Do People Understand What "rare" Or "vintage" Means?

[Guernseytim]

It's rapidly becoming my pet hate.

 

People overuse the words rare and vintage.

 

This is a prime example - a vintage pen...? Brand new. Surely that's an oxymoronic description!?

 

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=331427753276

 

It's so common to see hundreds of pens described as rare. If it means the seller hasn't ever seen one before, they should probably search eBay a little better - often there's another a click away.

[alexander_k]

The meaning of vintage has changed a lot during my lifetime - and not just because stuff from my youth is now called vintage.

[sombrueil]

In pens, my personal timeline goes:

 

Pre-1920's: Antique

1930's to 1960 inclusive: Vintage

1960's- 1980's: Junk (there are a few exceptions)

1990's - now: Modern

I realize that I apply these criteria to more than pens . . .

[georgeb]

Shouldn't it be 88 keys?

[Charles Rice]

It's a very, very unique problem.

[______Zaphod_Beeblebrox]

I like it when on eBay thay call something "rare" and as you scroll down you find three more of the same "rare" item. But it is even better when they use the term "ultra rare".

[Cryptos]

 

It's a very, very unique problem.

 

Oh, well played, sir! I almost had a seriously fatal laughing accident.

[Raskovnik]

 

1960's- 1980's: Junk (there are a few exceptions)

 

That hurts, some of my favorite pens (like parker 45, T1, etc) was from that era

[Sasha Royale]

Maybe these are rare in London. It is not a ballpoint or rollerball, so it must be old / vintage.

It may be rare someday. UGLY = UNPOPULAR

UNPOPULAR = 60 YEARS = RARE

[sd10521]

Back to the question of this thread,

Do People Understand What "rare" Or "vintage" Means?

It menas I'm likely to get a good chuckle when I click on that eBay link.

[kestrel]

As somebody else in the forum has postulated, vintage is older than I am.

 

Rare means either very uncommon or the manufacturer failed to adequately heat/cook the celluloid or rubber or precious resin to render it suitable for pen use.

[Ted A]

Rare: "you should pay me extra just in case I never have another to sell"

Vintage: "even if it's broken"

[NinthSphere]

Rare, vintage, clean, good condition, & countless other descriptors are used & abused on a daily basis by people who should be pelted with dictionaries.

[Guernseytim]

Rare: "you should pay me extra just in case I never have another to sell"

Vintage: "even if it's broken"

Haha, I think this is definitely true.

[inkstainedruth]

This reminds me of an article I read in a gardening magazine a few years ago. They too had "definitions" of terminology. The one that springs to mind is this one:"Blue" means "the flowers are *really* purple"....

Getting back on topic, "rare" often seems to mean "I've personally never seen a pen like this before, but it came out of my grandfather's house. And you should pay a lot of money for it because it's part of my inheritance...." I was in an antiques mall a couple of months ago, and one dealer said all the pens were made of "bakelite" (even, apparently, the Vac Maxima .... sadly I didn't have the cash to try and talk the price down a bit more, and the place was going out of business, even though it was too large a pen for me).

@ NinthSphere -- I could recommend a couple of larger tomes for purposes of the pelting by dictionaries (Webster's 2nd Edition Unabridged, or the Compact OED (but one would have to be a shot put champion in either case -- and I wouldn't want to break the magnifying glass in the latter). And they might need to be followed by a further pelting with spare copies of Roget's Thesaurus.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Cryptos]

At least with the Roget's you can fling, heave, hurl, lob, pitch, bombard, cast, chuck, flick, launch, pelt, sling, toss, or let fly with them. Plenty of options for creative instruction.

 

 

The way I see some of the eBay sellers descriptions is by imagining their anticipated target audience. I suspect that they are not looking to sell to aficianados, who would not be awed by the use of such terms as 'vintage' or 'rare'. Non-enthusiasts may just be tempted though.

[Eclectica]

I guess it is just like any other advertising these days which employs the scarcity principle - such as ''last one'', ''rare'', ''today only'', etc. etc. etc.

 

...call me cynical... , but the trouble is, if the tactics work, then they keep being used!!!

[balson]

rare is subjective. i think its rare for anyone to use or collect fountain pens. i totally agree that it is over/misused.

 

vintage has been debated here before. i think it is also misused but not in the way most people think it is. my understanding is that vintage is a term used to describe the period in which something is made with a little flourish. it is best used if you know the rough date a pen is made, but not the specific year. for example if you had a vacumatic with the date code stripped off you could say its a vintage 1930s vacumatic.

 

given that definition it is entirely possible to have a vintage 2010 pen.

[RMN]

You should see some of the descriptions on ads for houses.....

 

 

The word Vintage depends on what it is. a vintage Portwine, vintage clothing...

 

In pens, it is even used for all those pens out of production. So you could call a Waterman Phileas: Vintage.

 

 

D.ick

[Cryptos]

The way I see it, antique is generally more than 100 years old.

 

Vintage though can relate to many things. It can be simply an indicator of time period, such as a vintage wine, but may also carry connotations of perceived higher quality (as in the wine example). It can also mean that something belongs to a certain fashion or trend. So vintage 1950s US cars have distinct features that mark them as of their age.

Further, for me and I suspect lots of people, vintage can also indicate a timeless quality that has endured, or as a pointer to a time when something was perceived to be at its best or most recognisable. For instance, vintage Tiger Woods would be when he was at the height of his game, even though he is our contemporary.

 

And as in all these cases, the lines are blurry!

 

When it comes to selling a vendor will use whatever they think will attract a buyer.

 

As an aside, I'm a terrible buyer in physical shops. I don't want to be pestered by salespeople, and if they are persistent I leave immediately. I am also guilty of deliberately annoying salespeople who offer 'price matching' when they try to make it sound like it's a bargain. They don't like it when I point out that price matching gives me nothing I couldn't get at the other store. And I haggle. Shopkeepers (in big modern Western stores) seem to hate that. I rather enjoy the process myself.