Potential Issues With 149 Nib?

[OngL]

I have just bought my first fountain pen and rekindled the joy of writing. The pen is 149 90th anniversary Edition with fine nib. Prior to purchase, I have read the forum and looked at samples for nib. I prefer fine or extra fine but went ahead with fine.

In actual script, the FP seems to be behaving like a medium or B. Please confirm if this is the case, as you'd be more experienced. The line in script is around 1 mm width

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll206/ongl/20141219_191538-1.jpghttp://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll206/ongl/20141219_191538-1.jpg[/url]

Edited December 19, 2014 by OngL

[arran]

I have a F nib as well in this edition and it writes far too wet and thick too my opinion.

If I compare this with a 1950 F nib MB 149 what a difference.

In the end , I can live with the nib , it is a good writer.

I have a red toirtoise pelikan new pen with XF nib , but writes like a Japanese M/ B

But if you want a F nib with some feedback , go and take a look at platinum or Nakaya in the modern pens

[OngL]

Hmm, I should have gone with XF then. I read the samples from user guide and from users in the forum, F should write thinner than this. I also realise that the paper at the boutique is a thick one which absorb the ink well. Tried on a normal paper, seems more stub and thicker.

 

Is my nib performing OK or it is problematic?

[Joane]

About three years ago I bought a 145 in a MB boutique. I got the F nib and found it writes noticeably broader than an F-nibbed 144 I have from a couple of decades ago. Had I realized that, I probably would have gone with the EF for the 145.

[Kevan]

The line width in your writing sample looks like a typical medium to me.

 

Unless you have skipping as you write, your nib is a good nib. As for your line thickness issue, well...any paper that's not "fountain pen friendly," smooth-finish paper like Rhodia, Clairefontaine, Japanese notebook paper etc is going to absorb the ink very quickly and make the line seem broader than it truly would be on a paper that resists ink absorption. Of course, most paper we use every day in a work environment or when we're out and about isn't going to be high-quality, smooth-finish paper. I have Japanese fine nibs (which are more like western extra-fine) and their lines are definitely broader on "everyday" paper.

 

Ink also has an effect on line width. A viscous, flowy ink (like Montblanc's own brand, or Pilot) might make a difference in your lettering size. I've observed this first-hand between wet inks and dry ones.

 

Of course, you can always take the pen back and have the nib exchanged to an extra fine. This is not a cheap pen after all, and you should be perfectly happy with it. On the other hand, you could keep it and enjoy it for its differences.

 

When I started out using fountain pens, I found that only fine nibs were good for my writing size. Most of the pens in my collection have fine nibs. But as time went on, I discovered that my tastes started to change and I wanted more medium and broad nibs for expressive writing. And today, when I buy a new pen, the nib is usually medium, broad, or stub. I find fine nibs too "ordinary" these days.

 

Go figure, eh?

Edited December 19, 2014 by Kevan

[OngL]

Hi Joane, Kevan, Arran

 

Thanks for the valuable input. It seems as Arran also mentioned, the newer pen has broader and thicker script than the older one. Paper does pay a part, I only reliase this when writing in my daughter notepad which has very thin and perhaps less than average paper quality, my writing is like a 0BBB.

 

In conclusion, I have two options: a) Change the nib to XF and perhaps be a little happier. This approach has a downside of long waiting time. Just enjoy it with the right paper and use a different pen when paper is not suitable.

 

I've used to ballpoint in all my life and write in a small spaces, hence, not being able to see a clear space in my 'e', 'b' and so on is a bit frustrating. I am planning to learn writing better. Hopefully not to old to start writing a proper cursive.

[Kevan]

Take a few days to see if you get used to it. If you don't, then change the nib so you'll be happier. Owning a fountain pen (or multiple pens, like most of us ) should bring you joy as you write with it, and come to enjoy writing as opposed to just seeing it as a task.

 

I went through a similar situation recently with a Lamy 2000. I wanted a pen with a medium line, and rumor was that the nibs on the Lamy 2000 ran wide, so you should order one size smaller than what you're looking for. I ordered a Fine nib and got....a Fine nib. I was disappointed because I have so many fine nibs. even though there was nothing wrong with the pen or nib. I tried getting used to it, but decided after about a week that I really wanted a medium nib, which wrote wider and wetter. Doing so meant sending it to Lamy, who would exchange the nib for free plus postage, but it would be 3-4 weeks. Or I could return it to the vendor, which would be a long wait too.

 

Luckily a member here was in the same predicament as I. He had a medium and wanted a fine; we both didn't want to wait for exchange or processing times. So we traded pens, and it worked out great. And I'm happy with the Lamy 2000 now.

[JLS1]

Hi Joane, Kevan, Arran

 

Thanks for the valuable input. It seems as Arran also mentioned, the newer pen has broader and thicker script than the older one. Paper does pay a part, I only reliase this when writing in my daughter notepad which has very thin and perhaps less than average paper quality, my writing is like a 0BBB.

 

In conclusion, I have two options: a) Change the nib to XF and perhaps be a little happier. This approach has a downside of long waiting time. Just enjoy it with the right paper and use a different pen when paper is not suitable.

 

I've used to ballpoint in all my life and write in a small spaces, hence, not being able to see a clear space in my 'e', 'b' and so on is a bit frustrating. I am planning to learn writing better. Hopefully not to old to start writing a proper cursive.

 

Although the decision is yours, trying to change your current handwriting style to suit the pen will be (at least IMHO) a lot more frustrating than changing the pen to suit your handwriting style. With that in mind, I'd at least visit a boutique and try their 146 XF tester to see what that's like (bearing in mind that each MB nib is hand-made and therefore exhibits some variation). If you like how the XF writes, arrange a nib exchange; otherwise stick with the F nib and try to use a dryer ink to reduce the flow. (I've found Pelikan's 4001 series to be a fairly dry ink)

[zaddick]

OP - did you buy this new from MB or an authorized reseller? If so, then listen to the advice on exchanging nibs already given. If not, MB will want to charge you $300 USD to swap nibs. You would be much better off finding a nib meister to grind the nib for you. Honestly, I would just go that route myself. You can send a writing sample and some sample paper and a good nib meister can get your pen to match that and adjust ink flow to your preference. MB will just swap nibs.

 

The cost is low and a good investment for such a nice pen.

Edited December 19, 2014 by zaddick

[talkinghead]

What is the definition of a "Fine" nib.. in millimeters? And does this definition pertain to the width of the tine tipping and/or the width of the line that is laid down on paper?

 

Curious...

 

 

Rick

[WilsonCQB1911]

Yup, looks like a MB "fine" to me. I have a 149 with a medium and fine, as well as extra-fine. I can't tell much difference between the fine and medium, and they are both thick and wet, which suits me just fine. My "fine" is much wider than the "broad" nib I have on my Nakaya. The extra-fine, with a suitable ink (it's still fairly wet) is much better for use on cheap paper. But it'll never be as fine as the Japanese nibs.

[Wolverine1]

I have shipped my 2 MB 149s to Mike Masuyama for him to make nibs on both the pens to be made to write more like Japanese fine and medium-fine.

[Kevan]

What is the definition of a "Fine" nib.. in millimeters? And does this definition pertain to the width of the tine tipping and/or the width of the line that is laid down on paper?

 

Curious...

 

 

Rick

http://www.nibs.com/TippingSizespage.htm

 

That'll help.

 

The actual line laid down on the paper varies due to writing pressure, the ink used, the paper, etc.

 

But I always thought that, in terms of line on the paper though, a typical western fine was around 0.5mm. And a broad would be anywhere from 0.7-0.8 depending on manufacturer.

[Avantix]

I have this exact pen in the 90th and can tell you that paper will show the most variation. On quality Rhodia for example it will behave more like a fine with any ink I've tried. On run of the mill copy papers though it could be mistaken for broad or a heavy medium.

[OngL]

I have this exact pen in the 90th and can tell you that paper will show the most variation. On quality Rhodia for example it will behave more like a fine with any ink I've tried. On run of the mill copy papers though it could be mistaken for broad or a heavy medium.

 

Hi Avantix,

 

Yes, it seems this is the best conclusion that I can draw. The right paper for the ink and pen. I tried on moleskine and their clones, some 'shadow' can be seen on the other side of the page, hence, writing double sided would not be best.

 

a B5 Rhodia notebook using Clairfontaine paper costs around US$ 25 USD, any alternatives?

[Mister Mont Blanc]

 

Hi Avantix,

 

Yes, it seems this is the best conclusion that I can draw. The right paper for the ink and pen. I tried on moleskine and their clones, some 'shadow' can be seen on the other side of the page, hence, writing double sided would not be best.

 

a B5 Rhodia notebook using Clairfontaine paper costs around US$ 25 USD, any alternatives?

I've seen that notebook before and didn't understand why Rhodia was not using Rhodia paper..? Anywhoodles, you can buy a standard 80 sheet pad in A4 size for about $10 which is what I use, or you can get really small pads for like $2 which I like for testing or doodling because it doesn't waste a whole big sheet.

[OngL]

I have some new findings around this. It seems my F nibs is behaving like M because of the paper. I have yet to get my hand on Rhodia paper to use, but I can already see the different by using 2 pens (146 and Heritage 1912) on same ink but different paper, the result is different.

 

Interestingly, I switched ink from permanent black to mystery (normal) black and the ink is wetter. So, it is a combination of ink, paper and nib size.

 

I'll get a permanent ink and rhodia paper to experiment around. At this point, I have lots of bleeding and feathering.

[TLMG]

I send ALL my new MBs out to get ground to a "true" whatever-I-expected. It's sort of my "tax" ... I expect it and there is no way around it.

 

Talk to Mike over at Mike it Work. He rocks.

[OngL]

Finally, I was able to go to the _only_ store that sells Rhodia paper. I grabbed a few pads and tested them. The first impression was excellent and when I got home to do a comparison, it attested my first impression. No wonder, there has been rave reviews about this paper.

 

Earlier on, I was quite frustrated with feathering and thinking the fine nib would be an issue. Apparently, the paper made a big difference.

 

I scanned the writing from 3 papers:

a. Rhodia 90 grams

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll206/ongl/SCN_0001-Rhodia.jpg

 

b. Random notebook (~ 70 grams)

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll206/ongl/SCN_0001-Notebook.jpg

 

c. GrandLuxe notebook (~ 100 grams)

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll206/ongl/SCN_0001-GrandLuxe.jpg

 

Grandluxe, being the thickest paper at 100 gram, fares the worst. This also bring me to another conclusion that the fine nib of 149 is thicker than Heritage 1912.

 

I hope this helps everyone who started their journey recently as I did.

[danrodcard]

Try another ink too. The mystery black ink fethers in cheap paper.