I'm reading rave reviews on the Pelikan M200. I'm just wondering if the Extra Fine nib runs wide or thin? And may I ask anyone who has this pen to post some pictures. I've googled and found some pictures, but there's a lot of different ones. But some are made out of plastic, which I didn't think expensive pens would be made of this material.

As a Pelikan retailer who also happens to be a nib guy, I don't customarily handle Pelikan's EF nibs because they're inconsistent. Steel ones (M150, M200) can be too wide or too narrow, too wet or too dry, scratchy, or any of the possible combinations of these. Gold ones can also have pretty much any of these problems, and even when they're perfect (which is virtually all of the time) they're still wrong because they're made by grinding a fine nib narrower without regard to the depth of the iridium ball, and the result is a nib that draws its dimensionally correct stroke up and down but draws a broader stroke sideways, sort of like an Arabic/Hebrew italic. When one of my clients inquires about an extra-fine nib for a Pelikan, I generally explain this and offer to regrind a fine nib to the proper configuration. It costs more, but the result is far more satisfactory to me -- and to my clients.

I thought a Pelikan had a premade EF nib from Pelikan that didn't have to be grinded by anyone. At any rate, how does the Fine nib run? Is it on the wide side as well? If so, this pen is out of the question. I like very fine points

As I said, Pelikan does make EF nibs. I don't normally handle them, as I explained. If you want an M200 with a factory-stock EF nib, you can get one. I'll even sell it to you, and I'll work on the nib before you get the pen to make the nib as right as I can.

Pelikan's F nibs are much more consistent than the EFs. I adjust them, too, before shipping them, but they never need as much work as the EFs.

The M200 pen itself is a superb pen. I have 13 of them that I carry with me to shows as nib demonstrators. These pens are handled by everyone who wants to try out the nibs; they go through a lot. I've had most of them for more than three years now, and the number of these pens that have failed in use can be counted on the thumbs of one foot. FWIW, the M200 is mechanically identical to the M250; the only difference is in the choice of barrel colors and in the nib, which is interchangeable. You can put an M250 nib (14K) into an M200, or an M200 nib (steel) into an M250. Or any other M2xx, M4xx, or M6xx Pelikan.

Richard: Are the M100 and the M150 nibs interchangeable?

In my opinion, Pelikan fine nibs are fine-mediums and the EF is a true fine or perhaps just a bit thinner. Here's a scan so you can judge for yourself:

Thanks Southpaw for the sample writing. It still looks kinda thick or am I being unreasonable?

I think I might have to look at Japanese pens to get the fine point I want. Can someone please point me to a site that sells nice but afforable japanese fountain pens from Sailor or another company? I don't want fat pens though. I seem to see a lot of the fancier pens pretty fat. I like the thin pens.


Thanks!

If you have Richard modify a Pelikan fine, I think you'll be happy. No matter how good a factory nib is, it can't compare to one that is adjusted not only for the nib width you want but to take into account the way you hold a pen.

Richard didn't pay me to say this but the nibs he has reshaped for me are far better than even the most expensive factory nib I have.

Might be a bit thick for an EF, but it's really close to what a true F should be.

If you want a true EF, then you can't go wrong with ordering a custom nib from Richard (no affiliation, just a happy repeat customer). You can order your M200/250 in the color of your choice, pick the nib(s) you want, and he'll get it to you. It's the best way to be sure you get what you want. You could even grab a stub or two while you're at it.

Likely to give you the most satisfaction for the $.

Let us know what you decide.

Yes, they are. The M100 and M150 pens themselves are identical except for the body color and the finish on the nib and furniture. Here's an M100, with unplated nib and white metal furniture.



And here's an M150, with plated nib and gold-plated furniture. (Despite the hot spot on the M150's clip, the clip really is gold plated all over. )

Good shot, SP. Is that a scan or a photo with the new camera?

Moppie: What you want, I think, is a Binder ground EF. That will be a true EF and conform to the line width that he sets forth at his web site. I think SPs sample was done with a Pelican factory EF which won't be as fine as Richard's. Richard is one of only a few premier nibmeisters in this country and he can grind it thinner than you care to write with, notwithstanding your professed passion for thin line widths. He'll go right to a needle point if you wish, but I'll guarantee that you do not want to go that far.

Go to his website and do some serious browsing. It is one of the most informative pen sites on the Internet, particularly for a newbie.

Thanks for that, Richard. The green M100 you show is exactly the one I have. Just got it recently from a fellow FPNer. It has the F steel nib ground by you to a stub. I absolutely love the F stub and the pen, too! Now, I know that I can add M150 nibs to it.

My seller thought he had heard that the green M100 was made for the Italian market and not normally shipped to the US. Does that jive with your knowledge?

Roger, it's a scan.

most pens are made of plastic with the exception of Ebonite (hard rubber) and metal pens. Now... what kind of plastic? That's where things differ. M400 and better series pens are Celluloid Acetate (CA). M200s are... well, not sure what the exact plastic is but I imagine someone here is. Many new pens are made of Acrylic - which is just another plastic but allows for some really stunning colors and patterns.

Celluloid Acetate pens are probably the most common on the high end and run at higher prices than acrylics and cheaper plastics. But all of them are solid and very well made. Depending on how the celluloid is shaped or layered (in Pelikan Souveran series, makes the pen striped) the cost will be impacted.

To my hand, little feels as comfortable and "warm" to my hand as Celluloid (either CA or CN*). I have no Ebonite pens but I'm sure I will someday. Metal doesn't do anything for me.

Designing a lightweight but quality pen like the 200/400 series can actually be more of a challenge than a hefty pen made of acrylic or laquered brass. That's why so many of the cheap pens out there are laquered brass. Sure they feel hefty and solid, but this doesn't equal quality. "Pierre Cardin" does it all the time for $10 at Office Depot.

That said - it has to be totally what appeals to you and if a light pen feels uncomfortable or "cheap" then that's what matters. You should, however, be open to something like the 200 in the future. many folks get very fatigued holding a heavy pen for a significant period of time (for me that's oh... one page of my small handwriting). As Richard points out, the 200 is an excellent pen. for a bit more you can get the 400 which is ever so slightly heavier and is made of CA plastic. Either one can take nib exchanges until you just get tired of trying different nibs.

I like the steel EF from Pelikan. But it is less forgiving (toothier) than their Fines and up. The gold EF from Pelikan is more of a fine IMO.

The Namiki VP fine I own is an EF and yup, this is a Japanese pen so... that's not surprising. However, if you really want something ultra fine, then I agree with others that a nibmeister can grind one for you that will be like writing with spider webbing.

the namiki VP is laquered brass btb, but of such a unique design and high quality that it deserves it's price (about $70-$80 most places).

check out this page - scroll down and you'll see a not-so-great scan of some of my pens. The red and blue stripe are 400s and I don't actually own the red. I have a couple of additions to my flock in the last year or so. The White Tortoise you see in my Avatar and now my 620 Piazza Navona shown in the pictures forum.

http://www.ghg.net/schwerpt/kcspages/collect.ht

*Celluloid Nitrate - once commonly used in FPs but the material is quite flammable. The beautiful green pen on the above web page is made of CN. Some modern pen manufacturers still use CN and it is a beautiful material. just a bit risky to produce. I've heard of repair persons (or repair person wannabes) setting fire to a pen when using flame to try to remove sections or such.

Please - Richard or other expert - feel free to set me straight on my explanation of plastics.

Yes, that's correct. There were green and red M100s made for Italy, neither of which was ever officially offered in the USA, even when SRW was repping Pelikan.

My first real fountain pen was a Pelikan M200 with an extra fine nib. I lucked out, I guess: mine wrote smoothly, and the replacement pen I bought continues to write smoothly after a dozen years.

On the other hand, I now have a Binderized XXXF nib, and I have to say that that is much smoother, and gives me exactly the sort of slender, spiderwebby sort of of smooth lines that I need for my peculiar handwriting.

My suggestion would be to get one from Richard Binder (this is a completely unsolicited plug, and with nothing against other vendors and nibmeisters (or nibmeisters-in-training) who are out there -- it's just that I've gotten lovely nibs from Richard), with a customized nib.

(And, if you've not looked around at many posts here, there are several people who can customize nibs nicely, including Richard and Dillon.)

Hi KCat,

Oh, no way do I want a heavy pen at all! I hate those kind of pens. But when I saw the Pelikans, it just reminded me of those copycat "City" pens that I see selling at airports with the lanyard.

I might go take a further look at Pelikan today along with the Lamy Studio and Pilot Knight

B

Velma,

Do you have a picture of the Binderized XXXF pen? I love fine fine points!

Thanks, Richard.

BTW, I see Barbara posting over on the GB last day or two. That appears to be a great sign. We all hope that her recovery has begun in earnest after the fall. Just remember you can't be sending her out for pizza, right now...let 'em deliver it

Barbara's doing quite well, thanks. She has a walker and a wheelchair and, for when she needs to get out of the house, crutches. Crutches? Steps? Granite steps?? Well, yeah, it's that or house arrest.

As for pizza, we just dial "eight-eight-nine, eight-eight-ten" (889-8810) for Seven Star, and they're quite happy to deliver. I'm sorry this won't work in other cities, but I assume y'all have your own favorite pizza places, anyway.

Just to keep this reply on topic, I'll mention in passing that the M150 is available in the USA only in black. Officially, at least. :ph34r:

Oh, and...



A Binderized XXXF Pelikan looks pretty much like an ordinary Pelikan, until you use a loupe on the nib or write with it. Here's the exemplar Antonios made for me with one of my XXXF nibs (1.5X actual size):



This crummy low-res scan doesn't do the nib justice; one pixel is wider than the 0.2-mm stroke of the nib. You can download an actual-size 300-dpi PDF copy of the scan from my site.

Just a quick note that there is an "m" missing at the end of the URL above, so clicking on the link doesn't work.

This is the correct URL: http://www.ghg.net/schwerpt/kcspages/collect.htm

(oh and I think your photos are really nice, KCat )