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Writing Speed?


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#1 sirShiggy

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 13:43

It takes me 21 seconds to write " the quick brown fox jumped swiftly over the lazy dog, that's about 30 words per minute. I want to adopt a sort of copperplate handwriting, is it possible to get up to that speed in copperplate? How can I speed my normal hand up? ( half print/ half cursive) what is your speed? What's the fastest hand? (a sort of speed writing only for exams hand) I also don't know if I should adopt this copperplate, or just improve my normal hand, do I need a flex nib? Do I need an oblique holder? I'm a lefty, what's the best hand for me?

Sorry for all the questions, I've suddenly had an "is it all worth it?" moment just before I started to learn my first hand, what if I picked the wrong hand? I have exams coming up, so should I focus on improvement or learn a new hand altogether? I don't know what to do! Help!

Sorry for dumping my mini freak out on you guys, that is all.


edit: wrong time

Edited by sirShiggy, 15 April 2012 - 14:43.


#2 Nonsensical

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 14:13

Under pressure, writing legibly, I can churn out "the quick brown fox jumps swiftly over the lazy dog" in about 10-12 seconds using a combination of print and cursive, and 14 seconds using just cursive. I've only started writing using cursive lately, though.

So that's anywhere from 50-60 wpm using a mixture of cursive and print, and just over 40 using just cursive. That is, if I write legibly (the cursive is less pretty, but still legible).

I'm not sure what would be the fastest method, it differs from person to person. You'll get some people saying that cursive is faster, some will say a mix is faster and some will say that printing is faster. I would just try to improve what you have right now, to start off with, unless you are interested in learning cursive.

The most popular and commonly suggested hand would be Palmer's Business Writing, there is a link stickied at the top of this forum. It's a nice simple and clean cursive form, very legible and pleasing to look at.

I'm not sure...copperplate is the way to go for speed, though. Regardless, you should post up a sample of your handwriting, it may help people answer your questions.

#3 Ken Fraser

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 14:19

In "the quick brown fox jumps swiftly over the lazy dog" the word "swiftly" is superfluous, as all the letters are duplicates.

Ken

Edited by caliken, 15 April 2012 - 14:20.

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#4 sirShiggy

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 14:32

In "the quick brown fox jumps swiftly over the lazy dog" the word "swiftly" is superfluous, as all the letters are duplicates.

Ken


Oh? That's just the way I learned it, you're right though.

#5 sirShiggy

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 14:40

Under pressure, writing legibly, I can churn out "the quick brown fox jumps swiftly over the lazy dog" in about 10-12 seconds using a combination of print and cursive, and 14 seconds using just cursive. I've only started writing using cursive lately, though.

So that's anywhere from 50-60 wpm using a mixture of cursive and print, and just over 40 using just cursive. That is, if I write legibly (the cursive is less pretty, but still legible).

I'm not sure what would be the fastest method, it differs from person to person. You'll get some people saying that cursive is faster, some will say a mix is faster and some will say that printing is faster. I would just try to improve what you have right now, to start off with, unless you are interested in learning cursive.

The most popular and commonly suggested hand would be Palmer's Business Writing, there is a link stickied at the top of this forum. It's a nice simple and clean cursive form, very legible and pleasing to look at.

I'm not sure...copperplate is the way to go for speed, though. Regardless, you should post up a sample of your handwriting, it may help people answer your questions.



I have recently posted a ton of samples of my handwriting in about every thread,and I'm starting to feel bad about how much I'm flooding these forums with all my stuff, regardless, here you go.
What is art 1.jpg
This is my reasonably quick writing, I wrote it a few days ago, and since then I have been working on slant consistancy ( to very little avail). I know I am risking insulting somebody, but with my very untrained eye, my handwriting looks like a laughable attempt at italic I think? I don't really know, I would be tickled pink if somebody could actually recognise the style my handwriting actually is!

#6 Nonsensical

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 15:24

You're going to get the requisite, slow down when you practice, and everything type of response, quite frankly. I found that after I became interested in learning formal italic, my handwriting magically improved as well. This is probably because I was practicing writing with a consistent slant, slowly. (I don't think you can write formal italic in any other way...) :rolleyes:

I think you're also writing too small given the nib width, either get yourself a finer nib, or write larger! That will easily increase the legibility, and you can be free to improve your writing in other ways.

P.S A finer nib will likely make the flaws in your writing stand out like a sore thumb, but all the better for you to see them, and fix them! :roflmho:

#7 sirShiggy

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 15:33

So is italic the way to go, being close to my normal hand? Or would copperplate be better in the long term for speed, albeit needing some initial time investment?

#8 Nonsensical

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 15:48

http://www.fountainp...-helpful-sites/
Pick whichever you like, as I said before, it all seems to boil down to personal choice, every single time that this question is asked.

I have attached a sample of my cursive handwriting below (please excuse the poor picture quality, I'm in the middle of midsemester exam preparation, and don't have the time to scan it-also my 30th page or so today...my poor hand is dying already):
Posted Image


And my mix cursive and print (I now loop the g's and y's and j's, so it's changed, yet again):
http://www.fountainp..._1#entry2123667

#9 sirShiggy

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 19:03

Ok, after reading through most of zipzap's thread, I have decided on a business hand, Spencerian or palmer? I like Spencerian, but I also think at times it looks a bit odd. Is there a copperplate business hand? Is there a better style that I'm missing out?

Edited by sirShiggy, 15 April 2012 - 19:09.


#10 Columba Livia

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 19:14

Is there a copperplate business hand?


What people may call "Copperplate" today was called Roundhand about 100 years ago. There is a monoline script version of Roundhand, often referred to as "Civil service writing", there was a series of Vere Foster books and there is a section Syke's manual of penamanship on civil service writing:

http://www.iampeth.c...kes_page27.html
http://www.iampeth.c...kes_page28.html
http://www.iampeth.c...kes_page29.html
http://www.iampeth.c...kes_page30.html

Compare the alphabet on page 27 to the Roundhand one in the same book:

http://www.iampeth.c...kes_page31.html

Edited by Columba Livia, 15 April 2012 - 19:29.


#11 andybiotic

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 20:17

Trained by taking notes in lectures and copying down everything on the projector, I can write relatively fast but may only be understand by me. "A quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" takes just a bit over 10 seconds and I am not proud of it. I am actually re-learning to writing slower now. :thumbup:
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#12 USMCMom

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 20:35

I write quickly ... too quickly, but always have and it used to get frowns and "taps" on the shoulder (none too softly, by the way) from the nuns, that I needed to slow down. I never did slow down. This was a big help to me later, when taking notes and keeping up with whomever was lecturing or speaking. I'm really quite surprised (and was relieved) that I never "got the ruler".

Edited by USMCMom, 15 April 2012 - 20:36.

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#13 GClef

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 03:49


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#14 andybiotic

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 12:13

That is amazing CGlef, consistency throughout the page, that is one of the are I am practicing on now. :thumbup:

Its easy to be consistent for a sentence or two but the writing will eventually change and before you know it, even after trying hard to stay consistent. the last sentence of the page looks different from the first!!! :bonk:
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#15 Ken Fraser

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 13:08

Whilst researching my Family History some time ago, I wrote out this transcript of a will. It wasn't produced as careful calligraphy, but more in my normal hand at the time, albeit a little slower than dictation speed, perhaps.

Ken

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Edited by caliken, 16 April 2012 - 13:08.

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#16 GClef

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 13:41



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#17 gwoodbridge

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 21:11

Ken--your handwriting always looks like a font :) Beautiful!
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.

Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.

--Groucho Marx

#18 sirShiggy

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 21:28



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... :0 that's actually amazing! Here, I wrote a little something in reply, I tried an italic nib, looks better, I worked on my slant, even better, best of all, I actually wrote faster than ususal!
Whaddya think?
I know I need a smaller nib, and it wasn't an attempt at italic, but merely an improvement with my handwriting in my opinion.
Handwriting reply to GClef, re what my writing could look like.jpg
I also love how you copied it out word for word, including spelling mistakes XD how long did this take you? It looks fantastic!

Edited by sirShiggy, 16 April 2012 - 21:37.


#19 pmhudepo

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 22:17

Oh dear, that sentence took me 26 seconds... I suppose if I could use Chicken Scratch instead of my approximation of Palmer, I'd be faster but barely legible.

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#20 GClef

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 09:11

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#21 pmhudepo

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 10:02

GClef: developing speed from form sounds right to me.

I am still very much working on my handwriting, but I feel that posture, grip and motion are the basic elements to get right first. Even if one isn't going to write in Palmer or Business Writing, I think that the exercises offered by EC Mills (check out the IAMPETH website) really help to achieve relaxed, sustainable movement.

A writing method using mostly finger movement may initially offer more control over the nib, but I believe it will be difficult to use this for longer periods and to achieve a fluid style. That seems to have been my major problem last year and now I focus on posture, a relaxed grip and whole arm movement. Precision has deteriorated, but sustainability has increased.

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#22 whitelily

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 11:23

What a very interesting topic and I love, love (!) when people are posting samples of their handwriting.

GClef: I´ve said it before, but you´re handwriting is lovely!

#23 GClef

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 16:05


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#24 GClef

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 16:13


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#25 whitelily

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 17:04

How pretty! Is that "gold" ink for a dip pen? (Not sure what that sort of ink is called)

#26 GClef

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 17:17

How pretty! Is that "gold" ink for a dip pen? (Not sure what that sort of ink is called)


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#27 sirShiggy

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 21:30

I would write this out but I don't have time, writing big is hard. Not physically, but it has shown me a lot of my problems. I do write with my arm, but I do use my fingers a bit too, I found I don't really think before I write, so I get a lot of mistakes, probably because I've been changing my handwriting up a bit too, also, my letters, particularly the newly changed ones, aren't always consistant, particularly my vowels, but some letters, like t and h are generally pretty good.

#28 ninjandrew

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Posted 18 April 2012 - 03:57

It takes me 30 seconds to write "A quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" in cursive, but in my defense I only started learning cursive writing about two months ago...

#29 Ken Fraser

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Posted 18 April 2012 - 09:18

So is italic the way to go, being close to my normal hand?


This example was written in 2 minutes by calligrapher Tom Gourdie, to show how Italic hold up well when written at speed.

Ken

Posted Image

Edited by caliken, 18 April 2012 - 09:21.

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#30 whitelily

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Posted 18 April 2012 - 15:57


How pretty! Is that "gold" ink for a dip pen? (Not sure what that sort of ink is called)


Posted Image


Thank you!