I just finished my first repair on an Eagle pen, using a variety of parts. Da Book said that clear fingernail polish was a good adhesive for the sac, which I used successfully for this first repair.
I note, however, that most other articles online say use orange shellac. What's the downside to using clear nail polish?
Full Version: Sac adhesive
This question has been asked and answered several times in the Repair Q&A forum. Here is one answer I posted in one of those threads.
The best thing about the nail polish is the bottle. Dump out the polish and rinse it out with Acetone. Let it dry and fill it with orange shellac - Wallah! the best of both worlds. Shellac in a neat bottle with an applicator. Questions?
Shellac's good stuff, and it's not that expensive.
Ideally, get the flakes so you can mix it (with alcohol) in small batches. I normally use Ron Hock's, but that's spendier than most available. That said, it has no wax (most does). Many woodworking stores have the flake form.
If you're getting a liquid form, try not to get more than you'll use in six months to a year.
Ideally, get the flakes so you can mix it (with alcohol) in small batches. I normally use Ron Hock's, but that's spendier than most available. That said, it has no wax (most does). Many woodworking stores have the flake form.
If you're getting a liquid form, try not to get more than you'll use in six months to a year.
QUOTE(Deirdre @ Jan 8 2008, 04:58 PM) [snapback]472071[/snapback]
Shellac's good stuff, and it's not that expensive.
If you're getting a liquid form, try not to get more than you'll use in six months to a year.
If you're getting a liquid form, try not to get more than you'll use in six months to a year.
When I first started working on pens, I went to the lumberyard to buy some shellac. The smallest can they had was a quart. If the stuff hadn't gone bad, I'd have had a lifetime supply! I'll try to find some flakes - although the pint I have now will last awhile.
QUOTE(Kelly G @ Jan 8 2008, 06:02 PM) [snapback]472077[/snapback]
QUOTE(Deirdre @ Jan 8 2008, 04:58 PM) [snapback]472071[/snapback]
Shellac's good stuff, and it's not that expensive.
If you're getting a liquid form, try not to get more than you'll use in six months to a year.
If you're getting a liquid form, try not to get more than you'll use in six months to a year.
When I first started working on pens, I went to the lumberyard to buy some shellac. The smallest can they had was a quart. If the stuff hadn't gone bad, I'd have had a lifetime supply! I'll try to find some flakes - although the pint I have now will last awhile.
I'm going to toss my 2 cents in here about buying sac cement (shellac)
You can purchase enough sac cement to do a whole load of pens (If you are not doing them professionally for a lot of people) for an average price of about $5.00.
Is it really worth it to purchase a load of shellac flakes and denatured alcohol to make a couple of lifetimes supply of shellac, unless you are also a woodworker and using it for finishing.
Here is a list of suppliers... in no special order....
Tryphon
Woodbin for our Canadian friends
Pendemonium
Fountain Pen Hospital
Personally, I see no reason to go to all the extra expense and hassle to make your own sac cement when it is readily available for the same people you are probably buying your sacs from.....
A half pint can of Zinsser orange or clear shellac is $5 or less at most True Value or Ace hardware stores. Zinsser says that the shellac is good for 3 years from the date of manufacture, which is on a lable on the bottom of the can.
If you don't want a half pint can sitting around, buy Giovanni's. Excellent adhesion, especially for silicone sacs.
If you don't want a half pint can sitting around, buy Giovanni's. Excellent adhesion, especially for silicone sacs.
QUOTE(OldGriz @ Jan 8 2008, 03:19 PM) [snapback]472093[/snapback]
I'm going to toss my 2 cents in here about buying sac cement (shellac)
You can purchase enough sac cement to do a whole load of pens (If you are not doing them professionally for a lot of people) for an average price of about $5.00.
Is it really worth it to purchase a load of shellac flakes and denatured alcohol to make a couple of lifetimes supply of shellac, unless you are also a woodworker and using it for finishing.
You can purchase enough sac cement to do a whole load of pens (If you are not doing them professionally for a lot of people) for an average price of about $5.00.
Is it really worth it to purchase a load of shellac flakes and denatured alcohol to make a couple of lifetimes supply of shellac, unless you are also a woodworker and using it for finishing.
I am also a woodworker and also use it for finishing.
(It's sad, but I just sold one of my prized handplanes so I could have more pens.)
First of all, what IS fingernail polish? Is it the same stuff as the fingernail polish that was available when Da Book was written? Last time I saw anything describing fingernail polish, it was called "lacquer." If lacquer works and shellac works, how about varnish or enamel or rubber cement or contact cement or Gorilla Glue or . . .????
I have a book written during WWII that tells how to make lacquer out of acetone and old toothbrush handles. That recipe may have worked back in the day, but it doesn't work any more!
Shellac works and we can still buy the shellac that was available eons ago.
I use shellac made-up less than six months before use. The last pen I bought had an dodgy sac. I decided to glue the new one in place with the shellac I made about eight months previously, in the depths of a hot summer (I write the date on the bottle's label). The shellac had turned into a substance resembling gelatin. Shucks, gotta make a new batch! I am using denatured alcohol as a solvent. "Internet Wisdom" states that shellac reacts slowly with alcohol to make a compound that won't dry, and to never keep any liquid shellac more than six months. If someone has made a solvent that will keep shellac usable longer than that, that's a good thing!
I reckon I have enough flake shellac to last me another 100 years (I had to buy a pound), at the present rate of consumption of 70 grains per year.
Paddler
edit: English: whut it done fer me.
I have a book written during WWII that tells how to make lacquer out of acetone and old toothbrush handles. That recipe may have worked back in the day, but it doesn't work any more!
Shellac works and we can still buy the shellac that was available eons ago.
I use shellac made-up less than six months before use. The last pen I bought had an dodgy sac. I decided to glue the new one in place with the shellac I made about eight months previously, in the depths of a hot summer (I write the date on the bottle's label). The shellac had turned into a substance resembling gelatin. Shucks, gotta make a new batch! I am using denatured alcohol as a solvent. "Internet Wisdom" states that shellac reacts slowly with alcohol to make a compound that won't dry, and to never keep any liquid shellac more than six months. If someone has made a solvent that will keep shellac usable longer than that, that's a good thing!
I reckon I have enough flake shellac to last me another 100 years (I had to buy a pound), at the present rate of consumption of 70 grains per year.
Paddler
edit: English: whut it done fer me.
" Understanding Wood Finishing " by Flexner explains the terrible misuse of nomenclature which is utilized by manufacturer's of the sorts of products referred to in this post. Examples ... Tung Oil does not have to have tung oil in it... Boiled linseed oil is not boiled... metallic dryers are added instead... the book is full of ' myth buster' boxes identified in easily read format. Highly recommended. Greg
Apparently Giovanni's formula solves the problem:
Special Sac Cement: This is my specially formulated sac cement. It is a blend of different ratios of extremely pure orange shellac and blonde shellac. The concentration is optimal for pen repair work. This premium sac cement dries quickly, gives superb adhesion (I use it even with silicone sacs) and has a shelf life in excess of 10 years. Excess sac cement can be removed with a cloth moistened in alcohol. As used by the world's best pen repairers. Compare our standard bottle vs. a competitive product. Now available in three sizes: Economy (¼ oz), Standard and Extra Large (for professional repairers)
see: http://www.tryphon.it
The acetone in fingernail polish is very unheathy for most pens. OIther solvents can be harmful too. Pen repair technology has progressed quite a bit since Da Book was written...
Special Sac Cement: This is my specially formulated sac cement. It is a blend of different ratios of extremely pure orange shellac and blonde shellac. The concentration is optimal for pen repair work. This premium sac cement dries quickly, gives superb adhesion (I use it even with silicone sacs) and has a shelf life in excess of 10 years. Excess sac cement can be removed with a cloth moistened in alcohol. As used by the world's best pen repairers. Compare our standard bottle vs. a competitive product. Now available in three sizes: Economy (¼ oz), Standard and Extra Large (for professional repairers)
see: http://www.tryphon.it
The acetone in fingernail polish is very unheathy for most pens. OIther solvents can be harmful too. Pen repair technology has progressed quite a bit since Da Book was written...
QUOTE(Paddler @ Jan 9 2008, 04:06 AM) [snapback]472397[/snapback]
First of all, what IS fingernail polish? Is it the same stuff as the fingernail polish that was available when Da Book was written? Last time I saw anything describing fingernail polish, it was called "lacquer." If lacquer works and shellac works, how about varnish or enamel or rubber cement or contact cement or Gorilla Glue or . . .????
I have a book written during WWII that tells how to make lacquer out of acetone and old toothbrush handles. That recipe may have worked back in the day, but it doesn't work any more!
Shellac works and we can still buy the shellac that was available eons ago.
I use shellac made-up less than six months before use. The last pen I bought had an dodgy sac. I decided to glue the new one in place with the shellac I made about eight months previously, in the depths of a hot summer (I write the date on the bottle's label). The shellac had turned into a substance resembling gelatin. Shucks, gotta make a new batch! I am using denatured alcohol as a solvent. "Internet Wisdom" states that shellac reacts slowly with alcohol to make a compound that won't dry, and to never keep any liquid shellac more than six months. If someone has made a solvent that will keep shellac usable longer than that, that's a good thing!
I reckon I have enough flake shellac to last me another 100 years (I had to buy a pound), at the present rate of consumption of 70 grains per year.
Paddler
edit: English: whut it done fer me.
I have a book written during WWII that tells how to make lacquer out of acetone and old toothbrush handles. That recipe may have worked back in the day, but it doesn't work any more!
Shellac works and we can still buy the shellac that was available eons ago.
I use shellac made-up less than six months before use. The last pen I bought had an dodgy sac. I decided to glue the new one in place with the shellac I made about eight months previously, in the depths of a hot summer (I write the date on the bottle's label). The shellac had turned into a substance resembling gelatin. Shucks, gotta make a new batch! I am using denatured alcohol as a solvent. "Internet Wisdom" states that shellac reacts slowly with alcohol to make a compound that won't dry, and to never keep any liquid shellac more than six months. If someone has made a solvent that will keep shellac usable longer than that, that's a good thing!
I reckon I have enough flake shellac to last me another 100 years (I had to buy a pound), at the present rate of consumption of 70 grains per year.
Paddler
edit: English: whut it done fer me.
QUOTE(penburg @ Jan 8 2008, 04:16 PM) [snapback]472030[/snapback]
I just finished my first repair on an Eagle pen, using a variety of parts. Da Book said that clear fingernail polish was a good adhesive for the sac, which I used successfully for this first repair.
I note, however, that most other articles online say use orange shellac. What's the downside to using clear nail polish?
I note, however, that most other articles online say use orange shellac. What's the downside to using clear nail polish?
I have a Swan leverless pen that I resaced about a year or so ago, and it always dripped ink off the nib, I resaced it several times and it still dripped. I recently saced it again and this time I used shellac instead of the fingernail polish I had been using (as it turned out from my records) only on the Swan. No drip. The shellac simply works better at sealing, it also is much less likely to harm the plastics, or hard rubber, of the pen.
It is also pretty damned cheap to buy, I got the little bottle that looks just like the fingernail polish bottle from, I think, Pendemonium when I ordered some other supplies. (Might have been Woodbin, but not sure.)
Why did I use fingernail polish at first, I read Da Book and I did not want to wait a few days for the right stuff. Why do I use shellac now, it actually works.
QUOTE(HLeopold @ Jan 9 2008, 10:37 AM) [snapback]472758[/snapback]
QUOTE(penburg @ Jan 8 2008, 04:16 PM) [snapback]472030[/snapback]
I just finished my first repair on an Eagle pen, using a variety of parts. Da Book said that clear fingernail polish was a good adhesive for the sac, which I used successfully for this first repair.
I note, however, that most other articles online say use orange shellac. What's the downside to using clear nail polish?
I note, however, that most other articles online say use orange shellac. What's the downside to using clear nail polish?
I have a Swan leverless pen that I resaced about a year or so ago, and it always dripped ink off the nib, I resaced it several times and it still dripped. I recently saced it again and this time I used shellac instead of the fingernail polish I had been using (as it turned out from my records) only on the Swan. No drip. The shellac simply works better at sealing, it also is much less likely to harm the plastics, or hard rubber, of the pen.
It is also pretty damned cheap to buy, I got the little bottle that looks just like the fingernail polish bottle from, I think, Pendemonium when I ordered some other supplies. (Might have been Woodbin, but not sure.)
Why did I use fingernail polish at first, I read Da Book and I did not want to wait a few days for the right stuff. Why do I use shellac now, it actually works.
Thanks, that's most helpful. I've just bought a pint of orange shellac.
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