I am confused. Are the two Drake models (sterling and vermeil) both limited editions? Or is only the vermeil a limited edition? And how many pieces of each is produced?

I am also confused about the $600 price difference between the vermeil and the white sterling. Is this big difference due to one being more \'limited\' than the other?

Thank you.

I think the difference is due to the price of gold.

A few microns of gold shouldn\'t make such a difference. I could understand if it was gold filled, but not electroplated.

It could also be that they wanted to run the gold plate up into a higher market niche. I've noticed that over the last decade more makers have been pushing into the $1,000+ niche.

I object to paying money for a manufacturer's desire to position a pen upmarket and to accomplish that, they simply raise the price.

Look at Visconti and their Divine Proportion. They priced it at the magic number - $1618, regardless of what it actually cost to produce (I'm sure the actual cost wasn't insubstantial, but coincidentally arriving at that number? No way).

With the Drake, a few microns of plated gold do NOT cost $600, and I don't they'd tell you that they did.

I can take a pretty close guess at what they do cost - around $100. I say that because the new Classic Pens ZJ1, a larger pen than the Drake, charged $100 more for their pen when they are gold plated, and I doubt they do that (in fact I know that they do NOT do that) too lose money.

The conclusion is that it costs CS around $100 to take the Drake and plate it....and then they place a surcharge of another $500 because hey - it is gold, so it has to be worth more, right?

Bill,

You are 100% correct. I have handled a Drake Vermeil and the gold seem kind of grey in colour, which tells me that it is pretty thin plating. Good gold plating should show the gold as yellow - not greyish (vermeil) or reddish (gold plated copper). It\'s a shame because the white sterling version is a really nice pen, with a good heft. I now know which one I\'ll go for.

It would take less than $5.00 worth of gold, at $800.00 per ounce to plate the pen.

A quick look at Mary's site show that the Vermeil edition is indeed limited to 100, so that probably explains the price difference. Btwy, the $600 difference is for the MSRP, and the actual street price MSRP may be less.

Hi There,

The Drake is available in a choice of two finishes; Sterling silver as a regular edition and Vermeil limited to 100 pieces.



The difference in price includes the cost of manufacturing, shipping costs to the goldsmiths for plating, assembly costs, and then shipping costs to the US. I don't know if you are all aware here, but Conway Stewart pays for all the shipping, customs and duties to the US retailers and this does add to the o/heads when producing a pen. Many times retailers have to bear these costs when purchasing pens outside the country and this is an added service offered to support the trade.

I do not know the amount of gold used to vermeil this pen, but please take into consideration when you compare prices with other manufacturers/boutique names that Conway Stewart has to factor in the above expenses along with the 100 YEAR GUARANTEE OF WORKMANSHIP which other companies do not offer. This alone should give a great sense of comfort when purchasing a Conway Stewart vermeil pen as I am sure many of you have seen vermeil pens where the plating is wearing through. The Conway Stewart precious metal pens all bear a British Assay Hallmark which is similar to a Government Seal of quality authenticating the precious metals and purification, whereby pens that are not hallmarked can be made of many different metals regardless of what the sales information states. This procedure in England was designed and developed to protect the consumers.

Personally, I feel the Vermeil Drake is very good looking and as I said earlier, I love the way the front section and nib follows through in the similar colour of gold. I have a 149 pinstripe Vermeil, and a few engraved 146 f/pens in vermeil and feel that by having a black section breaks up the design flow of a vermeil pen.

Kind regards,

Mary Burke

So the $100 charged by Classic is probably fair, given the additional stages the pens have to go through - ship to plater, plating and the fee they pay for that and shipping back.



Well obviously the answer to the original question is that the difference in price is based on $100 for the actual plating and $500 (or whatever lesser amount you are able to get from discounted sellers) fo the warm feeling some people get from knowing that they own something that 'only' 99 other people in the world also own. And who can fault them - they wouldn't do it if they weren't pretty sure, based on previous editions, that there were that many people with that particular mental quirk that felt that sort of premium was worth it to them.

Now wait for the depleted uranium version, made in an edition of one pen only, for $10,000 (comes in a 100 lb. lead case with a viewing window). And if you think I am kidding, you'd be only half right. If someone built something like that, my bet is that someone would buy the damned thing.

PS - Mary - I agree with having the section and barrel the same colour. I also prefer the sterling pens (like the Drake) that have silver top and bottom caps, not black plastic.

Yes, this is the way LEs are done, by all brands, not just CS. And yes, there are LEs that go even beyond a depleted uranium version, such as the Krones with Lincoln's DNA. This LE Drake has nothing that makes it stand out as quirky as far as the practice of making LEs goes.

Hi,

I am not going to get into a price war match, but you do have to realize that Classic Pens is a boutique name with three employees of which two are the owners. They are based in an apartment rented in Los Angeles and everything is out sourced.

Conway Stewart is a pen manufacturer, has more than 35 employees, machines on site with manufacturing overheads. You would be amazed the cost for all the machines in the factory as well as training for employees on the assembly line etc. It is also a company that is based outside the US, pays for all o/heads to get the pens to the customers, abides by UK and US laws and then gives a 100 year guarantee of workmanship to all their pens.

It is very wrong to compare a boutique name and a pen manufacturer on prices. Not only are the overheads very different, but the complete company set up is very different as well. Now I understand if you are comparing the cost of you personally gold plating a pen, but when you have the liabilities that a pen manufacturer has, the price to gold plate is not going to be the same for obvious reasons.

If you have the time and can make a trip to Devon, please let me know and I will happily arrange a personalized tour of the Conway Stewart pen factory and you will be able to watch a pen being made from start to finish.

Regards,

Mary Burke.

I understand - particularly the problem of wear on the threading of the barrel if the vermeil pens are actually used to any great degree. Thin electroplating on the vertices of the threaded portion will be particularly prone to wear. Fortunately I don't expect that too many claims on the warranty would result as these pens aren't too likely to see daily use (the sterling version would be a better choice for 'users').

Other vemeil pens like the Parker 75 don't have as much problem as they are snap fit caps rather than threaded caps, but I have seen a fair bit of wear through the plating on well used examples of that pen on the barrel body.

Well, that is when the 100 YEAR guarantee and warranty comes in handy for the customer

I tend to agree with Mary regarding the overheads, but the UK price of the pen is no cheaper than the US one, so it seems that all CS customers (including UK ones) are subsidising the cost of shipping and distributing these pens around the world.