Unusual Ebay Activity

[northlodge]

 

 

I am wondering about 9***9's 140 bid retractions though; wouldn't this - or shouldn't this - raise a red flag for the "moderators" at eBay? (Someone's watching the shop, aren't they?) I thought bid retractions were only allowed in very specific situations, and yet this guy or gal has managed to persuade eBay that they have a legitimate reason to cancel their bid 140 times, in 6 months?!? Whoever it is seems to spend way more time on eBay, wasting their time - and possibly that of the sellers and other buyers - low bidding on pens they apparently don't really want, than I can ever imagine spending.

 

Holly

 

 

My thoughts exactly.

My experience on ebay is generally positive and it is quite disappointing that others feel so negatively about ebay sellers. However the seeds of such negativity come from the behaviour of the few, and ebay should be taking swift action to cut out the cancer. 140 retractions simply cannot be justifiable and should therefore receive swift rebuke.

That ebay do not take action is the concern I have.

Edited April 2, 2015 by northlodge

[Cryptos]

 

I am wondering about 9***9's 140 bid retractions though; wouldn't this - or shouldn't this - raise a red flag for the "moderators" at eBay? (Someone's watching the shop, aren't they?) I thought bid retractions were only allowed in very specific situations, and yet this guy or gal has managed to persuade eBay that they have a legitimate reason to cancel their bid 140 times, in 6 months?!? Whoever it is seems to spend way more time on eBay, wasting their time - and possibly that of the sellers and other buyers - low bidding on pens they apparently don't really want, than I can ever imagine spending.

 

Exactly. This is why it came to my attention. I kept seeing the same seller number coming up again and again, so I started digging.

[tfwall]

Bidders have been anonymous for several years now. 9***9 as well as the other permutations of 1234567890***1234567890 (how many are there, one hundred?) are assigned simultaneously to many thousands of bidders constantly throughout eBay.

 

This. It is difficult to determine if the OP is seeing one bidder, especially since as they mentioned, the feedback numbers are changing.

 

 

Id be interested to hear how many positive stories come out of ebay. When watch collecting it was a big no no for me and I have never had the confidence to buy anything from it. Collecting quality pens is I would assume even more difficult in separating the fakes from the genuine models and when you see such actions as the above it merely further strengthens my belief that it is full of unscrupulous characters - am I wrong?

 

Been on eBay for about 20 yrs. One bad transaction early on and hundreds of good ones.

 

 

I suspect that there are people out there who are just up on eBay to be the fly in the ointment. I see a lot of bidders that come in and place multiple, incremental bids until they are the top bidder, and then, they usually stop bidding.

 

I'm not sure why you think this makes them "flies in the ointment"? Placing multiple incremental bids and then stopping once you are the top bidder is pretty much the definition of how bidders behave in an auction.

[gweimer1]

 

I'm not sure why you think this makes them "flies in the ointment"? Placing multiple incremental bids and then stopping once you are the top bidder is pretty much the definition of how bidders behave in an auction.

 

It's my speculation that some of this bidding has no intention of buying, or want of the item. It's more of a disruptive action, and generally annoying prank activity. I understand someone placing several bids in small increments, but these come in a very consistent pattern - there may be 10-15 bids within a very few minutes and always at the minimum increase, it will generally be a few days before the end of the auction (and frequently after the very first bid), and they won't bid again after they have hit top bid and THEN been outbid by someone else. It just doesn't look like earnest bidding.

[Cryptos]

 

I'm not sure why you think this makes them "flies in the ointment"? Placing multiple incremental bids and then stopping once you are the top bidder is pretty much the definition of how bidders behave in an auction.

 

I am reasonably certain that 9***9 is the same person each time. The behaviour and the 'recent activity' is identical every time I check. They generally do not bid incrementally, but drop one bid at the start and then leave and never return. That, and the number of retractions are red flags. Perhaps this is simply how they operate and there is nothing shady going on, but you know I am not the only one who takes a keen interest in online behaviours. I have also noted a nubmer of other bidders who routinely are associated with specific sellers and who never win any auctions from same. Thing is, the behaviour is there for anyone to see and analyse. I am not accusing anyone of anything specific here, only voicing a concern over what is clearly not a random pattern.

[tfwall]

 

It's my speculation that some of this bidding has no intention of buying, or want of the item. It's more of a disruptive action, and generally annoying prank activity. I understand someone placing several bids in small increments, but these come in a very consistent pattern - there may be 10-15 bids within a very few minutes and always at the minimum increase, it will generally be a few days before the end of the auction (and frequently after the very first bid), and they won't bid again after they have hit top bid and THEN been outbid by someone else. It just doesn't look like earnest bidding.

 

I still don't grasp what you are saying.

 

If I am trying to win an auction against either eBay's "earlier bid wins" policy with another bidder(s) or trying to clear a hidden reserve set by the seller, then it is certainly reasonable (and indeed encouraged by eBay) to make multiple incremental bids. I have no way of knowing either the reserve or the top bid and I may just be below it (or exactly at in the case of "earlier wins") and so it is quite reasonable to bid again in the minimum increment allowed by the auction ($1, 0.50 or whatever it is). Certainly, if I become highest bidder at that price, it is again reasonable for me to stop bidding and hope that I have out-priced all competitors.

 

If I am bidding on many auctions, it also seems reasonable that I would not return to re-bid if outbid days later, either because I have already accounted for the max price that I am willing to pay, I am occupied with new auctions (cheaper prices, nicer conditions, &c) and am okay losing that auction or I just am unaware that I have been outbid.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Chemyst

[inkstainedruth]

I've seen something else recently, and even found it on one of my own listings. I suspect that there are people out there who are just up on eBay to be the fly in the ointment. I see a lot of bidders that come in and place multiple, incremental bids until they are the top bidder, and then, they usually stop bidding. It's my guess that all they are doing is forcing the price up, with no real connection to the seller, nor any interest in buying. Cyber pranksters.

A friend of mine used to do that at live auctions (not necessarily for pens). She'd spot the people in the house who were dealers, and bid them up to amuse herself and make the dealers pay more than they thought they'd be able to get away with. I think it was because she knew those dealers were going to try to get stuff really cheaply, and then resell at a huge markup.

If this person is doing that on a lot of different auctions, from a lot of different sellers, I'm wondering if they're just bored and passing the time (not even to the level of cyber pranksters). I also wonder if it's someone who has maximum bids but doesn't expect (for what other reason) to actually win the item, and the retractions are from when they find they've actually won something.

It never occurred to me that bidding stops an item from being sold as a BiN or a Make an Offer (because often the bidding exceeds the just pay and be done price). It would be interesting to see stats on how often that's done. But then, I bid on things that I want, and ignore the things I don't. I will watch things sometimes, to see what the price may go up to. Or to see if anyone actually bites (watched a Pelikan with this insane OBBBBB nib for a couple of months, just to see what would happen -- the BiN price might have been fair for what it was, but also *way* beyond what I could ever hope to pay for a pen without winning the lottery....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[inkstainedruth]

I am another eBay purchaser with a lot of positive experiences. There are some very knowledgeable sellers there, and you can buy from them with complete confidence. There are a lot more sellers who know next to nothing about fountain pens, and whose descriptions are not accurate. Only buy from those sellers if they accept returns and if their feedback is at least 99% positive.

That positive feedback would not have helped me in the case where I ended up opening a dispute against the seller. The seller had huge numbers of good feedback ratings and comments, but decided -- for whatever reason -- that they could pull cr*p with me. They picked the wrong girl -- I was trained by someone who could have been a professional consumer advocate. Dispute opened, decided in short order in my favor, money refunded. But I wasn't allowed to give feedback at ALL as a result. Which means the *next* person who comes along and sees all that seller's listings (and good feedback ratings) could get rooked -- because I couldn't then go on and say "Don't buy from these people -- run away, and run away NOW!" and there is no way to track how many other disputes were opened by people like me who did NOT take the same cr*p from them lying down, any more than I did.

I would almost rather deal with some of the ones who are selling "grandma's old pen" because they're NOT, for the most part, trying to stiff buyers. Even if getting accurate descriptions out them is like pulling teeth sometimes.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[pajaro]

 

It's my speculation that some of this bidding has no intention of buying, or want of the item. It's more of a disruptive action, and generally annoying prank activity. I understand someone placing several bids in small increments, but these come in a very consistent pattern - there may be 10-15 bids within a very few minutes and always at the minimum increase, it will generally be a few days before the end of the auction (and frequently after the very first bid), and they won't bid again after they have hit top bid and THEN been outbid by someone else. It just doesn't look like earnest bidding.

 

Then, sometimes you are on a shoestring and trying to see if you can beat the high bids at minimum cost, and then you give up because it seems too much.

 

Then, sometimes you see someone bid an amount and be high bidder, then place more bids, and you get the impression that bidder is trying to intimidate other bidders. So, you mess with them.

 

An example of what I mean: http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=311326724106&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2565

Edited April 3, 2015 by pajaro

[FarmBoy]

Report the user to eBay and ask that the bidding activity be reviewed. eBay has access to all sorts of data you can not see.

I haven't been to eBay for a few years. Out of self interest, lets try another approach. PM me an auction number that has suspicious bidding activity. Let me do some data mining and if I find a pattern, I'll send the fraud detection group an email, I just checked and few of my old contacts are still in there.

 

FB

[Cryptos]

To PM.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Cardboard_Tube

[northlodge]

 

Then, sometimes you are on a shoestring and trying to see if you can beat the high bids at minimum cost, and then you give up because it seems too much.

 

Then, sometimes you see someone bid an amount and be high bidder, then place more bids, and you get the impression that bidder is trying to intimidate other bidders. So, you mess with them.

 

An example of what I mean: http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=311326724106&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2565

 

Some might think the pattern of bidding strange, but there is nothing wrong here as far as I can see. Buyers will have their own method, thats life.

 

The problem arises when the individual retracts bids (or does not pay).

 

It is the alleged 140 retracts in 6 months in the OP that I have an issue with.

[tinkerteacher]

Id be interested to hear how many positive stories come out of ebay. When watch collecting it was a big no no for me and I have never had the confidence to buy anything from it. Collecting quality pens is I would assume even more difficult in separating the fakes from the genuine models and when you see such actions as the above it merely further strengthens my belief that it is full of unscrupulous characters - am I wrong?

 

Positive here.

 

But I've only bought a few things here and there from eBay, and and only from people with rock solid reputations going back several years, like missing-pen or maritiniauctions. I never buy anything from Asia.

 

Way way too many fakes and knock-offs floating around on eBay. I even saw someone selling knock-offs of those Hello Kitty LE Platinum Preppies. Who knocks-off a USD 5 pen?

[tinkerteacher]

As to the OP, most likely a shill.

 

http://bgr.com/2012/08/27/paid-online-reviews-33-percent/

 

Very easy, actually, to hire shills to pump up your prices, same as is done with Amazon book reviews and ratings. There are even agencies of a sort that specialise in the business. A big no no if eBay catches you though.

 

There's a great, although outdated at this point, book on the subject by a former eBay shill who did it to help pay for college.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Fake-Forgery-Lies-Kenneth-Walton-ebook/dp/B000GCFXMW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1428065735&sr=8-1&keywords=fake+forgery+and+lies

Edited April 3, 2015 by tinkerteacher

[jeffkoch]

 

Then, sometimes you are on a shoestring and trying to see if you can beat the high bids at minimum cost, and then you give up because it seems too much.

 

Then, sometimes you see someone bid an amount and be high bidder, then place more bids, and you get the impression that bidder is trying to intimidate other bidders. So, you mess with them.

 

An example of what I mean: http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=311326724106&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2565

What you are seeing there is the current high bidder, worried that someone will enter a last minute bid, increasing his bid several times. He was the high bidder at $120, but he subsequently entered bids above that, "What if someone enters $121 - gosh, I'd better increase my bid to $125. Oh, but what if someone bids $126, I'd better increase my bid to $128...."

[jeffkoch]

I've seen something else recently, and even found it on one of my own listings. I suspect that there are people out there who are just up on eBay to be the fly in the ointment. I see a lot of bidders that come in and place multiple, incremental bids until they are the top bidder, and then, they usually stop bidding. It's my guess that all they are doing is forcing the price up, with no real connection to the seller, nor any interest in buying. Cyber pranksters.

It makes me wonder if the bid retractions come when they find that they may actually win the bid and have to pay. For these reasons, I'm also one who places a marker with a low bid, and then comes back. The marker also triggers the email alerts on items as a reminder.

If the series of bids is in rapid succession, the bidder is using a piece of software that enters progressively higher bids until they are the high bidder.

[Goudy]

If the series of bids is in rapid succession, the bidder is using a piece of software that enters progressively higher bids until they are the high bidder.

 

I didn't know there was software for that. I assumed that this sort of activity (I call it "bid nibbling") was by people who either didn't know how eBay worked or who preferred to treat eBay like a real world auction by only ever bidding just above the current price, rather than entering their maximum.

 

Either way, the threat of a nibbler raising your bid or outbidding you is one of the best reasons to snipe.

[fountainpenlady]

With that number of retractions could be a shill bidder.

I believe you are correct.

[inkstainedruth]

What you are seeing there is the current high bidder, worried that someone will enter a last minute bid, increasing his bid several times. He was the high bidder at $120, but he subsequently entered bids above that, "What if someone enters $121 - gosh, I'd better increase my bid to $125. Oh, but what if someone bids $126, I'd better increase my bid to $128...."

I've done that on occasion. But only as far as the maximum bid went -- not the current bid. Ironically, when I did that with the maximum bid on my plum 51 Demi a couple of years ago, I didn't hit the *intermediate* maximum -- even with the shipping charges. I had upped the maximum a couple of times over the course of the week, just from nerves as the price crept slowly up over the course of the week, even though I think I'd been the high bidder pretty much the entire time.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

edited for formatting

Edited April 4, 2015 by inkstainedruth

[sexauerw]

I'm another one who has had generally good experiences on eBay. I've purchased 200 fountain pens and a bunch of other stuff and only had a couple of bad transactions. And those were on inexpensive pens that I could afford to write off as learning experiences.

 

I generally put a low bid in early in the auction, mostly for the notifications that that triggers but also to shut down the buy-it-now option if there was one. It also prevents the seller from adding a buy-it-now option and ending the auction early. Then I'll come in with a serious bid near the end of the auction, unless the bidding has gone higher than I think the item is worth. This, of course, leaves a lot of auctions showing only my first low-ball bid with no further action as I'm pretty strict about not overbidding.