Group Buy In India?

[mehandiratta]

So we have as of now 11 people for custom hooded nib fountain pen similar on the lines of Lamy 2000 via ASA pens.

 

I will start sending personal messages also to people.

[rishminder]

Maybe we can finalize a design for 11 people and then even post in other forums and see if we can get more people in

[Lexaf]

Hi All,

 

Apologies for getting in so late in this tread.

 

My ideas about a possible group buy are maybe a bit different. I would certainly like to use the opportunity a group buy would give to have a pen more or less custom made. So in my point of view that rules out all those pens that would be more or less a copy or a clone of an existing pen or concept.

Apart from that, I have the strong impression that some Indian pen makers would already be able to realize individual custom wishes for clients. A group buy would not change that option.

I am thinking about a pen with a more original concept, and a pen that could, like a true 'Limited edition', be designed and manufactured especially for this group buy.

 

Here is my idea for such a special and original pen: About two months ago I received, from our respected member Mesu a very interesting and quite unique pen. It is an all black ebonite pen made by Indian manufacturer Guider: The Double Pen. Earlier in this tread referred to as 'The Magic Wand'

I took some pictures of it. Look here: ( and read further after that)

 

http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj504/Lex_van_Galen/DSCF4458_zps9a271cff.jpg

 

http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj504/Lex_van_Galen/DSCF4459_zps84b3bfbd.jpg

 

http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj504/Lex_van_Galen/DSCF4460_zps0d905a21.jpg

 

http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj504/Lex_van_Galen/DSCF4461_zps6e28a8cb.jpg

 

http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj504/Lex_van_Galen/DSCF4462_zpsa71ca456.jpg

 

 

In an interesting private correspondence with OP MHGuda, Mesu and myself, the idea arised that it might be even more interesting when there would be an ink window in this pen, to see the two different colored ink supplies in both ends of the pen. The first thought was to replace the black ebonite barrel with a transparent (acrylic or polycarbonate) one. But we agreed that it would destroy the 'Magic Wand' character of the double sided clipless black pen, So further we thought about having only a small transparent part for the two ink chambers just in the middle of the pen. This would give an extra and original image to the design, and the character of the all black stick would remain. The one red end on one end of the original design, could be omitted, as the ink window would show which side to use.

 

I suppose you can make an imagination for yourself how such a pen will look like. I am working out a design sketch that would show how this pen would look.

I can imagine that, with enough buyers interested in purchasing such a pen, we could ask Mesu, who has excellent contacts with Guider and has an excellent reputation as a seller here on FPG, to inform with Guider about the possibilities of making such a pen, and, not unimportant, what it would cost in a certain production quantity. I think Guider will need a minimum quantity, and that should of course meet the number of interested buyers here on FPN.

Besides being a truly unique design, this issue could then also be regarded as a true limited edition, especially if it could be realized to have a serial number engraving in the pen.

 

I'd really appreciate some reactions on this idea, so Mesu, MHGuda and me, Lexaf could work out this plan in further detail.

 

Waiting for your reactions: warm regards, Lex

 

 

[a_m]

ASApens Magic Wand. This image was sent to me around a week back.

 

 

 

ASApens Magic Wand - nibs on two side

[mhguda]

I'm really not sure what this means, and I''m worried about it. It looks a lot like Lex's design.

[a_m]

I'm really not sure what this means, and I''m worried about it. It looks a lot like Lex's design.

Not sure what you mean and what are you worried about?

 

I think FP users are going to have good blast of time.

[Tresconik]

I'm worried about the balance of these sort of pens. If we made a copy of the 51 or 2000, we know the pen would be comfortable to hold and use. Personally, I'd want a user pen that I can use for hours of writing.

[a_m]

I'm worried about the balance of these sort of pens. If we made a copy of the 51 or 2000, we know the pen would be comfortable to hold and use. Personally, I'd want a user pen that I can use for hours of writing.

 

I think these pens are not for us ordinary mortals.

 

My vote is still for the hooded nib FP.

 

But i have been told that ASA will shortly be comeing out with dual ended usable pens of normal size also - for those of us quirk headed who like to use different inks every sentence or two

 

:-) :-) :-)

[a_m]

 

Dual ended pens by ASA (the two on either side of scale)

 

The middle one is also a dual ended FP - which I think can be a pretty normal size desk pen.

 

The black one is Hawk

 

Perhaps ASA would be coming out with different combinations of ebonites/ transparent acrylics/ hybrids.

 

As to how I got these images in advance?

 

Well these dual ended pens are not new concept - and you can find old images of Indian FPs with dual ends on FPN itself.

 

However, I have been after Mr. S for such a pen after I saw Edison pen with dual ends.

 

http://edisonpen.com/index.cfm/2013/09/16/a-doubleended-pen-why-not-2

 

You will find my comment in that post (check the date)

Edited February 10, 2015 by anup

[mehandiratta]

 

Dual ended pens by ASA (the two on either side of scale)

 

The middle one is also a dual ended FP - which I think can be a pretty normal size desk pen.

 

The black one is Hawk

 

Perhaps ASA would be coming out with different combinations of ebonites/ transparent acrylics/ hybrids.

 

As to how I got these images in advance?

 

Well these dual ended pens are not new concept - and you can find old images of Indian FPs with dual ends on FPN itself.

 

However, I have been after Mr. S for such a pen after I saw Edison pen with dual ends.

 

http://edisonpen.com/index.cfm/2013/09/16/a-doubleended-pen-why-not-2

 

You will find my comment in that post (check the date)

 

 

 

 

Looks really exciting...

[rishminder]

I think these pens are not for us ordinary mortals.

 

My vote is still for the hooded nib FP.

 

But i have been told that ASA will shortly be comeing out with dual ended usable pens of normal size also - for those of us quirk headed who like to use different inks every sentence or two

 

:-) :-) :-)

 

 

I'm worried about the balance of these sort of pens. If we made a copy of the 51 or 2000, we know the pen would be comfortable to hold and use. Personally, I'd want a user pen that I can use for hours of writing.

 

Agree with both of you here and yes the magic wand concept is amusing

 

On the Design of the custom pen i would love if the lamy style pen nib could have some flex

[mehandiratta]

Still in for hooded pen.... Made either in acrylic or ebonite....

[mhguda]

Thanks for clearing that up anup, it seems that you have been developing the same idea that Mesu, Lexaf and myself were tossing around. I think yours with the ink windows in the middle is longer than I would care for - I have something similar to the middle one, from Guider - the one that Lexaf posted about, although in a slightly different version, with a shorter red finial. We are hoping to adapt that design to incorporate the ink windows without significantly increasing the length of the pen. Yours looks awesome, though. It's as if you had read our thoughts...

[Lexaf]

ASApens Magic Wand. This image was sent to me around a week back.

 

 

 

ASApens Magic Wand - nibs on two side

Wow! This is -apart from the somewhat greater length- exactly the idea that Mesu, MHGuda and me were trying to work out! Its hard to think of something original

[a_m]

Thanks for clearing that up anup, it seems that you have been developing the same idea that Mesu, Lexaf and myself were tossing around. I think yours with the ink windows in the middle is longer than I would care for - I have something similar to the middle one, from Guider - the one that Lexaf posted about, although in a slightly different version, with a shorter red finial. We are hoping to adapt that design to incorporate the ink windows without significantly increasing the length of the pen. Yours looks awesome, though. It's as if you had read our thoughts...

 

This is one of the various models that have been brainstormed between me and Mr. S. These particular ones are not exactly for me. As you can see this thing had been there in making over a year and half - when ASA did not even have a website. It has acquired manufacturing on its own brand only recently and coming out with these.

 

ASA is going to make the same FP in different sizes, different nibs, different materials - ebonites, acrylics & hybrids.

 

I had not posted the pic earlier, because I thought it was just something personal & hardly of any interest to anyone.

 

As I indicated in the Edison link - I would prefer a full acrylic barrel.

 

I would wait till he comes out with such a model (which I guess is not far)

Edited February 10, 2015 by anup

[a_m]

Wow! This is -apart from the somewhat greater length- exactly the idea that Mesu, MHGuda and me were trying to work out! Its hard to think of something original

 

 

Mr. S does have an original idea - and hope it is not part of his trade secret.

 

He is also planning a desk pen where the center position is to be a "pen holder" where the two pens on either side can be inserted.

[mehandiratta]

I

Mr. S does have an original idea - and hope it is not part of his trade secret.

 

He is also planning a desk pen where the center position is to be a "pen holder" where the two pens on either side can be inserted.

I blv lot of original ideas you will see In upcoming quarter

[Lexaf]

I'm worried about the balance of these sort of pens. If we made a copy of the 51 or 2000, we know the pen would be comfortable to hold and use. Personally, I'd want a user pen that I can use for hours of writing.

 

So, why would you like to have a copy or clone, where it is still possible to buy the real thing. The '2000' is still in production (as far as I know) and there are many used L2000's and P51's around you could buy for an affordable price.

 

I think the charming thing about ebonite India made pens is that they are hand made, have (not always but often) their own original design and are made from one of the best materials you can get for making pens: ebonite, or hard rubber as some say. The possibility of having a clone is not attractive for me, even if it would be ebonite or custom made.

[Tresconik]

 

So, why would you like to have a copy or clone, where it is still possible to buy the real thing. The '2000' is still in production (as far as I know) and there are many used L2000's and P51's around you could buy for an affordable price.

 

I think the charming thing about ebonite India made pens is that they are hand made, have (not always but often) their own original design and are made from one of the best materials you can get for making pens: ebonite, or hard rubber as some say. The possibility of having a clone is not attractive for me, even if it would be ebonite or custom made.

Well what I'm after as I said in my previous post, is a great user pen. And a 2000 or 51 would fit the bill perfectly, hence me wanting an ebonite pen to the same dimensions.

Any other design would also do, as long as it is comfortable to use and hold and not mostly ornamental.

[Lexaf]

Well what I'm after as I said in my previous post, is a great user pen. And a 2000 or 51 would fit the bill perfectly, hence me wanting an ebonite pen to the same dimensions.

Any other design would also do, as long as it is comfortable to use and hold and not mostly ornamental.

That is exactly my point: If you are going for a good pen, that meets your expectations in quality and design, go for the original. In this case the material of the body should be considered as a secundary issue. I love ebonite as a great material for making pen bodies. But there is also the respect for other designs and brands that do not use hard rubber any more.

 

The Parker 51 evoluted from a simply constructed basic black ebonite eye dropper in 1880, to a highly sophisticated technically almost perfect fountain pen in the 1940's. True, the weak point is that its made from a breakable sort of plastic. But ebonite has its own good and bad issues too. And ten-thousands of 51's are still functional these days after 50 years or more.

The body of a Lamy 2000 is not ebonite but a high tech well constructed ABS plastic, that is almost indestructible.

 

So both pens would meet your wishes. What is left is, no offence, your wish to have an ebonite pen that at its best looks like the model its inspired by. But, in my opinion, it will never even nearly meet its technical specifications. In other words, what you want is a combination that could not be realized.

In case of the '51', there is one exception I know of that could meet your wishes: the customized P51 pens Ariel Kullock makes from original Parker parts, combined with custom made caps and barrels in the original shapes and models. Among other materials he uses (vintage) ebonite stock.

 

To return to the topic: The amazingly beautiful and unique pens by Kullock are far beyond the prices we talk about here in case of a group buy.

So, instead lets talk about the nice, beautiful, characteristic and in their own way unique pens that are made by talented and skillful Indian small scale manufacturers. Hooded.. ok, if that is your thing, but equal to a real 51 or 2000? I do not think it will be possible, certainly not in a price range below us$100,--.

 

Tip: If you want a good, pre-used P51 or L2000, both can be had below us$100,-- I own 3 P51's and one Lamy 2000 and I never payed more then about $30,- for them.

All in fine working condition. One P51 is my late dad's old pen, the others I purchased (along with many, many other pens) from e-Bay, other internet market places, fora such as FPN and flea markets. I can recommend it! It's fun!

 

I also own a modest collection of new and vintage Indian pens. Some new, most of them old/vintage, all of them functional. Some lever fillers, some piston fillers even, most of them eye droppers. Some made from all kind of plastics, from thermo- to ebonite to Bakelite. Most of them in different colors of ebonite. They are mostly vintage but also 2 newly/recently made. These ebonite / hard rubber eye droppers belong to the most beautiful and loved pens in my entire collection.

This is what makes me take part in this intriguing collection and makes me willing to take part in an eventual group buy for -yet another- India made fountain pen.