Nib Choices, Which Way Do I Go?

[Ian the Jock]

Ok, so I'm new to FPs, (3 pens, and 1 put away for christmas from my wife) but like everyone else when starting, I just want to buy pens, pens, pens, however, I got into a discussion on another thread, about "flex" and decided I wanted to have a go.

With money I will be receiving at Christmas I had decided on getting a flex nib pen or something with a nib that can allow a litter more creativity.

My budget won't be high as I want to get some inks etc as well so I have been looking at pens around the £20-£25 mark. (still a ridiculous amount of money for a pen, according to my wife)

On reading the forums, the noodlers ahab seems to be the initial "weapon of choice" for those looking to go down this route, however, I'm not really sure about the looks of the ahab (aesthetics right, or wrong will play a large part in the building of my collection) although there are other noodlers pens for around the same price (£20) which might fit the bill.

I had settled on a noodlers pen of some description, until while raking around online, I found a Manuscript Master Italic pen, which I've pictured below.

This pen has a 1.1 italic nib where the broad line and appearance certainly suits my taste more than the Ahab.

 

I am now left with the question of "which would be best"?

Am I correct in assuming that with the flex nib, the variation is produced by applying varying pressure while writing causing the tines to spread and lay down a wider/thicker/varied line. Whereas with the italic nib, changing the angle at which you hold the pen when writing produces the variation, which if correct, would make it more of a "tricky gig" for a newcomer to produce decent results, compared with the Ahab, which would be a bit easier as applying more or less pressure would seem easier than changing the angle.

 

I tend to hold my pen at a bit of an angle anyway, so would this mean I would need to really change the angle to produce the variation as I would be starting out at the angle normally used to create the variation when using a more "upright" grip.

 

So!

 

Would the noodlers flex pens be a better starting point or should I just buy the Manuscript and have a bit of an experiment and have fun practicing with the italic nib.

All views are much appreciated.

Thanks

Ian

 

[doggonecarl]

Italic nibs are the quickest and easiest way to add line variation to one's handwriting. Flex takes some practice. "Real" flex, purists will say, can only be accomplished with vintage flex pens.

 

That said, you can buy a Noodler's pen and exchange the flex nib with a #6 stub or italic nibs that are sold separately.

[Ted A]

I prefer a stub or italic to a flex nib. I am much more in control of them.

 

I'm not familiar with that model of Manuscript. I have found Manuscripts at US hobby stores which cost less than $20 and include 4 or 5 interchangeable sections and nibs of different sizes. I like the line variation of the Manuscripts. They have quite a lot of variation but are really quite smooth. The downside is that the pen bodies themselves are cheap and the sectiosn are thinner than I like. So it is not as enjoyable to use as I would like.

 

The one you've pictured looks like it would be fairly comfortable to use. If it's the same price range as the Noodler's pens, I would jump on it.

[Ian the Jock]

Italic nibs are the quickest and easiest way to add line variation to one's handwriting. Flex takes some practice. "Real" flex, purists will say, can only be accomplished with vintage flex pens.

 

That said, you can buy a Noodler's pen and exchange the flex nib with a #6 stub or italic nibs that are sold separately.

Is it quite an easy operation then, changing the nibs on the Noodlers pen?

I have no experience at all with regards to "tinkering" but I'm sure that with all of the advice available on here I'd be able to manage.

But would that just turn the noodlers into a pen with an italic nib, or would the replacement nib have "flex" like the original.

[Ian the Jock]

I prefer a stub or italic to a flex nib. I am much more in control of them.

 

I'm not familiar with that model of Manuscript. I have found Manuscripts at US hobby stores which cost less than $20 and include 4 or 5 interchangeable sections and nibs of different sizes. I like the line variation of the Manuscripts. They have quite a lot of variation but are really quite smooth. The downside is that the pen bodies themselves are cheap and the sectiosn are thinner than I like. So it is not as enjoyable to use as I would like.

 

The one you've pictured looks like it would be fairly comfortable to use. If it's the same price range as the Noodler's pens, I would jump on it.

 

There are more detailed pics of the pen on the store website and it looks quite a decent pen, and to be honest, I am leaning more towards it than the Ahab at the minute, and more so after reading yours' and doggonecarls' views.

The views of the folks on fpn, and the for and against arguments for each pen/nib will play a big part in my eventual choice, and it's all part of the fun after all.

[Lou Erickson]

The Ahab is a fine pen, if you're willing to tinker with it to get it right. It is not a pen that works perfectly out of the box; it's intended to be user-serviceable and means you will probably have to do some of those things yourself.

 

The biggest two are to make sure the nib is seated properly (which takes nothing more than your fingers and paying attention, and watching one of many videos around the 'net) and to heat set the nib onto the feed. Again, the tools required are simple - boiling water, your fingers, and a good dose of care. And again, the Internet has videos on how to do it.

 

Add to that that the Ahab isn't very flxey out of the box - it does flex, but it's somewhat stiff - and you might be disappointed. Again, that can be changed - there's a thread here on how to add flex, and it looks easy and the tools are simple - but you have to file the sides of the nib to a different shape.

 

If that sounds like fun, the Ahab is a fine choice. (I think it sounds like fun. You may not; entirely up to you.)

 

If it doesn't sound like fun, you might consider a different pen.

 

For really affordable real amazing flex, you might consider dip pens. You need a holder - just a few dollars - and a pen (what we'd call the nib on a fountain pen) which is also just a few bucks. And some ink, also cheap. In the US, it's $20 or less to get a set of dip pens to try, and not much more to get really good ones. And you'll have lots and lots of flex.

 

As others have said, you might enjoy a stub just as much or more, and they're easier to deal with, and much more available new than good flex pens.

[Cryptos]

If you really want a more flexible nib on a fountain pen then I would say, from a beginner's perspective (as I am one), that you should look at Eversharp Skylines, Mabie Todd (Blackbirds and Swans), or some of the modern Pilot soft nibs. They are flexible rather than true wet noodle type flex nibs, as far as I understand it, and therefore a little more forgiving for the beginner. I currently have a Blackbird inked up that is fun to use. Does take practice though.

 

If you want to save your money for the moment and just have a go at flex nibs then I whole-heartedly recommend getting some dip pens. A simple holder will set you back $4, nibs can be had for $1-$2 each. Not going to be easily portable but at this point you should be looking to practice at home. I wholeheartedly recommend Zebra G nibs as being the easiest entry to pointed pens I have tried. And Hiro 41 nibs are super flexible. Both are great for beginners and readily available from places like Paper & Ink Arts (just a satisfied customer yadda yadda). Add in a bottle of Higgins Eternal, Sumi ink or Rohrer & Klingner Salix ink and you are goo to have some fun.

 

If you like the dip nibs like the Zebra G (nicely flexible) you could save your money now and go for one of Presto Tenebroso's offerings from the Desiderata Pen Company. They will set you back around $100 (60GBP) but combine the dip nib with a fountian pen body. Beyond getting lucky in the vintage pen market they are probably the closest thing you'll get to vintage flex this side of several hundred dollars.

 

Not tried one yet myself, pretty unlikely to (no cash for a while) but they look fab and reviews are all positive.

 

Above all else, have fun!

[Floreat]

Ooooh those Desiderata pens look awesome. I've just treated myself to one.....can't wait to try it if I ever manage to go to any UK meet ups I'll bring it with me for others to try

[ac12]

My preferred choice is a dip pen/nib in an oblique holder. But this is a fixed location setup. I did try to travel with it, and the ink leaked out of the bottle...ugh. Using a dip pen is also a SLOW writing setup, not for writing fast or a LOT of Christmas cards.

It is a LOT cheaper to try flex with a dip pen and a bowl, stub or pointed dip pen/nib rather than a fountain pen. And a ruined dip pen/nib is only $1 or 2 to replace. I used a bowl and stub nib as my starter nibs for dip pen writing.

 

My practical choice is a stub nib, specifically a Lamy joy with a 1.1 nib. This is portable and gives easy line variation, without the hassles of a dip pen.

Edited November 21, 2014 by ac12

[Kataphract]

My recommendation would be a stub pen of some kind over a flex. Not much in the price range you are talking about beyond the Noodler's, and as others have noted, they can be fussy (many do work fine right out of the box - mine did, but after two years it has gotten fussy). A reliable stub (kind of an italic with rounded edges to make it easier to write with) would probably be easier than a flex pen. I've been using dip pens for drawing for years and they have a much steeper learning curve. You don't really have to do anything while using a stub pen beyond keeping it an an ideal angle, and lots of pens should be available in your price range to find what pleases you aesthetically.

[Ian the Jock]

Brilliant, you guys on here are so helful.

It just shows you, in my naivety I would have thought a flex pen would have been more suited to a newbie, and left to my own devices I would just have gone for a noodlers, but not now.

I just had a bit of good fortune minutes ago.

The manuscript pictured at the start of the thread is for sale in a few UK pen shops for £20-£22.50, but after a bit of bartering with a guy on ebay I managed to get the same pen, 1.1 italic stub, brand new and sealed in it's box for £7, which is around usd $10 ....Result.

It should be here Tues. Weds. and I'll post how I get on.....can't wait.

Many thanks to you guys on here, you have all helped set me in the right direction which I appreciate greatly.

My new hobby is already great fun with a great deal of help from FPN and members.

 

Ian

[Ian the Jock]

Brilliant, you guys on here are so helful.

It just shows you, in my naivety I would have thought a flex pen would have been more suited to a newbie, and left to my own devices I would just have gone for a noodlers, but not now.

I also just had a bit of good fortune minutes ago, believe it or not.

The manuscript pictured at the start of the thread is for sale in a few UK pen sho ps, and pen sellers on ebay for £20-£22.50, but after a bit of bartering with a guy on ebay with no pen connections, I managed to get the same pen, 1.1 italic stub, brand new and sealed in it's box for £7, which is around usd $10 ....Result.

It should be here Tues. Weds. and I'll post how I get on.....can't wait.

Many thanks to you guys on here, you have all helped set me in the right direction which I appreciate greatly.

My new hobby is already great fun with a great deal of help from FPN and its members.

 

Ian

[Ian the Jock]

Sorry, I'm using my phone and don't know why it posted twice.

Hmm technology!

[Ian the Jock]

Well, my manuscript Master arrived yesterday.

First impressions were good, it came in it's own branded metal box with 3 ink cartridges.

Pretty ordinary looking black pen, with a textured rubbery feel, which feels comfortable in the hand, and appears well made.

I flushed it, popped a cart. in and away we went.

It's brilliant, nice and smooth, and great fun.

I had a bit of a mess about and I really like it. The broader line is excellent and really gives depth and variation when writing.

All in all I'm really pleased with it, although I'm not sure if I'd have been quite as impressed if I'd paid the £20 which is the regular price for it, but for £7, an absolute bargain.

I've been using it since yesterday for my normal daily writing and with a bit of practice I'll be writing like a monk in no time.

Not the best of pics, or writing....but hey, I'm new.

 

Ian

 

[ehemem]

It looks like you are holding the pen so that the nib is pretty flat to the writing line. To get the maximum line variation, hold the pen so that the nib is 45 degrees to the writing line and hold that orientation. See if that works for you...