Hi everyone i'm still a teen so I would have no idea about this topic but I would really like to know something. When you're at a business meeting and everyone pulls out a pen whether it's a ballpoint, rollerball or fountain pen does it really matter what brand it is or is it alright to use those cheap looking executive pens you get from business promotions? And when I ask this I mean big meetings with the boss or someone up there who has the power to fire you.

In general, no one cares about pens but we pen nuts. Most business associates would only notice if your pen runs out of ink - if you're lucky! In my business (healthcare), most people are using drug company ballpoints, both the cheap kind and the nicer kind. So...don't worry...use what you like. My boss uses a Zebra ball point, for instance...

-A 25-year ad agency/corporate marketing guy

I'd say it is a double edged sword. My guess is that most people don't notice or care what you are using but some do and make judgments about you based on how you are dressed and what kind of stuff you carry and wear. They might form negative opinions about you if you are using a pen that is too big, to ostentatious, or more expensive than what they think is appropriate to your position in the company.

In my experience, bosses don't fire people because they use the wrong stationary products. We're there to do a job, and do it well, and if you happen to whip out a Montblanc and a Rhodia pad, it is no big deal. Now, if he's a fountain pen nut, and you are two, that may help you get an interpersonal relationship going, but it could backfire on you as well. If you're a young guy fresh out of school, and working your way up an organization, and make $50k a year, and you whip out a LE Montblanc, and start taking notes on your imported Italian leather padfolio, then you look fiscally irresponsible, even if it was a graduation gift.

It is far more important that you are there, paying attention, engaged, and know your stuff.

-George

PS: highest ranking executive at my workplace is fond of rollerballs, uses Retro 51's, and doesn't give a dang what anyone else uses to write with, wears to meetings, or drives.

Alright that's good to hear thanks for your input.

Brad

Not pen but the coolest PDA thingy, that's a different story.

Most people at work don't notice, but occationally one does and that leads to some interesting conversations.

I like to have a nice "business" FP even if no one else notices, its all about how I feel. It makes me feel good to have a nice FP with my nice business suit. I feel missmatched wearing a $500 suit and a 25 cent bic. As for what anyone else thinks, i could care less.

Buy and use the pen because you like it, don't expect anyone else to notice or care!

I agree with the PDA as the impression maker.

Shows your on top of technology and working in the future.

Other than some niches, conspicuous consumption, especially if you show up the boss, can really give people the wrong impression.

The only times I had a boss commenting on my pen (in a way at least) was at my first job. I had been dreaming to get a Patrician throughout my years in university so once I landed that first job I quickly fulfilled that dream.

During a presentation given by the boss and owner of the startup, at some point he started to wave and make flourish displaying his pen while talking (to a point where I was wondering if did it on purpose to show off) Then all of a sudden he froze and look at my pen (I was taking note obviously). He looked at his pen then mine, his was an entry level Waterman, he looked at me then at my pen then at me again but no words.

One week later yet another presentation and he was back with a larger pen it was a 146 or 149 not sure which one but the white star was clearly visible

Bottom line I never had any issue with the job nor the boss and no words on fountain pen were ever exchanged... (but I'm still laughing to this day that he had to burn money...)

@JFT: That story is Awesome + Hilarious = Hilawesomeous, 100% Hilawesomeous.

I recall reading in an etiquette book that a pen and pencil "of excellent quality" are part of professional dress.

I think a nice Pelikan or Parker, of any age, should be fine for virtually all circumstances.

I work in an engineering company. Pens are considered utterly irrelevant to the business and are ignored. The MD uses a Mont Blanc ball point, but it was a gift from his wife. Nobody else in the firm uses FP's and I'm considered a serious oddity for even considering a writing instrument for more than a few seconds (well, that and a long string of other reasons involving scrap materials, pallets, etc).

Regards

Richard.

I have had really good comments about my cheap plastic Parker 45, and no-one notices my faceted Pilot Capless... But to answer the question, I always use a FP in any meeting. I am in the Army, and most officers I know seem to use a FP, even if it is just a disposable Pilot V pen.

I find that people notice my pen, and ask questions, and I notice others.

On the basis that first impressions count then what I write is as important as my suit, tie and the shine on my shoes.

And you can probably interpret that sentence as a postive or a negative.

PDA's are out...you need a smartphone to make a real impression these days...it really annoys me, all those people constantly checking their mail during a meeting.

Q to Mr Blonde or anyone who can answer

I was in the British Army (Royal Engineers) as an officer. Also over here the officers also tend to use FP espicaly the more senior levels. Wonder if it is a military 'thing' or tradition ??

Or they get mail and the wretched thing buzzes on the table - making the whole desktop into a sounding board. Discreet, it isn't.

Regards

Richard.

OK I am kind of keen on using a fountain pen , and really don't mind if others prefer ball points or PDAberry gadgets (though seeing everyone scramble under desks to get their laptops plugged in before (1) someone else picks all the sockets and (2) their battery goes flat makes me smile) but I am surprised when people who are in very senior positions write with chewed up old freebies.

I've been with this company for 12 years now and in that time I have seen more and more people using fountain pens at the meetings I attend - maybe they are "coming out" having seen me, blots, inky fingers, ink bottles and all

Some MBs, a few Watermans and a Pelikan or two, plus an old Parker and a Lamy Safari. We are getting there! Price range from low to high.

But in answer to the question, something understated but classic and of high quality (not necessarily expensive) is never a bad choice but if you are in a relatively junior position (meant kindly!), solid silver, or gold, or lapis lazuli and oversized might be considered a little ostentatious even if you had said to the boss it was a graduation present. Bear in mind that a good quality pen will last a lifetime whereas cheap rubbish will always disappoint, so don't be afraid to have a good quality pen used discretely.

But enjoy using your pen(s)

Chris

I am still in the Defence world, as a civilian engineer that is. I would not say the use of FPs is specific military thing. It is a common senior level thing. Seniors have the nicer things such as cars with drivers, offices, income that go with the position and responsability. Some have good taste in FPs. The majority use whatever is available to write with. But I can agree to what is said earlier: Pen lovers at least look at your pen and sometimes judge you partially by it.

First, a word of warning. It may come to pass that one day you are signing a major contract at a formal signing ceremony; this is particularly likely if you are doing business in East Asia. Pulling out a cheap ballpoint will NOT do, here.

At the very grandest contract signings, pens of very high quality may be ordered and engraved for the occasion - should this be the case, be ABSOLUTELY SURE that you never lose the pen you walk away with, as your Japanese or Chinese counterpart, on meeting you again years later, is highly likely to pull his out and show it to you as a mark of respect - you had better be able to do the same. (He will, of course, have been reminded in advance, by one of his staffers, that he met you at the signing).

Now, a practical business pen story: I was evaluating bids by two Classification Societies for a new contract; one sent a very pretty and capable girl and the other sent an older man who pulled out a Parker 51 and made copious notes with it.

He probably would have got the contract anyway, due to greater organisational depth, but that FP certainly helped him.

Often I have to say no - only the odd colleague seems to notice...

when it comes to the boss though - it was a different situation - I was close to seriously tell her off...

during a meeting, she needed to scribble something - found no pen so she streched for my Pelikan FP. She started to tear the poor cap with some fury, getting increasingly annoyed that she could not un-cap it...
In the midst of my deepest panic I told her loud and clear - interruupting the entire meeting "when you are done abusing my precious foutain pen I would happy to hand you this cheap ball-point pen instead which will prove less of a challenge for you"...

Imagine the look I got back from her...

I have seen one Lamy rollerball. That's it. Otherwise, whatever that is picked-up from supply or out of some nearby pen cup. In my time in the workforce, I can probably think of less than ten times I've seen nice pens in use -- a couple MB 149s at the top end. I guess "we" must be the only ones buying them ;-)

Agree with high-end gadgets: more likely to see Apple phones or super-duper PDAs in use.

-P

US corporate types seem to use far less fountain pens than their non US counterparts. I've taken some teasing on "writing with antiques" but other than that, no one cares.

I'm sure it's a British class thing. Kids in public school are still made to use fountain pens today.

I've always carried a pen/pencil set with me, even if it geeky! When I have given my pen to a client to sign an order older clients will know how to write with a fountain pen and younger clients do not. Then again half of the time the clients could not figure out how to twist or pull the cap on a nicer ball point. For a short period of time I had a nice ball point with the push button on top and everyone tried to twist to top off.

Be prepared to lose it by having it borrowed.

The best advice I've seen is be consistent. If you're just starting out don't wear $400 shoes, $2000 watches or $500 fountain pens. You look like a show off and lose credibilty, clients will think theres nothing behind the show.

My dad and my uncle worked together
My dad loves vintage watches and was wearing an Omega Constellation from the 60s
My uncle was wearing a Seiko Kinetic

All the guys started to kiss up to my dad like he was the boss, until he said, umh, it's him that you wanna talk to.

At the meetings I attended, everyone had a laptop with a wifi card.....pens? Whatsa pen?

-Bruce

I frequently have to go to the office of my company's VP (Finance) to get things signed. He uses slightly better-looking disposable pens (the ones that might cost as much half a bottle of ink) and one day the thing he had to sign for me ended up with not signature. In a move that reeked of frequent practice, he threw the pen cross-body into the wastebasket just behind him to the left and on the recovery put his hand over his pen caddy... empty!

I handed him my 1945 Sheaffer Valiant (a good sturdy point, no fears), keeping the cap in hand. There as a moment of appreciation, the signature, another moment, and the pen was returned. "You really have nice pens," he said, but alas has not come through to the smart side of the world. He's been handed my desk-model 51 Special several times, too, but without any lasting effect.



Smart advice. I'm lucky enough to work somewhere where I can dress my age-- the '40s. People comment on the hat more often than the pens.

Not much of a concern here either. I've been in many meetings at many levels and when you whip out the nice Esterbrook or Wearever or LAMY or what ever, there are no real reactions. As for "do they matter", they do to me and that's enough..

P.S. - nice avatar there murderface!!!! That's some good old school stuff.

I'm a commissioned officer in the Royal Air Force and always use an FP but that's just me. I don't think it is an "officer" thing - most other officers just use whatever is to hand including the ubiquitous, service-supplied BIC biros. Now that I'm retired from the service and working in civvie street, I still always use FPs. Not one other person in the company uses one except an engineer who sits right next to me. We never talk about it but I'm sure he only started to use one when he saw mine. Funny really.

Some really don't care about writing instruments but for sure they know the worth of what your writing with. What they really do care is the tie (for men) and the business attire your wearing.

In most top executive meetings, the most common sight that peeps out there shirts pockets or organisers are the white design on cap tops better known as MONTBLANC.

Yeah, for about 99% of the world "precious" is not an adjective that can precede "pen". Unless it's a Montblanc, of course, but then "precious" modifies plastic which makes more sense.

I used to work close to Burlington Arcade (upmarket olde worlde covered shopping street) in London. And, for those who know it, they will also know that there is one of the two Penfriend stores - a highly expensive modern and vintage pen shop. Stood outside there one day, two city types were about to enter. It seemed almost like an intiation as I overheard "just don't buy a Parker". Fountain pens and brand certainly mattered to those gents.

- Mark

I have been in business for about thirty years typically corporate manager / executive, and for five years Chief Information Officer. The success of an individual in the corporate environment is dependent on MANY factors. EQ, IQ, how hard you work, etc... and down the list a way is how you dress. It generally is not a maker/breaker but is part of the package. If you are a manager, the pen you use makes a difference, just like your shirt, tie, and shoes. In being successful, every facet matters, so you want to get as many right as possible. Some are easy, like dress, so you would be an idiot not to get it right. A tasteful elegant fountain pen in a younger executive shows a desire to reach a higher levels, so is a statement of intent. You need more than that to get there, but it can be helpful. If you are in sales, and ostintatous pen (like a watch) may stick out but would be more acceptable (because, you know, "their ALL like that". So there field makes a difference, if you are an engineer... you can probably get by with an Esterbrook in a pocket protector, but if you want to be the CTO or VP of Engineering, you need to move up to an OMAS Arco, if you want to show intent. If you are going for CFO then you are going the Monte Blanc --> Montegrappa route. I think in most situations, a BIC shows someone that is comfortable being an individual contributor and is not going anywhere. Overall, if you are presented with the choice of getting your Masters Degree or getting that Limited Edition Montegrappa or Monte Blanc... sorry, go for the degree. JD

My use of certain writing instruments reflects my personality, attitude and feelings. Sometimes I use a MB Limited Edition or Writers Series because it makes me feel especially good that day. Just something about writing a letter to a friend with the MB Virginia Woolf or William Faulkner. I also love writing in my journal with the Parker 51 fine point. If I am going to a meeting with extensive note taking I sometimes will use my Taccia Staccato because the the size feels good for extended times. My attitude about business is to dress for the specific occasion and my fountain pen is part of my attire. It is also about attitude. I feel good about myself when I dress well. I also feel good about myself when I use pens like a Parker Duofold True Blue LE. I honestly don't think it matters a hoot to others what pen I use so I just try to please myself in this area. /Craig

"Overall, if you are presented with the choice of getting your Masters Degree or getting that Limited Edition Montegrappa or Monte Blanc... sorry, go for the degree"

Well said JDFlood!

"I think in most situations, a BIC shows someone that is comfortable being an individual contributor and is not going anywhere." -

But I still bring a BIC red ballpoint for emergency situations.

It is the same with watches, a man showing that he has a great quality timepiece and a great pen is a man of trust. When people see my MAN 100 Patrician, I am often said to have extremely good tastes for quality items. Appearance makes the difference.

On the other hand, a man wearing a £20 quartz watch shows he has a sense of economy. A £100 FP writes better generally than a £10 one. But a £20 watch is as accurate as anything 10, 100 or 1000 times the price. An expensive watch is just jewellery.

Ray

Okay I'm getting multiple suggestions here. If I use a very nice pen I may come off as someone who just buys expensive stuff to compensate for my questionable academic abilities or if I use a very nice pen I come off as someone with an intent to someday work at a higher level so that may get me that promotion cause of the vibe I give off followed by hard work as opposed to someone who uses a BIC and works hard?

Brad

I think you should dress well, to make a good impression. In this situation, the pen is an accessory, like jewelry. So the way to pick a pen that it appropriate for work is to learn to dress.

If you dress the part, you had better deliver on your performance though. Otherwise you get labelled a wannabe or an eccentric who has an abnormal fascination with certain objects. One thing that is almost universally well received is understatement with very high quality.

Learn to dress well, then concentrate more on dealing with people and knowing your job. Sparkly baubles are just a facade that will always reveal what is underneath. You need a good facade too (ugly facts of life there), but what is behind it is what really matters in the long run.

Scott

Most people at work used to assume that my Tag Heuer was a fake because I used to have a fake one before I got the real thing. I only ever wear the one watch as well as two gold and platinum with diamond rings. The rings are both antiques and one belonged to my great aunt. I've only had one person at work comment that maybe I shouldn't wear those things to work because they're expensive. Do I care, definitely not. I'd feel undressed if I didn't wear those items and I'm not looking to be judged by them.
As for pens, people at work did tend to notice my pens, probably because of the colours on some of the vintage Conway Stewarts and people seemed to like using my Parker 51. A couple of other people at work used FPs as well. Worst moment, attending a conference on a boiling hot day and the only time my P51 has ever let me down, uncapped it and it promptly deposited most of it's ink in the notebook I was about to use

I would rather judge a man by the quality of his work and the nature in which he treats other than the clothes he wears.

I have met many who dress like they have a million dollars, yet every time they open their mouths they sound like an idiot compared to others who dress less opulent.

OLD ENGLISH PROVERB: Don't judge a man by his hat, but by the angle of his tilt"

The Romans had a similar saying that invoved the horse's mount (saddle), but I forgot

As you are a teen, just do what you like. Why care what other people do or think.

Why do what other people want you to do. Know what you want.

Well I knew that but I just really dislike it when people judge me cause of what I wear or use. In grade 11 I had a Cross townsend 14K ballpoint pen and I think my chemistry teacher really didn't like me using that pen I don't know why but I think she got a bad vibe from me cause of it. But I didn't care what she said so I used it kind of in a way to rub it in her face. I still pulled an 80.

Thanks
Brad

Shoes
$400 shoes are shoes for low key civil servant nowadays.

Good shoes cost more than 500 euros so about $800.


Watch
$2 000 watches are rather cheap too. A good steel watch cost $6 000.


Suit
And a suit at $500 is a crappy fused piece of junk which match well with a bic. A good suit costs $1 500.


Conclusion : you have no risk to look showy with $400 shoes or $2 000 watch.


Anyway, 99% of people are not capable to see the difference between $200 shoes and $800 shoes, particulary on other people's feet.

Was this person a member of the cleaning staff?

I disagree, spending that kind of money is outragous!

I tell you that you can find some excellent shoes for $100-200 USD
There are suits that look very sharp and high quality for $200-250 USD

There are great watches for around $2000 USD or less
Here's a few I thought of in 3 seconds

Omega Speedmaster (hexalite crystal)
Omega Seamaster
Rado Diastar
Rado Original
Movado 800

If I were to think for a few more i could come with a list 4 times that size.

The point is that MONEY may influence the way people look at you, but you dont have to spend thusands of dollars. A few hundred dollars can go a long way.

Also, the most important thing is WORK ETHICS and ATTITUDE. No ammount of clothes will hide a lazy bum or a rotten individual

Wearing a shirt with a pocket is a crime.

If I see a "top executive" wearing that or even a collegue, I leave the meeting on the spot and find a new job.

I don't want to work with tasteless people.

Wow, bilbok is great.

Wow, you must change jobs a lot.