Hi everyone,

I have a few confessions to make...

1) I have pretty poor handwriting especially when it's only for myself to read, and especially when I'm writing fast. People joke and say I really do need to finish my degree, as my handwriting is already on the "doctor" level.

2) I keep checking back with this forum from time to time to glean information about improving my penmanship.

One of the things that I've learned, is that there seems to be some discrepancy between schools of thought as to what to teach for handwriting improvement. There are those in the italic camp, and those that aren't, I suspect. Those that aren't, we can call cursive camp? I'm unsure.

So, here's the skinny- what are the types of handwriting that are suggested to help people learn to improve their legibility/handwriting. And when are the types indicated? [i.e., do people tend towards italic becuase they are already printing?]

Sorry this is such a strange question, but I'm at a bit of a loss in terms of how to improve, other than to go and buy some books on things. I've found some Spencerian info online, and can practice their exercises etc., and this has helped a bit- but I will likely need to expend much more effort on things. I guess I'm just a bit surprised not to see a much more rigorous work on this here- certainly we have a *ton* of fpn users who wish to improve their handwriting! I greatly appreciate the info that *is* here, please don't get me wrong... I just expected much more info on this in some form. Perhaps I'm just having a hard time finding them in the posts?

Sorry to ask such a general question- there probably isn't too great an answer for it. If you need me to clarify my question(s) please ask, and I'll try to do so!!

Thanks to everyone here, it's been a joy to see everyone's handwriting! One day I will improve!
-Allen

ps- Is the secret merely getting lettering charts and practicing until you're blue in the face?

Hi Allen,

Don't know how far back you went in our posts, or if you saw the pinned topics at the top of this forum--there's quite a bit of info all in all. Though some folks may be in one "camp" or the other, I enjoy using both italic and Palmer script.

In so far as a type of handwriting being indicated--and when--I don't believe there really is any.* It's just your preference--what inspires you. You'll see other people's diverse opinions (and of course these will vary if they're in a certain camp.) Buying some books isn't a bad idea (you could check the library first, then buy.) In fact, if you aren't sure which type of writing you want to practice and learn, a trip to the library first would be a good idea.

Regardless of which type of handwriting you aspire to, you'll find info on good habits such as posture, pen holding, and arm movement (as opposed to finger movement, etc.)

And Congrats! You already know the secret! Practice until you're blue in the face! ...But 1st, look at lots of styles and exemplars and decide on what you like the looks of.

Best, Ann

* An exception--if you happen to be a lefty overwriter like I am, this would indicate that you would have a problem using a flexible nib needed for roundhand scripts such as copperplate or Spencerian. Lefty overwriters make push strokes where right handed folks and lefty underwriters make pull strokes. Push strokes with a flexible nib = ink splatters.

Ann!

Thanks so much for your reply. I guess I'm just forlorne. I should know this will take some time, and I think you answered my questions so well! Of course it makes sense that those who want to write better should figure out what type of script appeals to their taste. The benefit is that they will be more motivated to learn it as well!

I will do more searching, and reading, and try and figure out what type of script appeals to me. I already have some ideas for it.

I think hitting up the library is a great idea as well!

Thanks, Ann, I'm sorry I posted such a strange question here- your answer helped me out.

Thank you!
-Allen

Hi a11en!

As Ann said, there's not ONE right way to write. Each style has it's own proponents, and one can learn to write clearly and legibly in any different handwriting style.

However, speaking from my own experience, I have found that the italic method of writing to be the easiest (for me) to use. One of the best books on this method is:

Write Now, by Getty and Dubay

If you're serious about trying to improve your writing, this is the book that I used to help my writing.

Good luck!

TMann

Ann's right. There probably is no right way. Ultimately, it's what works.

I, however, am firmly in the italic camp. I think that a joined italic is the most functional, legible option to begin with if you have poor handwriting.

Teach Yourself Better Handwriting by Sasoon is my "bible" of choice. It helps you understand what makes "good" handwriting, i.e. functional.

and here are my results:

http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/in...findpost&p=8851

I had embarrassingly poor (like an 8-year-old with a tremor) handwriting. Now it's clumsy but respectable. I took a sort of shortcut, didn't buy a book or go to a teacher - just used Gunnlaugur Briem's website. It was very helpful, not only on how to make letters, but more importantly on how to practice and what to do if it goes wrong. He is another in the Italic group.

For whatever reasons, I have a pretty strong dislike for the style they taught me in school. To some extent, I think I liked the change to something else as much as I liked the improvement.

I attended a handwriting and calligraphy seminar done by Ward Dunham at the 2004 Portland Pen Show, and I clearly remember Ward saying that using an italic nib is the quickest way to instantly improve one's handwriting

I agree with TMann about the book "Write Now"; it is very handy and very easy to find online (on Amazon, etc)

Me too, I got a lot of good from Write Now. I also love the site David mentioned, plus that's free.

I have attended one of his seminars in San Francisco. Impressive teacher.

Has anyone attended the Gettty and Dubay annual handwriting seminars in Portland? They are highly recommended, and also free.

You guys totally rock!

Here I go and post a semi-incoherent post, and I get all these great replies. Thank you so much for your patience, everyone! I'm sorry I let my frustration get to me so quickly!

I've written down all your suggestions and will be looking them over at the library very soon. I have to admit that I tend to print more than I tend to write in cursive, so it's likely that italic is a close match for what I'm doing already- currently I only slow down in an attempt to correct my poor penmanship, and haven't practiced any actual letter-forms at this time.

The closest to something I thought was a simple script was probably Spencerian Business form- it appears to be simple and quick to write. Definitely not italic, though! I do like the look of italic, and suspect connected-italic will be a quick way to improve, but wonder if simple cursive wouldn't be more appropriate for correspondence and writing etc.

In anycase, there's not perfect solution here! [Isn't there some sort of pill I can take to help my handwriting?! ] So, I figure what I should do is just find a book, jump right in and try and improve.

Thanks so much for all the replies, everyone! You're all so nice! I was expecting much more frustrated replies!

I'll check out those books, and the website and see what I can do to try and improve a bit.

BTW- can you write in italic without having line-variation? I can understand the yumminess of line-variation, but I'm hoping to have better over-all penmanship which doesn't require a special nib (say I pick up my friend's yucky bic- the horror!)

Thanks so much, guys! I appreciate the replies! Sorry I let my frustration overtake me!

My best to everyone here!
-Allen

Yes, you can. The Getty and Dubay method is designed to be clear and legible with standard pens, but can also be "dressed up" when used with an italic-type pen. In addition, the letter styles themselves can be written in a fancy, flowery style, or they can be written in a standard, more conservative style.

Good luck!

TMann

Thanks, TMann! I appreciate the well-wishes also! I'll probably need them.


-Allen

Ok, another little question tacked on here- sorry, maybe it should be a separate post...

The whole deal with the shoulder-girdle use, and finger movements- for someone who writes very small, the arm-movements are extremely tiny/quick? I find finger-movements to much easier than shoulder-girdle movements... is this perhaps one of the primary reasons my writing is so poor?

Thanks for any and all thoughts!
-Allen

When you say you find those movements easier, it means they are an easier way of producing the writing you don't like.

Fingers have something to contribute, but they can't do it all.

Arms contribute consistency, rhythm, strength, and endurance. Fingers are a very poor substitute in those departments, and writing with fingers only is usually inconsistent in size and shape, wobbly-looking, and tiring to produce.

Which explains quite a bit about my crappy handwriting!

BTW, I think I might also be confusing something... not only is there fingers and shoulder-girdle, but there's also wrist, right? Is wrist as bad as fingers, or is it mainly wrist and shoulder-gridle/arms for making the proper movements? I guess I might be making my letters with my wrist, but I suspect right now most of it is in the scrunching and unscrunching etc. of my fingers....

I have a lot of zig-zag and oval/line practices ahead of me!!! Thanks again for all the great information, everone! [I have a copy of Write Now on it's way to me via my schoo's library loan program- I'm really looking forward to it!]

Thanks for the help, David. I appreciate it!

Well, maybe not blue in the face, but perhaps blue in the fingers

You might want to go here:

http://iampeth.com/

Click on the "Rare Books" button and download some of the PDF books. You can preview them as images first.....

A couple I've downloaded that seem to be good are:

"The Champion Method of Practical Business Writing"
"Ames Guide to Self-INstruction"
"Palmer's Penmanship Budget"

Ames is particularly nice because it points out specific errors and how to recognize them. Palmer's is fairly exhaustive.

-Bruce

Sweet!! Excellent excellent website, Bruce!!