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Removing Shroud On Parker 51


corgicoupe

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Bruce,

I have a small ultrasonic cleaner, and while both my Aero & Vac P-51s work well, I think it's probably a good idea to clean them thoroughly. You suggest taking the hoodoff but don't give instructions how to do so in that pinned post. Would you please provide instructions on how to do that?

Bob

 

Carefully!

 

P-51 hoods are made from thinner material than the section and barrel. I watched Pendleton Brown wave a 51 through the air from his heat gun...casually and elegantly. Tried it myself and the edges of the hood began to melt. Key info: the hood will probably have been secured by shellac. Maybe "thread sealant", a very sticky gunk that Ron Zorn sells. You need to melt the shellac without damaging the hood.

 

There have been discussions about The Best Method, but I'll let one of the repair professionals give their opinion.

Washington Nationals 2019: the fight for .500; "stay in the fight"; WON the fight

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P-51 hoods are made from thinner material than the section and barrel.

 

Note that on a "51", the hood is the section.

 

--Daniel

"The greatest mental derangement is to believe things because we want them to be true, not because we observe that they are in effect." --Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet

Daniel Kirchheimer
Specialty Pen Restoration
Authorized Sheaffer/Parker/Waterman Vintage Repair Center
Purveyor of the iCroScope digital loupe

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Wouldn't you say the hood is the shell over the section of an aerometric 51? It seems different on a Vacumatic 51, but it has been several years since I had the hood off of a Vac 51.

"Don't hurry, don't worry. It's better to be late at the Golden Gate than to arrive in Hell on time."
--Sign in a bar and grill, Ormond Beach, Florida, 1960.

 

 

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Sounds to me that it's a job best left to a professional. Until required I believe I'll just dip the nib end into the ultrasonic cleaner.

Baptiste knew how to make a short job long

For love of it. And yet not waste time either.

Robert Frost

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Wouldn't you say the hood is the shell over the section of an aerometric 51? It seems different on a Vacumatic 51, but it has been several years since I had the hood off of a Vac 51.

 

No; the hood is the shell over the collector of both and Aero-metric and a Vacumatic "51".

 

--Daniel

"The greatest mental derangement is to believe things because we want them to be true, not because we observe that they are in effect." --Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet

Daniel Kirchheimer
Specialty Pen Restoration
Authorized Sheaffer/Parker/Waterman Vintage Repair Center
Purveyor of the iCroScope digital loupe

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Wouldn't you say the hood , the collector and the feed all three constitute the section on a P51?

 

What about the nib?

 

--Daniel

"The greatest mental derangement is to believe things because we want them to be true, not because we observe that they are in effect." --Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet

Daniel Kirchheimer
Specialty Pen Restoration
Authorized Sheaffer/Parker/Waterman Vintage Repair Center
Purveyor of the iCroScope digital loupe

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Meant the barrel...didn't mean to start a discussion of P-51 terminology. Meant that the hood is thinner than it looks; professional repair people make removing the hood seem easy. In fact, Frank Dubiel's "Da Book", says that Frank warmed pen-parts over a flame. So did Parker Service techs back in the '50s. Last time or two this was discussed, the professionals gagged at the idea. A reasonable reaction.

Washington Nationals 2019: the fight for .500; "stay in the fight"; WON the fight

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Meant the barrel...didn't mean to start a discussion of P-51 terminology. Meant that the hood is thinner than it looks; professional repair people make removing the hood seem easy. In fact, Frank Dubiel's "Da Book", says that Frank warmed pen-parts over a flame. So did Parker Service techs back in the '50s. Last time or two this was discussed, the professionals gagged at the idea. A reasonable reaction.

 

And just to be clear, Frank warmed the section/barrel joints of all kinds of pens, including celluloid pens, over a flame, but penmakers never used, or advised the use of, this procedure on celluloid pens, as far as I am aware, despite widespread and longstanding claims to the contrary.

 

--Daniel

"The greatest mental derangement is to believe things because we want them to be true, not because we observe that they are in effect." --Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet

Daniel Kirchheimer
Specialty Pen Restoration
Authorized Sheaffer/Parker/Waterman Vintage Repair Center
Purveyor of the iCroScope digital loupe

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What about the nib?

 

--Daniel

Yes , Daniel. Nib included. Didnt mention as it was understood. Anyhow thank you for correcting me.

Khan M. Ilyas

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Yes , Daniel. Nib included. Didnt mention as it was understood. Anyhow thank you for correcting me.

 

In general usage, the section refers to the outermost component of the front end (perhaps originally short for "gripping section" or "grip section"); consider a more conventionally-constructed fountain pen. To be precise, some elaboration might be needed; "I need a section for a Waterman 52." "Do you need the feed as well?" "No, just the section."

 

With a "51", context helps clarify; "Unscrew the section" is understood as meaning just the hood (shell, or, far less often, shroud).

 

--Daniel

"The greatest mental derangement is to believe things because we want them to be true, not because we observe that they are in effect." --Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet

Daniel Kirchheimer
Specialty Pen Restoration
Authorized Sheaffer/Parker/Waterman Vintage Repair Center
Purveyor of the iCroScope digital loupe

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Thank you , Dtaniel.

So it is the hood or the shell or the shroud itself that is called the section on a P51. Perfectly understabable.

Khan M. Ilyas

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Bruce,

I have a small ultrasonic cleaner, and while both my Aero & Vac P-51s work well, I think it's probably a good idea to clean them thoroughly. You suggest taking the hoodoff but don't give instructions how to do so in that pinned post. Would you please provide instructions on how to do that?

Bob

 

The major idea of that thread is for people who did not want to go to the effort of removing the hood.

 

Your most key statement is the middle part of your first sentence. Don't fix something that isn't broke. Leave the hoods on.

 

ESPECIALLY since you have an ultrasonic cleaner. That original thread also assumed the reader Didn't have one.

 

Flush the pen.

Hold it in the sonicator solution up to the clutch ring for 5 min. Sonicate.

[EDIT] Work the filler a few times while you sonicate.

Reflush

 

You'll be about as clean as you can get most likely.

 

Bruce in Ocala, Fl

Edited by OcalaFlGuy
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Thanks Bruce.

Baptiste knew how to make a short job long

For love of it. And yet not waste time either.

Robert Frost

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No; the hood is the shell over the collector of both and Aero-metric and a Vacumatic "51".

 

--Daniel

 

What is the section on a vac 51?

"Don't hurry, don't worry. It's better to be late at the Golden Gate than to arrive in Hell on time."
--Sign in a bar and grill, Ormond Beach, Florida, 1960.

 

 

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What is the section on a vac 51?

 

The preceding discussion was about "51"s in general.

 

--Daniel

"The greatest mental derangement is to believe things because we want them to be true, not because we observe that they are in effect." --Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet

Daniel Kirchheimer
Specialty Pen Restoration
Authorized Sheaffer/Parker/Waterman Vintage Repair Center
Purveyor of the iCroScope digital loupe

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Shell or hood are the preferred terms. As they translate to the 51, the section would be that part to the left of the clutch ring in the photo below. The barrel begins to the right of the clutch ring.

 

Bonus points if you can determine whether it's an aero or vac.

 

Glenn

 

http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/n533/GEAtkins/Pens/Random%20Pen%20Stuff/030966D5-B7F7-4D89-9B9A-2C4DD9B929FE.jpg

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I'd say that the hood attaches to the clutch ring...just in the interest of precise terminology and if we cannot consider the hood to be a section, as well.

 

Pen is a vac. The clutch ring looks just like thr ring on a vac I use every day: steel-gold-steel, more or less, and consider the "gold" color to be a faded yellow. An aerometric, picked randomly from my P-51 coffee-mug, has a bright steel / aluminum clutch ring. For those who care, I have what was claimed to to be an English vac, from about 1948. Aero-like cap but with an extra-long clip...and the same steel-gold-steel clutch ring.

 

Glenn must be showing us a cedar blue, if it's a vac.

Washington Nationals 2019: the fight for .500; "stay in the fight"; WON the fight

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I'd say that the hood attaches to the clutch ring...just in the interest of precise terminology and if we cannot consider the hood to be a section, as well.

 

Pen is a vac. The clutch ring looks just like thr ring on a vac I use every day: steel-gold-steel, more or less, and consider the "gold" color to be a faded yellow. An aerometric, picked randomly from my P-51 coffee-mug, has a bright steel / aluminum clutch ring. For those who care, I have what was claimed to to be an English vac, from about 1948. Aero-like cap but with an extra-long clip...and the same steel-gold-steel clutch ring.

 

Glenn must be showing us a cedar blue, if it's a vac.

 

Spot on welch. Now see if you can do the year? Just kidding...it's a T 3 dot from 1947.

 

Glenn

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The "section" of a Duofolds or vac pre-51 clearly are one thing, another the "feed" and another, the "nib" and, in fact, the section is usually the cheapest of the three elements. If you were buying one section, Parker had clearly not included feed nor nib. Who refers to the 3 elements as a single and citing it as "section", simply, he will be wrong.

On the other hand, the first Parker Vacumatic have section but arriving at the 51 Parker, that could do it, do not cite "section" and they speak about "collector shell" or "shell" and later also as "hood" so that whoever is expressly refer to the collector shell or hood as "section" of the 51 models, simply, he is wrong, the name is collector shell or hood. And, who refers to 51 section , albeit informally, considering the whole shell collector, collector and feed or nib, as "section" he too will be wrong.

 

Finally, of course, when you unscrew the section of a Duofold or vac pre-51 you extract next to the section others elements attached to it but these elements, as feed, breather tube or nib, are not section.

Edited by Lazard 20
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