Netnemo
Mar 27 2007, 09:28 AM
Hi to all,
I was wondering about the opinions around ink bottle shapes and their real usefullness, beyond the shape appreciation.
In another thread I inserted also the Stipula Netto in the list, but it is a Capillary System to be applied on the top of a bottle, not a one piece bottle, so here is not included.
The list above is an abstract from various ink seller around the web.
IMO, best solution is Stipula Netto at home only, and Visconti travelling inkpot both at home and travelling. And I normally use the last one.
Here I chose, internal conical systems because I think it is the best way to use nearly the last drop of ink in the bottle.
Of course using the converter directly, all bottles have the same usefullness but it is not the subject of this poll.
Kees
Mar 27 2007, 11:23 AM
IMO, by far the most functional ink bottles are those with a separate ink well inside, the pre-Slovenian Sheaffer Skrip type. By turning them upside down you can use the ink almost to the last drop, and the procedure of filling the pen is pretty clean, in comparison.
One problem: The poll doesn’t seem to take this kind of bottle into account...
Netnemo
Mar 27 2007, 11:53 AM
| QUOTE (Kees @ Mar 27 2007, 12:23 PM) |
IMO, by far the most functional ink bottles are those with a separate ink well inside, the pre-Slovenian Sheaffer Skrip type. By turning them upside down you can use the ink almost to the last drop, and the procedure of filling the pen is pretty clean, in comparison.
One problem: The poll doesn’t seem to take this kind of bottle into account... |
The first kind, of course, include also the ink bottles you mean, because internal conical shape has internal ink well due of that internal shape. Also MB for example needs a turning when you finish the ink in the little inkwell inside. So I summed all internal inkwells and internal conical shapes in one category because they both can permit to use nearly the last drop.
Edited to correct some typos.
Kees
Mar 27 2007, 11:57 AM
Thanks for making it possible for me to vote!
(Not being a pro ink bottler, I was puzzled a bit by your description...)
FrankB
Mar 27 2007, 02:28 PM
I voted Internal Conical Systems, but I agree with Kees. Those old Sheaffer bottles were the best.
sheafferkid
Mar 27 2007, 10:16 PM
Definitely internal conical systems. I LOVE the Sheaffer's bottle. Its INGENIOUS! Already, its getting harder and harder to fill my pens with the Noodler's bottle. Pretty soon I will just pour the rest of the Noodler's into my empty Sheaffer's bottle.
Evan
johnr55
Mar 28 2007, 12:43 AM
The ink manufacturers remind me of perfume manufacturers. Shame the Slovenians didn't take Sheaffer's great internal inkwell with them. As I frequently fill with syringes, the bottle shape doesn't matter to me. Except that the short, fat ones are harder to store.
RLTodd
Mar 28 2007, 03:08 AM
| QUOTE (johnr55 @ Mar 27 2007, 04:43 PM) |
| Shame the Slovenians didn't take Sheaffer's great internal inkwell with them. |
I am pretty sure it was not economically feasable to tool up t make the inkwell bottle. The things are so well liked I am quite sure that if anyone could get a reasonable return on the setting up cost they would have done it by now.
Mr. Tardiff has a famous (for us) statement on why Noodlers had to end up in the bottles he uses so it could meet the target price point.
Ray-Vigo
Mar 28 2007, 03:15 AM
Diamine makes the best looking ink bottle- old style. But the most functional- I've found- to be a Waterman-style where you can just tip it on its side and get the last of the ink out. It's not as nice looking, but it does the job.
Cloud
Mar 28 2007, 04:08 AM
I adore the Montblanc bottles. V shaped area to fill the pen. The cap closes well.
They are the only one which accounts for pens with BIG nibs. Aka Visconti, Montlanc, Danitrio...
Second would be Lamy bottles. Nice design but again the pocket isn't deep enough.
I absolutely HATE the sheaffer bottles with the V. It's good if you are using a dip pen of a ''hooded nib'' Most of my nibs are too long to fit correctly and thus render the pocket in the way to actually fill the pen.
Viseguy
Mar 28 2007, 04:25 AM
I'm not familiar with all the varieties of bottles, so my choice is based on those I know. My vote went to the Waterman/OMAS type, which can be tipped on its side when the ink level is low. But I also find the Levenger bottle, with its plastic insert, to be quite clever and convenient.
Of course, virtually any bottle can be tipped to a convenient angle with the help of a vise -- my preferred method of filling, as you know (or can imagine).
Netnemo
Mar 28 2007, 11:35 AM
| QUOTE (Viseguy @ Mar 28 2007, 05:25 AM) |
I'm not familiar with all the varieties of bottles, so my choice is based on those I know. My vote went to the Waterman/OMAS type, which can be tipped on its side when the ink level is low. But I also find the Levenger bottle, with its plastic insert, to be quite clever and convenient.
Of course, virtually any bottle can be tipped to a convenient angle with the help of a vise -- my preferred method of filling, as you know (or can imagine). |
I inserted levenger on the list but I used only internet images and those that not explain the internal shape. So if you have a Levenger ink bottle, can you show us the internal? If the little inkwell is on the center of the base, I think it is nearly impossible to use the last drop if around there is a little climb around it. If there is not, sorry but from the pics I saw it seems to be there.
Yes you are true that all bottles can be tipped to a angle but not so convenient in the "blind zones" category because of the bottom angle that is not reached from a pen inserted. Try with Pelikan 30ml There is a little part of that internal angle impossible to reach. Same with indentical or similar bottles. In other bottles, the new based area could be too large and it loose the possibility to be used as an internal inkwell (Aurora). In other again there is no other possibility except you want to try the angles putting the bottle in a particular and dangerous equilibrium (Private Reserve).
Waterman and OMAS have not this blind angle.
Anyway, best solution is the travelling ink pot and with this idea I cannot understand why a producer don't put a rubber ring around the internal neck to use every bottle like a Visconti travelling ink pot.
The mechanism is simple: if the pen cannot reach the last drop, let the last drop go to the pen. if you turn upside down the bottle with a proper ring internal to the bottle neck and a pen with the nib safetly and ermetically inserted, you can aspire all the ink in the pen, just because the base of the feed can be putted at the same level of the rubber.
As with Visconti travelling inkpot of course it is better to apply with the last drops only because air dilatation is simple than ink dilatation and the piston has not to be force dangerously to this way.
Viseguy
Mar 29 2007, 03:25 AM
| QUOTE (Netnemo @ Mar 28 2007, 07:35 AM) |
| ...if you have a Levenger ink bottle, can you show us the internal? |
I'm afraid the only Levenger bottle I have is filled with dark brown ink and wouldn't photograph well at the moment.

The gimmick, though, is a small plastic reservoir, enough for one or two fills, that hangs from the rim of the bottle, with slits near the top that allow the reservoir to fill up when the (capped) bottle is upended. You insert the nib into the reservoir to fill. Truth be told, I don't know how well it works when the bottle is nearly empty. But it's a comfy way to fill a pen because it removes the worry of ramming the point of the nib against the bottom of the bottle; the reservoir, which is made of a soft plastic, acts as a cushion. I hope that gives you something of a picture.
antoniosz
Mar 29 2007, 04:24 AM
The Parker Penman bottle is the best that I have tried.
It has a plastic "canister" that functions like the old Sheaffer bottle with the "side pocket" (I am inventing words tonight as I can not remember the proper terminology), but it is plastic and one is not afraid that the nib will hit the glass wall.
krz
Mar 29 2007, 04:29 AM
It's not my favorite ink but the Montblanc shoe looking bottles are my favorite.
Netnemo
Mar 29 2007, 10:14 AM
| QUOTE (antoniosz @ Mar 29 2007, 05:24 AM) |
The Parker Penman bottle is the best that I have tried. It has a plastic "canister" that functions like the old Sheaffer bottle with the "side pocket" (I am inventing words tonight as I can not remember the proper terminology), but it is plastic and one is not afraid that the nib will hit the glass wall. |
Uhm...
The Parker bottle I mean in the poll was the Parker Quink... not the Penman that I have never seen also online...
MYU
Apr 12 2007, 07:01 PM
| QUOTE (krz @ Mar 28 2007, 11:29 PM) |
| It's not my favorite ink but the Montblanc shoe looking bottles are my favorite. |
I agree. The MB bottles are super steady, have a convenient shape, high quality cap, and are simply beautiful to behold. I like the side "V" chamber, versus the more common central one (like on Lamy bottles). I've only used their Blue and Black inks and find them quite good. The black seems to have decent water resistance, though I suspect less permanent than Noodler's Eternal and Bulletproof inks.
Mac in Alberta
Apr 13 2007, 06:41 AM
I think I'm part of the group that misses the old Sheaffer filling well but voted for Waterman-style tippable bottles.
kenny
Apr 13 2007, 11:05 AM
The MontBlanc ink bottle shape is my favorite as well. However, I find that the inner lining of the cap comes out on many of my bottles. Maybe they're using a cheap glue?
Paddler
Apr 13 2007, 02:57 PM
I haven't voted yet; I don't know what a "blind zone shape" is. However, I have found what I consider to be the ideal ink bottle shape. It is a Pelikan bottle shaped a bit like a stretched-out Z. It was made by Gunther Wagner and contains India ink for fountain pens ("shake well before using"). It contains 1 - 1/4 oz of ink. Whazzat - 38 ml? Anyway, you tip this bottle over onto its back and the ink glugs into the part of the bottle under the cap. You can't get the very last drop from a bottle because most pens lose suction when the ink level falls below the section grip. However, this bottle comes as close as any I've seen yet.
Paddler
Netnemo
Apr 13 2007, 04:47 PM
| QUOTE (Paddler @ Apr 13 2007, 03:57 PM) |
I haven't voted yet; I don't know what a "blind zone shape" is. However, I have found what I consider to be the ideal ink bottle shape. It is a Pelikan bottle shaped a bit like a stretched-out Z. It was made by Gunther Wagner and contains India ink for fountain pens ("shake well before using"). It contains 1 - 1/4 oz of ink. Whazzat - 38 ml? Anyway, you tip this bottle over onto its back and the ink glugs into the part of the bottle under the cap. You can't get the very last drop from a bottle because most pens lose suction when the ink level falls below the section grip. However, this bottle comes as close as any I've seen yet.
Paddler |
Blind zones shapes are that bottles with an uncovered angle also putting the pen and the nib in different positions u cannot reach the last little amount of ink. Tipical are Pelikan 30ml shapes, which seem to have no blind zones but if you try, you cannot fill the pen with the last amount because the nib cannot reach it.
Instead for the Pelikan India I have never seen it, and also I don't know anyone that can describe it so you can consider it as Cylindrical shape, also because as you said, you cannot use the last drops of ink.
Netnemo
Apr 24 2007, 03:21 PM
mmm
no more people voting?
Maybe it is time to close the poll. So if I look at the results, I can say without any doubts that the best shape is the internal conical type, but I don't understand why producer don't use this kind or modifications of their own bottles placing a internal zone like in sheaffer's.
We all think that Noodler's has very good ink but bottles are very bad...
Shangas
Apr 24 2007, 03:33 PM
I remember having this small bottle when I was a kid. Little ink-bottle. It had black ink in it, and it had a little black plastic cap. It was part of a SET, which came with a quill pen.
I remember I hated that bottle, because it was so-designed that it would be VERY easy to tip it over.
Consequently,
I like the Parker Quink bottles (Nice, fat bases. Hard to knock over), and the MB 'shoe' bottle. Again, nice and heavy, hard to knock over. And it has that little V-chamber to store ink in, when filling your pen. Very convenient...even if the shape is a bit weird....
BillTheEditor
Apr 24 2007, 03:36 PM
QUOTE(Netnemo @ Apr 24 2007, 10:21 AM) [snapback]279374[/snapback]
mmm
no more people voting?
Maybe it is time to close the poll. So if I look at the results, I can say without any doubts that the best shape is the internal conical type, but I don't understand why producer don't use this kind or modifications of their own bottles placing a internal zone like in sheaffer's.
We all think that Noodler's has very good ink but bottles are very bad...
Don't close it until I've had a chance to tell you about what I found this weekend.
Sunday, I went to the Main Street Art Festival in Fort Worth, Texas. This is a huge event that takes up six city blocks in downtown Fort Worth and draws artists from around the world.
I happened to walk into the booth of Heinrich Andreas Schilling, a wood turner from Grunstadt, Germany. He had some unusual inkwells there in a design that was new to me. He was selling these as inkwells for dip pens, but they will work perfectly well for fountain pens.
The inkwells consisted of three parts: a wooden cap (with a plastic liner and screw threads), a wooden ring, and inside the wooden ring a glass bottle. The bottle is round, but the bottom has a conical extension in the center that is almost an inch deep and about a half-inch in diameter. This extension allows the user to completely immerse a nib in ink even when the bottle is almost empty. The wooden ring supports the bottle, since it would not stand up on its own.
If I can get a photo of this inkwell, I will post it later. Schilling has a web site (http://www.formdesign.de/x/schilling/), including a page titled, "fur den Schreibtisch" but there is no photo of the inkwell on it -- just pictures of his dip pen handles (which were very nice, only I didn't really need one) and a pen rest for the desktop. The inkwell I bought is made in black walnut (he had another done in pearwood) and has a tag on the bottom that identifies it as "NR 58." His contact information is on the web site, his English is better than my German (may not be saying much!), so if anyone is interested they could probably get in touch with him to ask about buying one of these.
Netnemo
May 7 2007, 08:16 AM
Thank you very much for this information. It confirms my opinion that the perfect shape is the internal conical or internal inkwell one. I will contact Schilling as soon as possible and I will suggest him to join FPN. As someone suggested for a FPN LE pen than also a FPN LE inkwell could be a good idea. The pen was made in USA the inkwell could be made in EU.
Netnemo
May 23 2007, 08:11 AM
No more people voting?
Shangas
May 23 2007, 10:14 AM
HOOOOOOOOOOOLD THE BOAT!!! *runs frantically towards it*
*Jumps in and presses his choice-button*
Okay, I voted.
Tricia
May 23 2007, 09:53 PM
I haven't voted only because the only thing I care about in an ink bottle is the ink inside.
I have one of the MB shoe bottles and it is cool, but since the Noodler's hold more I
really like them.
Let me amend my first statement to add that I don't like caps that get stuck, but so far that's only happened with a metal cap on a old bottle of Skrip (in the squat cylinder, in case there's a different shape out there).
Oh, and a mild annoyance that the metal cap on the 'crystal' bottle that comes with J Herbin's Ink for Man isn't metal at all but silverized plastic.
rattybad1
May 25 2007, 04:11 AM
You might want to change Levenger from the "other" category to the first category listed here (conical filling systems). Their bottles are oddly shaped but they are fitted with the conical filling system that puts them in the first category, not the last.
Netnemo
May 25 2007, 06:30 AM
As I asked in post #12 of this thread, if someone can show me this famous internal ink well, I sure will put levenger ink bottle in the first category. I have searched for pics on internet but never found it, and in Italy levenger is not sold.
rattybad1
May 25 2007, 04:24 PM
QUOTE(Netnemo @ May 25 2007, 06:30 AM) [snapback]299703[/snapback]
As I asked in post #12 of this thread, if someone can show me this famous internal ink well, I sure will put levenger ink bottle in the first category. I have searched for pics on internet but never found it, and in Italy levenger is not sold.
Pic's a little blurry and askew, but this is an empty bottle of Levenger Cobalt Blue with the internal well.
Netnemo
May 25 2007, 05:34 PM
This is definetely of the first category. Only one problem: I'm not able to edit the poll... So consider the Levenger in the first category.
Paddler
May 28 2007, 04:21 PM
Here are pictures of the Pelikan bottle I mentioned in a post on page two. If you use a snorkel, you can suck up the last drop.
Paddler
Col
May 28 2007, 08:28 PM
Another vote for the Mont Blanc bottle, which is combines excellent functionality with elegance. I'm not really qualified to pass judgment on the contents, since I have only one bottle (of Bordeaux). Having said that, I've had no flow problems with it in a range of pens, and I like the colour a lot.
Another interesting type, which I acquired from PenGallery recently, is a Pelikan 'Antique' bottle which incorporates a pen rest - see picture.
Netnemo
May 28 2007, 08:40 PM
The pen rest is the fifth category and has only two votes because here we are voting the usefulness not the beauty. I like the pen rest, too. I have a Gunther Wagner edition. About Mont Blanc: I have only one colour, Bordeaux, as yours. Do you like it? I like the shadow feature, visible with broad and stub nibs more than medium and fine. I have some skips and flowing problems with some paper like amalfi paper.
Col
May 28 2007, 08:55 PM
QUOTE(Netnemo @ May 28 2007, 09:40 PM) [snapback]301619[/snapback]
The pen rest is the fifth category
Ah, sorry - I missed that for some reason.
QUOTE
About Mont Blanc: I have only one colour, Bordeaux, as yours. Do you like it?
I do; but although I've tried it in a few different pens, I haven't tried it on a wide range of papers and so haven't encountered any skipping issues (yet).
Netnemo
Sep 12 2008, 09:21 AM
Now that we are over 17000 members, I hope there is someone else interested in this poll.
Come on
I'm talking to you
Come on...
Titivillus
Sep 12 2008, 11:32 AM
QUOTE (FrankB @ Mar 27 2007, 09:28 AM)

I voted Internal Conical Systems, but I agree with Kees. Those old Sheaffer bottles were the best.
I've got two for sale in the Marketplace right now!
K
MrRogers
Sep 12 2008, 11:37 AM
I like Lamy bottles with the internal well and blotter paper dispenser, some design concept
MrR
ZeleniLav
Sep 12 2008, 11:51 AM
I honestly don't know. I've never emptied a bottle using a pen itself. My favourite filling method are syringe-refilled cartridges, so I have no problems with there being too little ink in a bottle. And if I would happen reach the point when I couldn't get the remaining ink out, I'd simply dump it into another bottle of the same ink...
DerMann
Sep 12 2008, 01:29 PM
Vintage Skrip bottles
shostakovich
Sep 15 2008, 02:14 PM
Another solution which has been solved by "The Writing Desk." (UK website) Buy a larger plastic refill botlle of Diamine ink and fill your bottle up a bit (or a lot) so you have no trouble filling pen. They say on the website that the plastic bottle is also good for travelling. Not sure if this means its relaible on aircraft? The ink is slightly better value too.
thibaulthalpern
Sep 15 2008, 03:33 PM
QUOTE (shostakovich @ Sep 15 2008, 07:14 AM)

Another solution which has been solved by "The Writing Desk." (UK website) Buy a larger plastic refill botlle of Diamine ink and fill your bottle up a bit (or a lot) so you have no trouble filling pen. They say on the website that the plastic bottle is also good for travelling. Not sure if this means its relaible on aircraft? The ink is slightly better value too.
I don't see why any ink bottle wouldn't be reliable on the airplane. After all, all ink bottles have to travel by plane to get to some destination before being sold. The only isue is whether it'll break and that means packing the ink bottle well. Hand carry, of course.
lapis
Sep 15 2008, 03:44 PM
Now don't get me wrong but I don't care all that much about the bottle.
Main thing is I like the ink (for all possible reasons).
If the bottle is almost empty and I can't get out the last few drops, I just buy another new bottle.
If I don't like the ink, it can even be half full and I'll chuck it away anyhow.
Chuck
Jimmy James
Sep 16 2008, 12:29 AM
I see a long future of buying Levenger ink for me because I love their bottle (not to mention their Skies of Blue).
I can't wait to finish up a bottle and be able to use it for some Legal Lapis.
wvbeetlebug
Sep 16 2008, 12:41 AM
Decisions. Decisions. I'm a huge fan of the vintage Skrip bottles and I really like how the Noodler's bottles store and line up, but I'm drawn between the Private Reserve bottles (short wide, large opening for big nibs) and the Waterman bottles because you can tip them and they stay.
I'm going with Private Reserve.
037
Sep 16 2008, 01:25 AM
I don't see why any ink bottle wouldn't be reliable on the airplane. After all, all ink bottles have to travel by plane to get to some destination before being sold. The only isue is whether it'll break and that means packing the ink bottle well. Hand carry, of course.
[/quote]
Hand carry is no longer allowed, at least not in Canada, what with the fluid bans and such. Had a bottle of Pilot confiscated just 3 days ago coming back from Vancouver.
As to carrying bottle ink (when it was allowed), ditto with filled fountain pens - the cabin is pressurized, leakage was never a problem for me, and I routinely carried 6-10 pens in my carry-on when I travel.
Wonder what would happen if they find out the combined ink volume in all the pens way exceeds the fluid-carry-on-ban limit?
off topic now...sorry
LedZepGirl
Sep 16 2008, 01:41 AM
Old Skrip bottles with the well in them are the best.
gyasko
Sep 16 2008, 02:22 AM
I like the MB shoe bottles, too. (What's conical about them?). I have a lot of old Skrip because i like the ink, but the bottles have never done anything for me.
Maria
Sep 18 2008, 07:25 PM
Dear Kees,
As far as I know; Sheaffer Script glass bottled ink with the internal ink well, is no longer made and this to me has been a tragic; as that was one reason to buy it. Now its plastic and you can't even see into the bottle to know how far to lower the nib and keep the barrel from being an inky mess.
Now, I am scrambling to find bottles that used to hold Sheaffer Script inks; as nobody has such anymore.
(Got two-one 1950's vintage and another 1970's vintage).
Only thing decently close to the thing I wish for; is Speedball's Calligraphy ink that comes with their ink for dip pens.
Respectfully,
Maria
QUOTE (Kees @ Mar 27 2007, 07:23 AM)

IMO, by far the most functional ink bottles are those with a separate ink well inside, the pre-Slovenian Sheaffer Skrip type. By turning them upside down you can use the ink almost to the last drop, and the procedure of filling the pen is pretty clean, in comparison.
One problem: The poll doesn’t seem to take this kind of bottle into account...
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please
click here.