Nakaya ink flow problems

[1000km]

Having acquired a stunning Nakaya Piccolo fountain pen with a remarkable flexible nib, I've been deeply troubled by ink flow problems. After several days of glorious writing, the ink flow gradually dries up to the point where it intermittently cuts out mid sentence.

 

The first time it happened I immediately returned the pen to Nakaya in Japan, who reportedly replaced the feed and made some improvements to the nib in accordance with the writing sample I provided. Credit to Nakaya for excellent service, but at the expense of an excruciating 6 week wait for the repair.

 

The second time it happened I removed the nib unit and soaked it for a couple of hours in luke warm water with a few drops of washing-up liquid. The pen is now functioning beautifully again.

 

I'm interested to hear from owners who have experienced similar problems. What is causing this problem? Could the wonderful but highly saturated Sailor Blue ink I've been using be behind this? How can I prevent this problem? How should I best cure this problem if/when it happens again? :hmm1:

[GardenWeasel]

Cannot offer any suggestions for a home-grown repair (except to try other inks), but I sure can recommend Michael Masuyama (MikeitWork) to tune it!

[Dillo]

Hi,

 

Other people who had this seem to have it go away with use. Just use it more and it should go away.

 

Dillon

[1000km]

Reassured to note that others have suffered the same problem and that it has eventually cleared up. Secretly hoping that it might just be a bit of oil residue from the manufacturing process.

[1000km]

As per my worst nightmares, the dreaded Nakaya ink flow problem has arisen again. After a few sentences it dries up completely. I've been using Platinum Blue Black excusively since this last happened, so surely the ink can't be to blame? Grateful for ANY insights before I'm forced to return the Nakaya to Japan AGAIN for another likely <shudder> six week stretch. I'm at my wits end - if they offer me a refund I'll take it and run for the hills...

Edited February 3, 2009 by 1000km

[LouisA]

In my Nakaya I use Waterman Florida Blue without any flow problems. It is a Piccolo with a Fine nib. I would certainly try other inks first.

[QM2]

I had this problem with my first Nakaya, which has a Super Extra Fine Elastic nib and which I ordered directly from Japan. The problem did not go away with use. I had the pen for a year and it persisted in the same manner you describe, until John Mottihaw took a look at it at a pen show and fixed it. From what I understand, this is not an uncommon issue with the elastic and soft/flexi nibs. I would recommend John Mottishaw for resolving the problem.

[jkrewalk]

Cannot offer any suggestions for a home-grown repair (except to try other inks), but I sure can recommend Michael Masuyama (MikeitWork) to tune it!

 

 

I second this! Mike is the best having learned from the best Japanese nib masters! He can fix it better than anyone.

 

[1000km]

The Nakaya goes back to Japan for the second time today. Nibmeister suggestions much appreciated, but while its under warranty I should rely on the manufacturer. Will update this thread in due course (please less than six weeks wait this time).

[1000km]

4 weeks after returning the Nakaya, and having received no notification during this time of when the pen would be returned to me, I requested a refund of my money. Nakaya duly obliged, marking the end to this sorry six month saga. I may consider buying another Nakaya at a later date, but it will be from John Mottishaw and it won't be fitted with the soft and flexible medium nib (most likely cause of my ink flow problems).

[MidnightBlue]

If it runs fine and then runs out it sounds to me like it may be the converter. Turn it up then down to see it's not sticking to the sides. Rinse it in detergent and water, then with distilled water, or any good clean water. Here in Adelaide we don't have any clean water.!!! It's the only thing I can think of.

Thanks

[ethernautrix]

Might I suggest an Edison Pearl with an Edison nib?

 

Pictured below are a Nakaya Piccolo Cigar (with a problematic nib) and an Edison Pearl (with a FABULOUS nib). Brian Gray, a member here, is Edison Pens.

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3596/3299133933_288564e44a.jpg

[ianmedium]

Might I suggest an Edison Pearl with an Edison nib?

 

Pictured below are a Nakaya Piccolo Cigar (with a problematic nib) and an Edison Pearl (with a FABULOUS nib). Brian Gray, a member here, is Edison Pens.

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3596/3299133933_288564e44a.jpg

 

 

That is one stunning Edison, Brian does a fantastic job! Thanks for the size comparison as well, that is really useful, I will be ordering from Brian this year!

[Skyppere]

I had this problem with mine too. It would write beautifully and then after about a paragraph dry up. I took it to the dc supershow and Nakaya was there so they had their nib meister tweak it. Didn't work because the problem wasn't with the nib but the feed. I would try the following, soak the section in a mixture of 409 and water... sometimes there's gunk in there. Also try adding just the barest drop of 409 to the cnverter or cartridge before you add the ink. That sometimes helps.

Finally, what I dd was send it to Richard Binder who fixed it. Alas his queue is what, 5 months now? But he fixed it and I love it. I have another nakaya that writes beautifully so I think most of them are fine.

skyppere

[QM2]

I had this problem with mine too.

...

Finally, what I dd was send it to Richard Binder who fixed it.

...

I have another nakaya that writes beautifully so I think most of them are fine.

 

Based on what I've been reading via following the Nakaya posts for a while, I'd say there is almost a 50% rate of problematic nibs when the pens are purchased from the manufacturer directly (the problems ranging from scratchiness to flow issues).

 

My first one came from Nakaya directly and had flow problems, until John Mottishaw adjusted it at a pen show.

The second one came straight from John and had no problems, so with future ones I plan to follow this route as well.

 

 

 

 

Edited March 6, 2009 by QM2

[mava]

I have 4 Nakaya's of which 2 have Fine nibs. One writes more like a western extra fine and the other a fine yet they both are "fine" by designation.

 

I've haven't had any flow issues to report but my flex medium nib exhibited similar symptoms as ethernautrix's Piccolo. It doesn't bother me too much since I have other pens in my rotation and personally find the Piccolo a tad too short for my hands.

 

I 2nd going with John Mottishaw. 2 of my Nakaya's were sourced from him; the other two from Nakaya.

[ianmedium]

I had this problem with mine too.

...

Finally, what I dd was send it to Richard Binder who fixed it.

...

I have another nakaya that writes beautifully so I think most of them are fine.

 

Based on what I've been reading via following the Nakaya posts for a while, I'd say there is almost a 50% rate of problematic nibs when the pens are purchased from the manufacturer directly (the problems ranging from scratchiness to flow issues).

 

My first one came from Nakaya directly and had flow problems, until John Mottishaw adjusted it at a pen show.

The second one came straight from John and had no problems, so with future ones I plan to follow this route as well.

 

I agree, the process through John was wonderful and the pen writes wonderfully!

[Flourish]

When a Nakaya is putting ink to paper it is truly one of the greatest modern fountain pen writing experiences around but when it goes into Diva mode it's the biggest pain in the butt I have ever experienced in a fountain pen. There are many factors that can help contribute to a Nakaya's decision to write or not.

 

1) Japanese nibs and therefore feeds run smaller than European and in the fine extra fine and super extra fine sizes the feed used is downright microscopic. Don't forget that Japanese characters are written in many small strokes while european characters are huge megalithic structures compared side by side with your average sized Japanese writing. Constant cleaning is almost a given if you use a fine or smaller Japanese nib on a Nakaya. One solution is to get a medium size feed installed but this can also highlight another problem:

 

2) The converter and feed tube connection on Nakaya's is again downright microscopic. One of the smallest connections I've seen on a pen so far. This means the ink and air flow transfer necessary for proper ink flow can block up, by an air bubble or slightly too thick ink, real easily. Another problem is that your feed can begin to gurgle bubbles at the feed tube just inside of the converter and you'll have to clean it as a slight film of oiliness has probably magically appeared somehow in your feed and or your converter. So it's time to clean it in an ultrasonic cleaner filled with distilled water and a half cap to a full cap full of clear ammonia, NO MR. CLEAN, followed by a second run in the ultrasonic cleaner filled with just distilled water.

 

3) Your ink can be too thick, even one that has worked in the pen before. For both my Nakaya's a base mixture, using a Visconti Traveling Inkpot is 4 eyedroppers full of Noodler's Bulletproof Black and 11, NOT 10 NOT 12, drops of Noodler's Polar Black. Yeah try and guess how many pages and curse words it took me to figure that mix out. Luckily that mix also works fantastic in all of my super extra fine nib Japanese fountain pens especially the ones with extra flex.

 

4) I have found that the environment is also a big contributing factor in the performance of a Nakaya pen. You pick up your Nakaya and it's writing great for a page or so then WHOMP! No ink whatsoever. What's going on here?, you ask. Well here's what I have found after taking a trip back to 4th grade HEAT EXPANDS COLD CONTRACTS. Now just how does this apply to a fountain pen? Easy, the heat from your hands expands the ebonite of the feed, feed tube and converter connection just that microscopic fraction while at the same time the ink is expanding that little bit as well, the end result being constricted ink and air exchange causing a vacuum in your converter. Arrrg!!!!!!!!!

 

5) A Nakaya usually will work well for people who only write a page or less at a time. If like me you put out on average 16 pages a day you're going to have to fill your pen at least 4 times and every time you're going to have to give it the FULL cleaning regimen. No short cuts. The closest comparison I have for a Nakaya is a Formula One race car, for every hour you drive it you can expect to work on it in the shop for 10 or more hours. It's a huge pain but when a Nakaya is working right there is no writing experience quite like it to be found out there.

 

6) Now because Nakaya's nibs are some of the best out there and the pens have the looks to match you may be willing to put up with its eccentricities that can also be solved, most of the time, the old fashioned way. When your ink flow magically stops, put the cap back on your pen and shake it like a misbehaving step child. Or, you could screw off the barrel after every 4-5 lines and give the converter a turn to get the ink flowing again, don't forget to screw the barrel back on. Neither of these solutions should be necessary in a $300-$5000 pen but they work when Nakaya and Mr. Mottishaw can't get it quite right, and by this point you've probably fallen completely in love with the Nakaya nib and will do absolutely anything to get it to work right. For example when I got my Piccolo it was $330 for a superfine extra flex nib, it didn't quite work right. After roughly an additional $600 and three years of daily tweaking it finally works the way it should have when I first bought it. Why did I stand by this pen when it was clearly an overpriced, but beautiful, piece of junk? Easy, the nib on it is the absolute best nib for my particular writing style that I have ever used.

 

Now for many people who like using their fountain pens but really don't need the specialized super extra flex nibs that Nakaya and Mr. Mottishaw make and work on and you get a Nakaya and it proves to be more trouble than it's worth send it back and get yourself a Platinum, Sailor, Pilot or Namiki instead as everyone of these pens has worked dead on right out of the box. I know but the Nakaya's Urushi lacquer is one of the most simply elegant finishes that any pen has ever seen, but no pen is worth 3 years of frustration and three times the cost to get it to work the way it should have out of the box.

 

As you can see I love and hate my Nakaya's and if it weren't for the perfection of both of their nibs I would have flown to Japan and thrown both of them at the Nakaya offices attached to bricks, after all of the trouble I've had with them. But those darn nibs are truly better than any for my particular writing style than any other dip fountain or quill nib I have ever used, so of course I will keep tweaking my ink mixtures and clean my pens up to 4 times a day and switch them out every half hour or so, so that each pen can cool off and the ink will flow again.

 

On the other end of the spectrum if you can get as upset with your Nakaya's ink flow problems as I have then I'd suggest an Edison Pen, eyedropper fill for super massive ink flow, like others here have. The ink flow on an Edison compared to a Nakaya is like the Missississi river compared to a leaky faucet. That means Edison's are best for fast writers, and those who write large, while Nakaya's are best suited for real slow writers and write microscopic size.

[rkolling]

Flourish,

 

Thanks for such a wonderful post. I think you have it absolutely right!

 

I have experienced the same problem with Sailors (1911s and Kings of Pen) using the zoom and broad nibs with my beloved Aurora Blue which is a somewhat thick ink relative to some other inks. I think the real cuprit is, as you pointed out, the capillary, "quasi-osmotic" connection between the feed and the converter. The converter sure has a very tiny opening. I have found the pens to start out writing very wet after a fill up since I am writing the ink out of the feed comb. But as I write on, the ink flow becomes less generous until it finally starts to skip unless I write slow as molasses. As you indicate, I have found I can take the body off and twist the piston in the converter a bit to rejuice the nib and then start writing again, only to have to repeat the process periodically.

 

There may be two solutions: 1) go to a less viscous ink along with periodic degreasing as you suggest or 2) take the nib and send it to Edison or to Thompson Pens and see if they can build a real writing pen around the nib. Chris Thompson can also do a plunger filler giving you something akin to a Pilot Custom 823 but with the nib of your choice. I really like the nibs and I think I'm going to explore alternative #2.

Edited March 7, 2009 by rkolling

[1000km]

Thank you Flourish. You've captured the soaring highs and the despairing lows of the Nakaya experience beautifully in your post.