Sailor F Nib + Sei Boku Ink = Dry And Slightly Scratchy?

[Ego Id Veto]

Hi all,

 

I just started using a new Sailor Sapporo with a 14k Fine nib, and it was recommended to me that I buy a bottle of Sailor Sei Boku ink with it. Upon using it, I noticed it was much drier and less lubricated than any other pen/ink combo I've tried. It never skips, but it does seem to be like using a Pelikan 4001 ink in terms of dryness.

 

I don't believe a Sailor would have a scratchy nib, but it does seem to have a bit of tooth, and make a distinct noise even on Rhodia paper. Is this normal? Or could it be that the Sei Boku is just a dry and relatively low lubricating ink?

 

I don't really want to have to take the pen back, I'm hoping it's just because of the ink. But are Sailor fine nibs supposed to be like "butter on glass" like I've heard? It seems to have tooth in both directions; not just one, so it doesn't seem to be a misaligned tine....

 

Any help or tips, guys?

[SeeksAdvice]

Never found my bottle of Sei-Boku to be "dry." My money is on the nib. I have run in it in the following: Sailor Pro-Gear (EF) [damaged "repaired" nib causes scratchiness]; Pilot VP (F); Pelikan M400 (EF). Apart from the Sailor with the damaged and "repaired" nib (not sure that they got it right), never had a scratchy experience with it. Both "nano" inks I have write smoothly.

[ink-syringe]

My Sailor fine isn't really butter on glass. At a little under .3 how could it be. It is whisper fine. The problem was it was also dry. I suspect this is because of something the dealer did when I bought it. I have since had it back to Sailor in Japan and it is much better now. Not smoother but wetter for sure. I regret getting the F but that is another story.

 

I usually have good luck with Sailor inks (& hey who doesn't love that smell?) but try something known and proven to remove one variable.

 

Clean the pen, even just a converter twisty clean. You know where you empty the converter and take up water and expel it till it is clean. Then let it dry. I often put a tissue in a cup and put the pen in that so that the water is drawn from the feed via the nib.

 

Try something solid, that you know is good in another pen like Waterman Blue or Aurora Black or something with good flow.

 

Then if it is still not wet enough, bring it back.

[lgsoltek]

I don't think it's the ink. My Sei-boku is very wet in my Pilot Justus.

[Davis19942003]

Never find my Sei-Boku ink dry either. It's my everyday ink at school. The 1911M is the smoothest pen in my Fine pens (The only fine pens in my collections are Sailor Clear Candy and 1911M) I have never tried a "butter on glass" nib so I can't compare the smoothness, but I am happy when writing with the 1911M. I am new to fountain pen so I still write with fairly heavy pressure, but the pen is quiet. What I don't like is the ink capacity is a bit too low and the nib creeping is terrible. I have taken some photos for your reference.

 

 

[Algester]

this is the case I say you probably need to have the nib tuned in some way... I have experienced bad stuff about sailor OTB wise in my country I haven't bought one yet in Japan

[Ego Id Veto]

Since reading all this I've tried Waterman Black in it, to no avail. I then gently widened the tines slightly, and realigned them, resulting in much wetter flow.....for about two pages, before it would revert back to its original dry writing.

 

Perhaps I just need to return it to the shop? Are Sailor fine nibs rather wet writers? Because that's why I bought it...

[FountainPenCowgirl]

Yeah, I just used Sei-Boku while journaling this morning (Lamy fine). Smooth as glass. Another vote for the nib.

[Algester]

Since reading all this I've tried Waterman Black in it, to no avail. I then gently widened the tines slightly, and realigned them, resulting in much wetter flow.....for about two pages, before it would revert back to its original dry writing.

 

Perhaps I just need to return it to the shop? Are Sailor fine nibs rather wet writers? Because that's why I bought it...

I'll leave it to your decision...

[XiaoMG]

Yeah I think it's the nib...either you're catching edges (Sailor F does not have as forgiving a geometry as a Pilot F), there's an alignment problem, or there's a sharp edge somewhere, which isn't uncommon in the several Sailor Fs I've had. There's been a lot of hyperbole about Sailor nib smoothness, but you can find more down-to-earth commentary about it sprinkled around the fora.

 

I use Seiboku in a Custom 74 F pretty much dedicated to it, and it's one of the best writing experiences I can get in the FP realm. My Sailor pens are nice, but a bit underwhelming overall.

 

EDIT: Also consider pulling the nib and feed and washing them with a little dish soap in the water. I've never had an issue with this, but it seems like a feed or perhaps airflow problem. Sailors have a feed that ought to handle juicy writing fine in general.

Edited October 14, 2014 by XiaoMG

[Tanzanite]

My Sailor Sapporo F nib is medium to wet and had very much feed back when I bought it. It has become better with time. I have not had a Sailor nib that has been smooth from the start. One M has never become ok. I use wet inks and Leuchtturm notebooks to make it work well.

[Algester]

Since reading all this I've tried Waterman Black in it, to no avail. I then gently widened the tines slightly, and realigned them, resulting in much wetter flow.....for about two pages, before it would revert back to its original dry writing.

 

Perhaps I just need to return it to the shop? Are Sailor fine nibs rather wet writers? Because that's why I bought it...

they can be wet... the highlight is CAN

[cellmatrix]

It sounds very much like an interruption in your ink flow from dried or clogged ink. Sei boku is notorious for drying out on the nib and if this happens it can be hard to clean out. Its possible that is what is causing it to write dry and scratchy. Alternatively its possible that you did not clean the last ink out of the pen thoroughly enough (or if the pen was completely new and had never been tested, that there was some residual manufacturing oil or debris in the pen) and the sei boku precipitated with it, causing a clog which could also cause it to write dry and scratchy. And even though you subsequently added waterman ink, the clog is still there continuing to make it write dry and scratchy. You have already tried to widen the tines, so its unlikely the nib is causing the problem. Instead, I suggest doing a nice long overnight soak of the nib, feed and section in some water, perhaps soaking it in some pen cleaning solution or some dilute ammonia solution, and if you have an ultrasonic cleaner definitely use it. If you are able to get the pen writing well again with this type of aggressive cleaning, you will find that the sei boku is actually quite a wet and lubricated ink. Good luck!

Edited October 15, 2014 by cellmatrix

[mhosea]

Have owned 7 Sailor pens, all new. Only one out of 7 didn't require smoothing, and a couple required much more. I believe in the pens, but I expect to love them AFTER working on the nib, not before. Sad, perhaps, but true.

[Algester]

I find the Sailor particle inks to be lubricated just right and not too dry it's just that Sailor nibs even as cheap as the Crystal tend to be quite unforgiving on the hand I sold my lecoule despite liking the pen but man that nib...

[mhosea]

I've spent some time studying the Sailor Medium, Broad, Naginata Togi (MF), and Cross-Concord nib designs. The latter two specialty nibs should probably be sent back if they are not smooth in western writing, though note that the Naginata Togi has a textured rather than smoothly polished nib--it should feel more like a felt-tipped pen than a person is probably used to with fountain pens. If one can accept that, it is, IMHO, a delightful addition to an arsenal of fountain pens.

 

The Medium and Broad nibs, OTOH, can be unsmooth and not defective at the same time, unfortunately. They have facets ground to the left and right of the nib towards the tip. It is reminiscent of their Zoom nib shape on a much smaller scale and will achieve the same end of making the pen produce a finer line when held vertically, presumably when holding the pen more like a brush. This may be useful to Japanese writers in some contexts--I would not know, but for western writing one must try to keep the pointed and gently-curving foot on the paper, which I find practically impossible and undesirable, anyway. Stray but a little in angle, and you will be dragging the edges of the facets on the paper. It won't "snag" the paper, but it does "drag" in an unpleasant way. A modicum of effort to smooth the transitions from the foot to the facets (more than what they do at the factory) pays big dividends, and then these nibs are great, IMHO. Of course this doesn't rule out that the standard tips might have other problems that would merit being returned. One of my Broad-nibbed Sailors came with the tines not gapped properly--the gap did not narrow much, if at all, from hole-to-tip. This is trivial to fix, but I encountered that problem before I could handle it myself, so I sent it to a nibmeister to fix, which he did.

 

It would be a shame to pass on Sailor pens entirely. If I did not do my own nib adjustments, I would calculate the price and procedure of importing a Sailor pen to include a trip to a nibmeister who understands these issues. I still think the value proposition works out quite well.

[Fox Point]

Newbie vote for the nib, as well.

 

I have a Sailor Daks Simpson with a very wet and quite smooth XF nib, which is so wet that I'm tempted to call it fine instead! Thankfully the reverse writes XXF at least. Both sides tend to rattle, though, which I would love to have fixed without altering the way the pen writes.

 

Good luck!

[biancitwo]

My Sailor 1911 M, with music nib was scratchy. It skipped. My 1911 L, with H-M was scratchy. It skipped. Pendleton Brown made them both wonderful. Now I have a Sailor Pro Gear Slim, with EF nib. It is scratchy. It skips and is anemic. It leaves for Pendlton Brown tomorrow.

[Ego Id Veto]

My Sailor 1911 M, with music nib was scratchy. It skipped. My 1911 L, with H-M was scratchy. It skipped. Pendleton Brown made them both wonderful. Now I have a Sailor Pro Gear Slim, with EF nib. It is scratchy. It skips and is anemic. It leaves for Pendlton Brown tomorrow.

 

I swapped the nib out at the shop for a medium, in the hope it would be wetter and smoother.

 

Unfortunately, whilst it is indeed wetter and smoother, it still writes quite dry, and has a very toothy feel on the paper unless I hold it at a very low angle.

 

Would you recommend getting Pendleton to make it a butter line? Or would you think just getting him to tune it would be better

[mhosea]

Would you recommend getting Pendleton to make it a butter line? Or would you think just getting him to tune it would be better

 

It's a simple fix, if only the nibmeister knows what needs to be done. Making it into a stub would definitely fix it (that's the nuclear option).