Hello all,

I'm looking for something to used instead of Moleskine Large ( 13 x 21 cm (5 x 8¼") ) Lined notebook. I'm writing a lot while on the suburb train so the hard back is a must. So far I failed to find anything of that size with a hard back (like the Moleskine) with good paper quality. That size is ideal for me since it can fits my rather large coat pockets. Smaller than this I and have issues with verse not fitting on single line

Any suggestion?

Thanks you!

I use large size moleskines as well, and yes, there is some bleed through, but there are other factors that seem to compensate for it. So, am curious why are you switching?

Too much feathering and bleedthrough

I recently got a a Visconti Van Gogh. I wanted a wet F nib. The F nib to fit more words per line in the Moleskine, and the wet because my main writer (Waterman Le Man 100 M nib) was too dry for many inks, I had flow issue with some inks and others were too light (many red turns to pink ). As it is, I'm enjoying my Van Gogh a lot but I didn't get any "real estate" in my Moleskine since there is so much feathering that it write almost as wide as my Le Man and the bleedthrough is worse due to the heavier flow...

I really do like the form factor, the rigidity, the pocket and all aspect of the Moleskine... except for the paper.

Hence why I'm looking for a replacement

Considering Moleskin is marketed as a quality brand their disappointing paper quality means I just don't risk buying them anymore. Love everything else about them but the paper is inconsistent and thats not good enough for a prestige brand.

If in the US see if this will do it:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0013CDCMM
or perhaps
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000EFK3TO

UK:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000SHUE56
http://www.idealb2b.co.uk/Shop/product.php?xProd=35060
or perhaps
http://www.ryman.co.uk/Ryman-A5-Bound-Memo...-0340020540.asp
(I haven't heard of this one, Black n' Red (all the other links) seems to have well-regarded paper on FPN (search for references)).

Beware of shipping! Seek them out locally first, see if they would meet your needs. Also, if in the US, stop by a Target store and see if they have something in stock that'll meet your needs. I found something just as good as a Moleskine, but for 1/3 the price (I don't recall if they had A5 sizes like you seek, though).

Thank you! Yes A5 is what I am after.

The Black n' Red looks interesting, but I have yet to find a retailer for that brand in Montreal

I usually prefer to see paper "in the flesh" before buying through the net. Guess it's time to make a first

Talk about timely!

http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/in...showtopic=27790

A discussion of the Black n' Red and mentions that Staples carries it. If you in Canada chances are you are close to the US and hopefully check it out (I think they are US only, but their main site seems to have an international link). Also someone in that topic offered to send individual sheets off if you wanted to see paper.

I looked at the Black n' Red notebooks but they just didn't do it for me. Too High-Schoolish looking or something. I still prefer the Moleskines and just choose my ink and pen carefully. If another manufacturer had a knockoff of the Moleskines with better paper, I would buy it.

Before someone asks, I like the Moleskines because of their sedate, conservative exterior, the hardback covers, the thin, cream colored paper, the thin lines, etc.

Ron

These have been mentioned before and I just received one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...A:IT&ih=006

I like them better than R&B, personally, but I'm sticking with Moleskines for now.

Ron

I looked at these but they are soft cover

I switched from Moleskine's about three months ago to Hand*Book Journals. They have a hardbound cloth cover, an improved elastic strap, and a nifty pocket. The paper is much thicker (I'd guess 32#) but the paper is not 'slick' like the Moleskine sketch books. The paper is ivory colored and thirsty as hell. Despite the heavy weight, there is no feathering or bleedthrough. I think they create every size that Moleskine does, but I'm not sure whether they produce lined journals.

It's apparent that Handbook was trying to do just what you requested, create a better Moleskine. Handbook is manufactured and distributed by Global Art Materials, Inc.

Check out this review: http://ducly.wordpress.com/2007/03/30/handbook-journal-co/

Best of luck,

Will

There are a number of choices in the 12cm x 18cm size, but I rarely see any in the Moleskine 13cm x 21cm size. How set are you on that exact size?

Personally, I like the (slightly) smaller form factor, but it bugs me that all the notebooks are ruled so wide you could drive a truck between the lines. Why is Moleskine the only notebook with 6mm ruling? That can't be a patented feature.

Ehhh, if they'd just use decent paper, I wouldn't even look at another notebook.

I have a Moleskine knockoff I got at either Target or Walmart (both sell the brand) with the brand Markings by C.R. Gibson. It is good with xf, f, and m nibs, with noodlers and pelikan royal blue, and skrip blue black, and pelikan green. The one I have is smaller, 4 x 6, but I think I saw the larger size also. I also have a bonded leather journal by the same company, also with fp friendly paper.

The bonus is, these are very inexpensive, $4 for the small one, $8 for the bonded leather journal. Check Target and/or Walmart for these. I love mine.

Donnie

Will: Thanks I'm going to check if I can find those in Montreal. My normal handwriting is so bad that I am condemned to use lined, so I hope they do have lined version

Splicer: 3 cm shorter is not "that" big of a deal but I'd prefer A5 size. I agree 100% if only Moleskine would use better paper I wouldn't have to look either

Donnie: Thanks for the hint I'm going to check the Walmart track

What I would have really loved is to find either a Rhodia, Clairefontaine or Whiteline in A5 format with a hardcover!

Regarding the need for lined journal pages; many years ago I had a solution that worked for me. I only had access to some journals that were unlined but I also had handwriting that depended on lines for legibility. I made a lined template, the same size as the page, with fairly dark lines that fit behind the page I was writing on. The lines were faintly visable through the paper and was able to use them as a guide. I just moved the template to behind the page I was writing on. Perhaps if you can only find unlined journals that meet the rest of your requirements, this idea would work for you as well. /Craig

As long as we're dreaming, I'd like Moleskine to use ivory paper created by Clairefontaine. Oh, and I want it white gold edged. Oh, and each Moleskine should come with a free Pelikan 825 (Deep Green/Sterling Silver).

Of course, for this to happen, Pelikan would have to get off their butts and make a Pelikan 825--and then offer it in green.

Will

Hello,

I am having exactly the same dilemma as you and many others: should the paper in Moleskine notebooks be of decent quality it would not even cross my mind to switch to anything else for my notes and preparatory writing. Yet as it is basically impossible to use flexible nibs on the paper without writing through the next three pages, I am slowly switching to Clairefontaine Matris Hard Cover and Clairefontaine Age Bag notebooks (which I had used only for my personal writing until now). In my opinion Clairefontaine paper is unbeatable and the Clairefontaine Age Bag notebooks are almost as stylish as Moleskine one's. Unfortunately, this particular style is not made in hard cover version, nor with the elastic to keep it closed, nor with the very useful back pocket... What a darn pity!

Regards, Zed

Ding! I forgot all about that as I wanted a much smaller notebook (7x12x0.8 cm AKA 2 3/4 x 4 5/8 x 3/8 inch Miquelrius) but my first purchase after getting a fountain pen again was a 13 x 21 (x 1.6) cm tan suede book with pocket, ribbon, & band; from Target, "Markings by C. R. Gibson". Not real stiff covers, but plenty good. Lamy Safari EF (meaning it is really a F) with either the original cartridge or Noodler's bulletproof Black. You can write on both sides of a sheet without problems. You can tell something is written on the other side, but it is not at all disruptive. Roughly 110 pages (no, I'm not going to count! :) I forget how much, but 8 to 10 USD sounds about right.

Oh, and thin lines (that's what sold me on it). Let's see, 17 lines in 99 mm (that sounds like a metric version of <a href="http://www.lyricsondemand.com/n/nailslyrics/88linesabout44womenlyrics.html">a song</a>) about 7 1/2 mm, or 13 in 3" about .23"

JFT, have a look at the Semikolon notebooks at L'Essence du Papier (Ogilvy's, rue St-Denis, or Centre Dix30). They're actually better than the Mole, with a comparable form factor.

Hourra! Something in Montreal I'm definitively going to check these out!

Thank you very much

Had I found a Black n Red retailer in Montreal that's what I would have liked to try...

I completely agree with donwinn and excarnate, the Markings by CR Gibson notebooks are top quality. I use the leather bonded ones exclusively now. The paper is consistently good throughout the notebook, the leather gives is a bit of a more sophisticated look, and it is the same form factor as the Moleskine. Not to mention how cheap it is!

Highly recommended.

Before you abandon your Moleskine, you might try changing your ink.
I was using a Waterman Medium with Waterman ink in a cheap journal from Officemax. The line was way too thick as I write slow. So, I ordered a Fine, but I had the same problem. I finally ordered an Extra Fine, but at the same time changed to Noodler's Swishmix Eternal Nile Ebony. Beautiful line width. I haven't tried it again with the Fine nib, but am confident that I could have saved the price of the Extra Fine merely by changing inks.
I have tried this combination in a Moleskine and it jsut as good there also.
I'm pretty sure the Noodler's Swishmix (only from Swisher Pens) is available as a regular Noodler's Bulletproof ink. There are more colors than the black that I use, too.
Then you can keep the Moleskine, which seems to be the format you like.

Thanks for the advice but it is rather the other way around

I bought about 20 bottles of inks in the last month and half. I have only 2 pen moment a Waterman Le Man 100 M nib which is medium wet (but I find it too dry when I put Noodler's in) and a Visconti Van Gogh F Nib (very wet). With any Waterman or Herbin inks, which are the ones I love to use to balance the dryness in my Le Man, I get excessive feathering and bleedthrough, let's not even talk of WM or Herbin inks in my Van Gogh on Moleskine paper...

To my dismay I found my Le Man 100 a bit too dry, with a lot of skipping issues with the 4 Noodler's color I have. So I bought a wet F nib to enjoy these inks. Result: no combination that works with Moleskine. So yes I like the form factor of the Moleskine but I want to chose which pen and which color I write with I dont want the paper to chose for me A paper that tell you otherwise is badly behaved

Amazed at the variation in reports of Moleskine paper quality ...

I like A5, I like wide-ruled, I like non-slickie paper, I like hard-cover, I like a pen-loop, I like perfect-bound (square binding, not ring or folded-over like the composition book), I like creamy Clairefontaine paper, I like ... free dancing girls that come with it?

I picked up a couple of the small Wal-Mart ones a month or two ago when my wife dragged me there kicking and screaming (not my favourite shopping location, can you tell??? I love them as little `jotters`that I keep with me wherever I go. They are less than half the price of Moleskine small journals and do the same job, since they could end up being marked in by an FP, BP, gel pen, pencil, whatever is handy. However, I prefer real Moleskine for the larger journals that I use. Just really like the format and the ability to lay flat, and the paper is `good enough`that the form and functionality outstrip the occasional lack of paper consistency. The one problem with those WalMart journals is that they only come lined, but for the price, I can`t complain too much I guess...

I have two A5 Moleskine, a lined one and a squared one (which I bought by error). The lined one can't stand any FP, the squared has no problem with either, even my wet calligraphy pen (Rotring Art Pen) doesn't bleedthrough using Herbin inks. I also have a smaller notepad which is ok with both the Le Man and the Van Gogh. The problem is the consistency

It seems that asking for a lined A5 with hardcover and good paper is too much. Why doesn't Rhodia and Clairefontaine make that? (Or Whitelines since we're dreaming ) The elastic band and the pocket (and the dancing girl ) may be nice but I dont mind losing that if I get good and consistent paper.

Try this thread

Moleskine like pad with Rhodia paper - possibly

Thanks a lot These pads seem very interesting indeed!

I can also vote for Markings by C R Gibson. I found one at Staples for $6 and took a chance on it. I normally use Clairefontaine 3.5" x 5.5" for my pocket journal/notebook. But the Gibson has a Moleskinesque closure and pocket in the back. (Moleskine paper I found makes my nice nibs look like a sharpie.) My Sailor Sapporo with medium left oblique cursive italic nib produces the line it's supposed to. The paper is a tad thin so there's a wee bit of bleed through visible, but not too bad. Nice orange cover too. Try one out.

I am using the levenger Junior instead- roughly the same size; it is quite lovely, the paper is pleasant, and it is awesome because you can rearrange the paper however you like.

This past weekend at Shopko (a midwestern discount chain) I found one of the smaller "Markings with CR Gibson" bonded leather books with Grid Paper. I haven't started using it yet (I'm finishing out a Moleskine reporter), but preliminary tests are very positive.

Steve

And I found a larger one with grid paper at Target! I took some cellphone pictures...the one with the UPCs is too blurry, but the one below has my pocketsized moleskine (brand) grid notebook on top for scale and comparison. FWIW my Moleskine works fine and I got it for ~$11 (at Books-A-Million), but my larger notebook is the Markings by C.R. Gibson and my future notebooks are likely to be as well ($9 for the larger sized!). Although the tone of the paper is hard to capture in the lighting of the store with a cellphone camera, the colored tabs in my moleskine look right. As you can see, everything lays pretty flat (I tried not to bend the store copies too much!), the grids are similar, the paper in the larger lined one is whiter but not blinding, the lines are nice and narrow. The Moleskine is a bit stiffer, but the Markings are pretty stiff and would work well writing unsupported. They all have a nice pocket in the back and a decent flexible band and bookmark ribbon. I haven't had either the Moleskine or the Markings long enough to judge their durability, but they both seem fine (and equivalent), unlike the poor abused Miquel Rius mini-pocket.
Click to view attachment

im also very interested in a reasonable priced moleskine alternative.. did anyone ever had a notebook pocket size from paperblanks? they are a moleskine knockoff, just dont kno what the paper's like.

Greetings
Martin

Well I'm just tickled! The other day, before I decided I wanted a fountain pen, I was at target and got a Markings journal so that I might be encouraged to start up journaling. I'd been fretting that it might not go well with the noolder's ink I had ordered, but judging from the comments here it should be great! What a stroke of luck.

BTW, I got it because of the narrow lines, the wonderfully sedate look, and because it was there and inexpensive! The elastic, pocket, and ribbon are a bonus, they're nifty.

Thanks to all who responded.

I have ordered some Rhodia Webnotebook that I hope will fill the bill!

http://www.bloc-rhodia.fr/Rhodia-BOUTIQUE/...otebook-A5.html

Here's a review I found of this new product:
http://www.blackcover.net/?p=20

I can't wait to get mine!

I have a couple and they are not particularly FP friendly. As they have not used their standard paper but opted to try and copy Moleskin with an ivroy paper, it is not to their usual standard. Beware and don't buy more than one until you have tested them with your FP and ink combination. I was very disappointed.

Oh Thank you for the warning... I was hoping so much that they would be FP friendly ...

Are they equivalent to Moleskine or slightly better in your experience?

Oh no.....

This is the most depressing news I have read in a long time.... Rhodia is now selling non-fountain-pen-friendly paper????

I am a devoted Rhodia and Clairefontaine user going as far as importing my needs and copping the freight such is my love of quality paper. This is the only example I have found where Rhodia have compromised their quality so don't let it deter you from ordering their usual products. I think they have focussed too much on trying to emulate Moleskin's ivory paper rather than creating their own book.
I hope they see the error of their ways and churn them out with the standard paper grade, even if it meant less pages.
I stress again the feathering and bleed is not as bad as Moleskin and maybe your pen/ink combination will be ok. Just be careful with your original order until you have tested them.

I just revised - or rather, followed up on my original Quo Vadis Habana review with an updated post. This could be a possibility.