Full Version: Sailor Naginata-Togi
I have become greatly enamoured of Sailor nibs, and I am looking to acquire a pen with the Naginata-Togi, the sword nib. Can anyone share his or her experience with this nib?
I have a 1911 full size with a Togi Emperor nib. It is pretty much a reversed stub. Narrow downstroke and wide cross stroke. It also writes broader on a lower angle and finer in a more higher angle. I have the togi emperor and the difference between that and the Togi is the togi emperor has the extra ink collector that is placed on top of the nib to ensure constant ink flow.
These pens are super smooth and super broad and a total pleasure to use. My only complaint is that the converter does not hold that much ink at all.
These pens are super smooth and super broad and a total pleasure to use. My only complaint is that the converter does not hold that much ink at all.
I tried one at a store in Japan.
Pro: the smoothest nib ever. Just buying it for this you would not go wrong. This is true of all the Sailor specialty nibs I tried.
Con: the line variation was not that noticable. It's supposed to create a finer line with a higher angle, and it does, but it requires such a change in angle as to be impractical for this.
My understanding is that this nib is designed for creating "hane" and "tome," which are aspects of Japanese brush writing that really aren't seen in English writing. It does this quite well but if you're writing in an western language this feature is pretty useless.
Pro: the smoothest nib ever. Just buying it for this you would not go wrong. This is true of all the Sailor specialty nibs I tried.
Con: the line variation was not that noticable. It's supposed to create a finer line with a higher angle, and it does, but it requires such a change in angle as to be impractical for this.
My understanding is that this nib is designed for creating "hane" and "tome," which are aspects of Japanese brush writing that really aren't seen in English writing. It does this quite well but if you're writing in an western language this feature is pretty useless.
Thanks for the feedback. 
There seems to be a difference between the Naginata-togi which is the "entry-level" Nagahara specialty nib (still a very nice nib) and the Cross Emperor nib (which I think is the one Noble Savage was referring to).
I like the idea of a reverse (or perpendicular) stub with thin downstrokes and broad cross strokes, and was hoping that the Naginata-togi would simply be a less broad version of the Cross Emperor. It doesn't look that way from lordjeebus' description though. Looks like I should be looking at the Cross Emperor (or Cross) nib instead of a Naginata-togi.
I do have a question for Noble Savage though: Is the line variation between the downstroke and cross stroke as sharp as a normal stub? From the looks of the nib, it would appear that the downstroke would still be a pretty thick line.
It also seems to me that the writing-angle line variations that these nibs are designed for aren't easy to reproduce at all. I've tried the Zoom nib which was really fun for a while, but it was very difficult to control line thickness for writing in western alphabets. It seems nicely suited for cursive Han script though, but even for that it requires a different writing technique from a pen brush.
I tried holding the pen with the Zoom (I think it was a 1911M) with a Chinese pen brush grip, which allowed a high angle necessary for a thinner line, but that is not the way the pen is designed to be held, and it is difficult to vary the angle for broader strokes.
Looks like I have to master a totally new way of writing if I want to use these beautiful nibs to their full potential! :doh:
There seems to be a difference between the Naginata-togi which is the "entry-level" Nagahara specialty nib (still a very nice nib) and the Cross Emperor nib (which I think is the one Noble Savage was referring to).
I like the idea of a reverse (or perpendicular) stub with thin downstrokes and broad cross strokes, and was hoping that the Naginata-togi would simply be a less broad version of the Cross Emperor. It doesn't look that way from lordjeebus' description though. Looks like I should be looking at the Cross Emperor (or Cross) nib instead of a Naginata-togi.
I do have a question for Noble Savage though: Is the line variation between the downstroke and cross stroke as sharp as a normal stub? From the looks of the nib, it would appear that the downstroke would still be a pretty thick line.
It also seems to me that the writing-angle line variations that these nibs are designed for aren't easy to reproduce at all. I've tried the Zoom nib which was really fun for a while, but it was very difficult to control line thickness for writing in western alphabets. It seems nicely suited for cursive Han script though, but even for that it requires a different writing technique from a pen brush.
I tried holding the pen with the Zoom (I think it was a 1911M) with a Chinese pen brush grip, which allowed a high angle necessary for a thinner line, but that is not the way the pen is designed to be held, and it is difficult to vary the angle for broader strokes.
Looks like I have to master a totally new way of writing if I want to use these beautiful nibs to their full potential! :doh:
If you're looking for a "reverse stub" you might also want to look into Richard Binder's Arabic/Hebrew italic.
I just got a sailor 1911 pen with a naginata togi nib (Fine-Medium Nib) , about 2 weeks ago. First i tried diamine registar's ink in it and it was smooth, considering the ink. Now i've got platinum carbon black in it. flows pretty nice! yay!
as for line variation there is some for a japanese fine/medium nib, but i think maybe a broader nib than this would give me some more noticeable. i am not too sure how many sizes this nib comes in, if you have a chance, i would try different size nibs.
someone said the nib was smooth, it is, but for me my pilot custom 823 nib seems smoother.
i guess the converter is small, and theres so much wasted space in the barrel, maybe making it an eyedropper, might be possible?
can't say i've tried the other specialty nibs, kinda pricey for me, maybe one day!
hope you find the right pen/nib!
as for line variation there is some for a japanese fine/medium nib, but i think maybe a broader nib than this would give me some more noticeable. i am not too sure how many sizes this nib comes in, if you have a chance, i would try different size nibs.
someone said the nib was smooth, it is, but for me my pilot custom 823 nib seems smoother.
i guess the converter is small, and theres so much wasted space in the barrel, maybe making it an eyedropper, might be possible?
can't say i've tried the other specialty nibs, kinda pricey for me, maybe one day!
hope you find the right pen/nib!
I took the plunge, and was able to convince the shop-owner to substitute a normal 21k nib on a black 1911 Classic with a Nagahara King Eagle, for a big jump in price of course (nearly doubling the price of the pen). Still it was a lot cheaper than buying the nib itself.
Apparently, the Sailor agent here doesn't think standard 1911 Classics are 'worthy' of specialty nibs and won't offer the option even though they fit perfectly. In fact, even the more upscale 1911 Executive Naginata line are deemed worthy only of the Naginata-togi, the 'base-line' specialty nib.
The King Eagle nib I got is incredible. It's appearance on my humble plain black 1911 Classic is simply Regal. It's arching tines mount upwards like muscular wings to form a triple-stacked tip.
The line it lays down has the quality of a Chinese brush stroke. To paraphrase a saying in Chinese painting, "Ink has five colours" in reference to black ink used for Chinese painting and calligraphy. If you have seen a good Chinese brush painting using nothing but black ink to express dimension, texture and movement, you know what I mean.
With the King Eagle nib, writing with Visconti Pearl Black, the broadest lines exhibit an effect which begins to approach the variation of tone available with the ink brush. While nothing close to the broad range of tonality possible with a brush, one must remember this is done with a rigid pen nib!
The nib is smooth, though not buttery smooth as some have described Sailor nibs (maybe it's just me). Very slight 'tooth' could be felt when writing at the highest angles (about 80 degrees) and upside down, although the line was still very wet. I experimented with rolling the nib when writing upside down. Some angles produced a wetter line than others, but the amazing thing was the nib still wrote! When writing at lower angles (about 45-60 degrees), the nib is a gusher, producing very round and broad strokes.
The downstroke / cross-stroke line variation was not great - it is not at all a 'reverse' stub. However, the nib can produce great variation in width even in normal writing. That surprised me after my experience with the Zoom. The thing is the variation is gradual, not crisp like what you can get with an italic or even a stub. Also, the variation is not along the same axis that is produced by angled tips like the italic or stub. The effect is much like a paint brush, with thin strokes broadening out or vice versa, but not in the precise way that a flexible nib is capable of.
I'm still exploring the possibilities with the King Eagle. Maybe I will post some writing samples once I get the hang of this.
Apparently, the Sailor agent here doesn't think standard 1911 Classics are 'worthy' of specialty nibs and won't offer the option even though they fit perfectly. In fact, even the more upscale 1911 Executive Naginata line are deemed worthy only of the Naginata-togi, the 'base-line' specialty nib.
The King Eagle nib I got is incredible. It's appearance on my humble plain black 1911 Classic is simply Regal. It's arching tines mount upwards like muscular wings to form a triple-stacked tip.
The line it lays down has the quality of a Chinese brush stroke. To paraphrase a saying in Chinese painting, "Ink has five colours" in reference to black ink used for Chinese painting and calligraphy. If you have seen a good Chinese brush painting using nothing but black ink to express dimension, texture and movement, you know what I mean.
With the King Eagle nib, writing with Visconti Pearl Black, the broadest lines exhibit an effect which begins to approach the variation of tone available with the ink brush. While nothing close to the broad range of tonality possible with a brush, one must remember this is done with a rigid pen nib!
The nib is smooth, though not buttery smooth as some have described Sailor nibs (maybe it's just me). Very slight 'tooth' could be felt when writing at the highest angles (about 80 degrees) and upside down, although the line was still very wet. I experimented with rolling the nib when writing upside down. Some angles produced a wetter line than others, but the amazing thing was the nib still wrote! When writing at lower angles (about 45-60 degrees), the nib is a gusher, producing very round and broad strokes.
The downstroke / cross-stroke line variation was not great - it is not at all a 'reverse' stub. However, the nib can produce great variation in width even in normal writing. That surprised me after my experience with the Zoom. The thing is the variation is gradual, not crisp like what you can get with an italic or even a stub. Also, the variation is not along the same axis that is produced by angled tips like the italic or stub. The effect is much like a paint brush, with thin strokes broadening out or vice versa, but not in the precise way that a flexible nib is capable of.
I'm still exploring the possibilities with the King Eagle. Maybe I will post some writing samples once I get the hang of this.
More on the brush-like qualities of the King Eagle, I was able to reproduce Li-Shu calligraphy with some patience and playing with the ink-flow (just like with a brush)!
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