilute all my Private Reserve inks if I will be writing with them.

Well, if the flow doesn't change much, the volume of liquid deposited per linear distance should be about the same. Not more clear stuff, but less dye. Assuming that's still enough dye, the question becomes roughly whether the original vehicle or the diluted evaporates faster. Different surfactant concentration, different surface tension, different feathering tendency.... Someone must've tried this.

By the way, Kurt, what's your avatar today? I think I like it, but I'm not sure what I'm looking at.

Michael

That's a good point, and I should have thought of it. Thanks!

Increase is the last thing I need.

So, ah, what else...no, I don't want to know. (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

I think jmkeuning was just meaning to say that adding water will make the ink dry faster, but made a typo.

But... I disagree! It depends on the ink (or rather, what's in it), but I've seen adding water slow the dry time down in few times I've tried diluting the ink. The problem isn't how water effects the drying time per se, but that adding water increases the flow a lot- and that's the cause of the slow drying times. And no, these weren't half-and-half mixes. I've basically written adding water off until I run into a pen with an extremely stingy flow rate.

For me, the slowest drying times I experiences are by very watery inks that come out very wetly. They sit on top of the paper like a blob, which isn't surprising- the paper can only absorb so much per unit time.

I'm not saying adding water always slows down drying, but in the few inks I've tried it with it has. In the end... just try it, don't bother waiting for more replies. Instead, tell us how it goes for you, with your ink, your pen and on the paper you use.

Aaron

Yeah, I meant to say decreases the time (increases the speed). Note that I said can speed up drying. The only inks I dilute are PR, they are so saturated.

Ach, OK!

The inks I've noticed a slower drying time with are the ones with a lot of lubricators and flow-promotors- some of the diluted Noodler's I've tried just about fell out of the pen, like an overhot sauna. Or some other bad simile- firehose is already well-used around these parts.

Aaron

Suprisingly enough I am a doubly degreed chemical engineer so I might have a little insight into evaporation!

yes the ink soaks into the paper but the water still needs to evaporate for the ink to become 'fast'

Kurt

Not really true what you have done by adding water is increase the surface are of the enire blob and it will dry but it is going to dry faster over a greater surface- this is not what you want to do. By adjusting the concentration of water in ink it is going to be a smaller change and you do have the chance of making a feathering mess.


Kurt

So, your double degree in chemical engineering tells us that if I take PR, and compare to some of the same ink to which I have added some water, that the PR with water WILL NOT do better on a timed smear test?

Actually two degrees in Chemical Engineering as in B.S. and M.S. Ch.E.

No that is not what I said.

if you add water to a solution of dye you are doing two things- one if you take the entire bottle as a whole ( your blob of jelly which I talked about above) or to a fill of ink in a pen. If you look at a fill of ink what you have done is remove a part of the dye which will not evaporate and replaced it by water which will. But at the same time you have by reducing the viscosity increased the possibility for feathering as the water will by capillary action be wicked into the paper. So in effect what you have done is caused a more dillute solution to, using the same extimated amount of heat, create a lighter dye line than you would by not adding water. So in a timed test there is more material available that needs to be evaporated. So the actual amount of increase in dry time improvement is most likely going to be balanced by the increase in feathering as a supposition. Unless I have the actual numbers I can not say since there are several physical effects occuring.


Kurt

It's a clown


Kurt

A scary-looking clown!

Soki

I've never quite understood the attraction of clowns. I'll just back slowly out of the big top for a while.... Cool graphic, though.

Thanks for everyone's thoughts on dilution. I'll just have to try it, when I get a few minutes and feel like making a mess. We just got the bathroom cleaned up, though, so it may be a few days.

Michael

This is a bit late, but I'd say in general that it depends on the individual ink and the combination of a number of different effects. While plain water is less wet than most inks and can increase drying time when added, some inks with anti-feathering properties can penetrate much better when diluted, at the cost of increased feathering of course. In this specific case, while the ink may not technically dry faster, based on my experience it will resist smearing more quickly.



Isn't that kind of redundant?