Hi, I just got a B nib and am looking for something with line variation. Is the OBB like a music nib? Have you used OM OB OBB and what do you think of them?

Definitely not an italic oblique: not a lot of line variation. The oblique angle is just enough to make the nib move smoothly across the page if it's rotated correctly in your hand. YMMV

Here's a scan of writing samples with an OB, an OBB, and an O3B: (My O3B is also quite flexible, hence the greater line variation.)

And just for fun, here is a picture of two M800 O3B Nibs:

I have always found the Pelikan OM-O3B nibs disappointing.

They tend to be rather round (the 14 K are better than the 18 K)

If you want a modern Pelikan nib with character you really need to send a 14K off to Richard Binder or John Mottishaw.

The only M800 nib I use out of the box is an EF 14K, for grading.

I have an OB (m620) and get no line variation. And to write with it you have to rotate the pen. Dont like it much.

Obliques are not intended to give line variation. They are intended to compensate for how the writer holds the pen.

For line variation, you want either a sharp italic, cursive italic, or "stub" italic. I have enjoyed the stubs I have purchased from Richard Binder.

Most obliques, including modern Pelikan, aren't perfectly round and end up having a bit of italic cut to them, and thus a bit of line variation.

I definitely get line variation from my factory OB nib from Pelikan, [an 18k that's currently in my transparent blue 600 (aka "Little Blue Ocean)].

Thanks for the feedback, guys. I am considering sending my first Pelikan, M605, to chartpak and getting a OBB, it is a 14k nib. Should I be good as I tend to rotate my pens at a funny angle when I write anyway?

As a side note, are problems with starting common? I am astounded as my B feels toothy compared to my Sailors but maybe thats just the feel of Pelikans. Maybe its due to ink starvation and a common issue for all Pels but I do appreciate the wet flow of the nib. Another fact I am surprised with, the pistion seems to hold less than my Sailor converter.

I have a Pelikan 200 and I've used the M, OBB, OM and Italic nibs with it. My use of these nibs has included Pelikan ink (but too long ago to remember exact details) and they only have been used with Noodler's Squeteague, Noodler's Lexington Gray, Noodlers Navaho Turquoise, or Swisher's Cocoa recently.

I also have a Sailor music nib , and that is a good reference nib for me to compare the B, OBB, OM and Italic nibs.

First, the issue of possible toothiness in a Pelikan nib. My impression is that Pelikan nibs are pretty much flawless. Any toothiness is more likely my fault, or the fault of using less than optimal paper. Toothiness happens sometimes it's related more to my not holding the pen properly, rather than any defect in the nib itself.

So, the my impression on on anything other than buttery smooth action from the nibs, is this. All of my Pelikan nibs are a little toothy if I use too much pressure, or if I'm using really cheap paper. Sometimes I've had the nibs pickup a bit of lint or dust into the nib, sort of getting it stuck between the tines, and that just requires a wipe off with a damp cotton ball or a peek under a magnifying glass and removal of the offending fiber. (I knit a lot and fibers floating around are a fact of life for me.)

Other problems that I experience with Pelikan broader nibs, such as the OBB and OM occur when I am not holding with the "sweet spot" working best, or if I am pressing down even a little bit. That goes almost double for the OBB nib. The OBB nib demands a very light touch between pen and paper. Think floating along on the top of the paper. Some days it almost feels like I am writing in the air above the paper, but still the ink hits the page and letters appear.

The OM nib acts pretty much like the OBB nib in terms of requiring a very light touch between the pen and the paper and needing to find the sweet spot. The OM nib doesn't have as much ink flow, so in that respect, it is a better nib for writing for me if I'm having a "smallish writing" day. It also gives a nice line variation if I, the user, am doing what I ought when writing with it.

I had a Mont Blanc Noblesse fitted with a OB nib, and that had the same response as I recall. Of course, that was in my callow and carefree youth. Think back to the time when dinosaurs were roaming what became the Great Plains, so the memory is a bit hazy on that point.

My conclusion is that the OM lays down a line that is about equal to my other B nibs, but with subtle line variation. The OM is also close to other M nibs I've used, especially if I'm using an ink with super wet flow properties, on humid days or somewhat cheap paper that might not feather, but just seems to draw a huge amount of ink from the nib.

As Richard Binder says, Pelikan obliques don't give a lot of line variation. I just can't remember where on his site he said it, and my 'puter doesn't like me much today. I agree with him, except the subtle variations are there with an OBB, OB or even an OM nib. None give as much variation as you see with the Pelikan Italic or the Sailor music nibs.

As the Pelikan nibs lay down a lot of ink, relatively speaking, my writing size has to enlarge a bit for legability. The OBB requires the largest writing, then the Sailor Music nib. The Pelikan Italic is a virtual tie with the Sailor music in terms of ink flow and line width, but the difference with the Sailor is that the line variation is more subtle and more beautiful to me.

Next in line for requiring larger writing to get the any available variation from the Pelikans is the OM. then my Mont Blanc B (tied with a Waterman , and so on down the size scale to EF.

With some inks, the OM can be just a bit broader than the Montblanc B or Waterman B nibs. However, the difference is really minimal. The OM is usually a thicker line writer than a Waterman B, but gives more line variation.

The italic nib feels balky or toothy only when I'm writing on my ultra-ultra-ultra- cheap (err, inexpensive) 20# copier paper. Even if i am using a 24# paper, making sure of course to be on the front, or "top side" of the paper, the nib can feel "toothy".

Check the paper label for which side should be loaded to make the top the printed side in the printer, and that's the top, or better side, for writing. On HP paper, the top is the side of the paper that is NOT on the seam side of the paper covering the ream. Put another way, the bottom/second side, or rougher side is close to the seam of the paper covering the ream of HP all purpose paper.

My guess is that if the Sailor music nib is broad for you, and the Pelikan B is not broad enough, you may find that the OM will be a good choice, but the OBB will be the really broadest line. You can, (but only with a small amount of practice in my experience), get line variation from the OBB, or OM nibs, without the feedback of a difference in your hand as you achieve the variation that the Sailor music nib gives. In other words, you can get line variation, but not quite as obvious as the Sailor. The feedback from the pen is not as obvious from the Pelikan broader nibs, no matter what.

My Pelikan italic nib gives crisp line variation no matter what, and also gives great feedback to my hand while doing so.

The problem I have with any of these nibs is that I sometimes need about a half page of writing to get my hand acclimated to the "lighter--as in no pressure" action. Also, the practice writing is required to get the best response from the nibs. If you're only using one or two pens all the time*, you probably won't have to practice much after you learn the variations that are possible with those nibs.

A conversation, if you were the proverbial fly on the wall, might go like this:

"Lighter pressure. "
write, write, write--

"No, LIGHTER pressure."
write, write write---

"No, no no no no--FLOAT along as you write. LIGHTER STILL. Are you an idiot hand? THIS REQUIRES a REALLY light touch..."
write, write, write...

"You need to FLOAT along, not press even one bit. These are Pelikan nibs, they are smooth and you need a REALLY LIGHT TOUCH."
write, write, write...

And so it sould go, if only my pens could audibly talk, or shout, at me. The quotes are what my pens would say. They do a bit of shouting, especially if I've just used a reluctant fine nib or had a nib react badly to some paper. If I've just used a ballpoint, well my pressure on the Pelikan is disastrous, whatever nib I'm using.

I know this is an absurdly long post, but I had fun writing it, and actually I'm using this for a rough draft on a violinist repair manual. (That's right, violinist repair.) You just got about 80 percent of a chapter on "training your hand--with a fountain pen" related to light pressure lessons to help injured violinists recover the proper touch on the bow or fingerboard as they recuperate. I left off the bowing and fingering exercises, figuring you wouldn't be using a Pelikan fountain pen to crank out a violin concerto any time soon.



--------------------
* Yeah, like that would happen any time soon for FPN Twelve Step Participants!

Is the BB (Double Broad) nib squared off to be more like a stub nib? I've got my share of oblique nibs, but I'd like to have a little line variation between horiz/vert strokes without going to an edgy italic. I've considered a Binderized nib, but they're all done in the single tone nib--the two-tone is so beautiful and I'd really like to have one in my newly acquired 400NN.

A few more thoughts on the Pelikan Factory M800 and M1000 Obliques:

The picture above is a scan of a full 8 1/2 x 11 piece of paper so the actual line width is actually larger.

I agree with the Violinwriter about finding a "sweet spot" on the obliques. If you hold the the nib so that the oblique angle is contacting the paper properly it should be smooth as proverbial silk. Anything else and it feels scratchy, skips, and is generally annoying. Since I end up twisting my wrist to get the correct angle of the nib as I write, my wrist aches by the end of my wrting session. If you normally hold your pen at a weird angle, this nib is apparently made just for you. (All three of my obliques just went back to Chartpak to be exchanged for regular nibs before my hand drops off.)

I've never had a problem with my Pelikans not keeping up with my broad nibs (B to 3B.) I only have the Souveron piston converter types: M250, M200, 3 X M800, and a M1000 and they gush as required. The only problems I've had with toothiness (the original OB on a 2002 M800) was solved when I sent it in to Chartpak for a nib replacement.

I write with a fair amount of pressure, so I can't back Violinwriter on using a light touch. Though, it probably would be better for you pens in the long term, I write from light to crank depending on the line variation I want with my semi-flexy Pelikan nibs. One day I'll probably hear a loud Spro-ing! Then I'll cry bitter, bitter tears...

Thanks for the insight, would you say that the BB provides more line variation than the OBB?

I'd say the BB will give you the same line as a typical round point. The current M800 production 18K Bock nib (the one on the right in the picture above, and the OB and OBB in my writing sample) seems pretty firm to me, so no line variation there. Perhaps when people talk about the 'Pelikan Flex" they mean the small 14kt nibs?

My writing tends to be pretty straight up and down, so the line width was quite regular. I suspect you'd get a touch of variation if your cursive is more slanted. As noted above, you'll get real oblique variation with an Oblique italic, to use Richard Binder's more precise term, than you will the factory oblique. Mr. Binder's excellent glossary can be found here:

http://www.richardspens.com/?page=writings/bio.html

I'm a big fan of line variation myself. So, I just sent a B and a 03B to him to be reground into cursive italics of the same sizes. Since you have a 14kt nib you could have him increase the flexibilty on yours, lucky you!

Here's also the Pelikan nib key you've seen everywhere else:

I think having a nibmeister do the nib may be the best way to go like you are suggesting.

Argh... today I received a M400 two-tone OBB nib for my 400NN. It's even more beautiful in person! It does manage to screw into the section, but not quite all the way--there's this obvious steel nib collar extending from it by about 1.5mm. It does manage to write just fine and the cap will close on it without touching the nib, so it is compatible but not 100%. It just doesn't look right. I'll have to check to see if the seller will take it back. Dammit.

Conversely, I also got a new M200 F nib and although the steel nib collar is slightly visible (only 0.5mm), it looks just fine. And it writes beautifully. It was a tad toothy at first, but after putting it to use, it is showing some nice controlled glide. I like the idea of using this and keeping the vintage nib out of daily service. Does anybody do this with their vintage Pels?

~Gary

If my experience is any indication, if you want line variation from Pelikan factory-made obliques, forget recent models (the recent one I tried provided no variation at all; I returned it for a refund) and try a pen made in the 1930s-50s. I have obliques ranging from fine through double broad, made for 100s, 100Ns, 140s and 400/400Ns, and all provide distinct line variation (though not as pronounced as, say, Richard Binder's left oblique cursive italics). As you might expect, the variation increases with the breadth of the nib, but it's still noticeable with fines. These are also all far more flexible than any recent Pelikan nib, which adds to the variation. If you dabble in vintage Pelikans, you will also learn that what they used to refer to as "B" is what we would now call a medium stub ("BB" is a broad stub). You can find old Pelikan nib guides on the internet via google; they give a pretty good idea what to expect.

Simon