Pelikan M205 Arrival...and Questions.

[sirgilbert357]

So I got my first "real" fountain pen today, a Pelikan M205 (med nib). Love the size, shape and light weight of it. I loaded it up with a sample I had of Noodlers Blue ink and wrote a few sentences. First impression: this thing is really wet. Second impression: why is my nib flexing??

 

Come to find out, the nib wasn't screwed all the way in...OK, fixed that, feels a lot more solid now...not sure how it wasn't leaking before, but whatever. I thought maybe it was "getting too much air" or something and that tightening the nib would slow the flow of ink (??) but I guess it doesn't work that way because it still lays down a very wet, thick line.

 

My question(s) is(are): I'm using Noodlers Blue, but had originally decided I wanted to use Noodlers Liberty Elysium in this pen...can anyone comment on which one is "wetter"? I'm really hoping Liberty Elysium isn't as wet; and it works great in my Parker Vector (med nib). I love the color so far out of the three I've tried (all Noodlers samples from Goulet).

 

Also, are Pelikans known for writing this wet? It's bleeding through the notebook I'm using and the Parker Vector with Liberty Elysium isn't (or only does when I go really slow with my cursive or screw up and go over something twice). I know the paper I have sucks and that's going to have to change, but it's one variable that I can control right now and use for comparison purposes.

 

And the nib on the Pelikan actually bends away from the feed ever so slightly with light pressure (I'd use more pressure writing with a rollerball for instance), is that normal?

[Notgatherox]

Yes Pelikans are wet. But wet is a relative term. Thing is, the Pels are made to go with a notoriously dry ink, the 4001 series, so other inks would definitely feel wetter, not to mention that Noodler's inks are wet to begin with!

 

Yes the steel nibs on the 200 series are springy, it's normal.

 

Not too sure if Blue or Liberty Elysium is wetter since I don't have blue... I do know that LE is pretty wet. The way to go now would probably be better paper (ie thicker), less pressure or a finer nib. You could try pinching the tines together to restrict the ink flow a little bit too!

 

Hope I've helped!

 

 

~Epic

[Runnin_Ute]

First off congratulations on your first Pelikan!! As Notgatherox outlined Pelikan pens run wet. I have two M205's myself. (a F & a M) No experience with either of those inks, but many Noodler's inks do run wet as well. RIght now I have Pelikan 4001 Blue Black and Diamine Sherwood Green in my M205's. My other Pelikans - a 120 Merz & Krell and a M150 have Diamine Steel Blue and Noodler's 54th Massachusetts respectively in them right now. I get some nib creep with the 54th Mass in the M150.

 

Yes the nib is a bit springy. But it is NOT a flex nib of any sort. You want to replace a nib, press away. I will write with a light touch with mine.

[ac12]

Light pressure is relative.

My nib does NOT flex/bend at all.

But I also have a very light hand.

 

As was mentioned, Pelikans are wet pens, which match their dry inks.

You can try to narrow the nib slit, which might reduce the ink flow enough for you. But reducing ink flow is much more difficult than increasing it.

If you can't slow down the ink flow, I suggest switching to Pelikan ink, or sending the pen (and ink and paper) to a nib meister to adjust the ink flow to match what you would like. Best to go to a show, where you can talk directly to and get feedback from the nibmeister directly.

[sirgilbert357]

Yes Pelikans are wet. But wet is a relative term. Thing is, the Pels are made to go with a notoriously dry ink, the 4001 series, so other inks would definitely feel wetter, not to mention that Noodler's inks are wet to begin with!

 

Yes the steel nibs on the 200 series are springy, it's normal.

 

Not too sure if Blue or Liberty Elysium is wetter since I don't have blue... I do know that LE is pretty wet. The way to go now would probably be better paper (ie thicker), less pressure or a finer nib. You could try pinching the tines together to restrict the ink flow a little bit too!

 

Hope I've helped!

 

 

~Epic

 

OK, thanks...yes, that does help. I may still get a bottle of Noodlers Liberty Elysium, even though your observation is that it runs a bit wetter. I can always use it in my Vector (which I love the way it writes in BTW). Don't think I want to try to push the tines together...I'm sure I'd ruin the nib with my luck.

[Lou Erickson]

Also, are Pelikans known for writing this wet? It's bleeding through the notebook I'm using and the Parker Vector with Liberty Elysium isn't (or only does when I go really slow with my cursive or screw up and go over something twice). I know the paper I have sucks and that's going to have to change, but it's one variable that I can control right now and use for comparison purposes.

 

And the nib on the Pelikan actually bends away from the feed ever so slightly with light pressure (I'd use more pressure writing with a rollerball for instance), is that normal?

 

Congrats on the M205. They're a very nice pen.

 

Yes, Pelikans are wet writers. As others have said, try a dry ink; the Pelikan inks work well in them. I haven't tried much of either of those two inks so I can't really say how they are.

 

The M200 steel nib is "springy", as others have said. It's not a rock-solid nail like the Vector. That said, if you're seeing it move, you're probably pushing too hard. Lighten up the pressure. You might get a less wet line.

[sirgilbert357]

First off congratulations on your first Pelikan!! As Notgatherox outlined Pelikan pens run wet. I have two M205's myself. (a F & a M) No experience with either of those inks, but many Noodler's inks do run wet as well. RIght now I have Pelikan 4001 Blue Black and Diamine Sherwood Green in my M205's. My other Pelikans - a 120 Merz & Krell and a M150 have Diamine Steel Blue and Noodler's 54th Massachusetts respectively in them right now. I get some nib creep with the 54th Mass in the M150.

 

Yes the nib is a bit springy. But it is NOT a flex nib of any sort. You want to replace a nib, press away. I will write with a light touch with mine.

 

Thanks for the congrats, I really love everything about this pen! How is the Fine nib on yours? Still really smooth? I might just order another nib in Fine and swap them out to see how that affects the ink flow.

 

Yeah, I've been mindful about the nib and have lightened my touch a bit. Its not bending anymore, but most certainly has a different feel than my Vector. The Vector is basically a nail, which if I'm honest, didn't really bother me. I could chalk it up to ignorance of other kinds of nibs, but I really think its just my writing style. My handwriting will need to adjust to fountain pens in general and my cursive will have to get more fluid with little flourishes before I develop a preference (I'm betting anyway, I guess I could be wrong, LOL). I also tried a pen at the Dallas Pen Show that had a really flexy nib. It was a fine, but I could easily add a little pressure and it would write a line as wide as the Pilot 78 broad stub nib I tried at another table. I knew nothing about it and it being a vintage lever filler from a brand I've never heard of, I just backed away...but it was fun writing with it.

[Scribblesoften]

You might want to try a Pelikan brand ink in your pen before you buy another nib. You may find that the pen is better adjusted for the performance of their ink. Congratulations on your new pen. I hope you use it frequently.

[sirgilbert357]

 

Congrats on the M205. They're a very nice pen.

 

Yes, Pelikans are wet writers. As others have said, try a dry ink; the Pelikan inks work well in them. I haven't tried much of either of those two inks so I can't really say how they are.

 

The M200 steel nib is "springy", as others have said. It's not a rock-solid nail like the Vector. That said, if you're seeing it move, you're probably pushing too hard. Lighten up the pressure. You might get a less wet line.

 

I may have to see if Goulet does samples of Pelikan ink...(I'll do that next!)

 

And yeah, the Vector is a nail for sure. I like it though; maybe I just got lucky, but mine is really smooth. And its pretty consistent no matter what the angle is. I can snap it up and scrawl a quick note to myself without worrying if I have the angle and orientation "just right". It will even write upside down, but it doesn't like it very much, lol.

 

You were right, if I lighten up a bit, the line isn't as wet. It helps with the shading a little too. Now I can see the end of my downstrokes are a little darker (like the ink has pooled there at the end or something), whereas before, it was a bold, wet, feathery line through and through...

[sirgilbert357]

You might want to try a Pelikan brand ink in your pen before you buy another nib. You may find that the pen is better adjusted for the performance of their ink. Congratulations on your new pen. I hope you use it frequently.

 

Agreed. I was thinking that a sample of Pelikan ink would be prudent prior to ordering a new nib.

[ac12]

You were bending the nib?????

Definitely LIGHTEN UP YOUR HAND.

A fountain pen can write with just its own weight, it does not need any more downward pressure from you. Only just enough to guide and write.

I think that is something that you NEED to work on.

It will take a while to retrain your hand to LIGHTLY grip the pen and not to push down on the pen.

Take a look at the attached pix. The left pix is a light grip. The right pix is a TIGHT grip.

Do some writing 30-60 minutes a day. Write a journal or copy a book, anything that will get you writing. Retraining the muscles is about using it "correctly" long enough that the muscles learn what to do.

If someone cannot easily pull the pen out of your hand, you are gripping too tight and pressing down too hard.

 

If you do order a new nib, try ordering from Richard Binder.

He advertizes that he adjusts his nibs to write with Waterman ink, which is a wet ink. So he must be slowing down the ink flow.

But email him first with your concern.

FYI, I understand that Richard does not like/recommend Noodlers ink, so he may not be able to give you a reference as to how his adjusted nib will work with your choice of ink.

[sirgilbert357]

Thanks, ac12. Yeah, I've lightened up now; no more nib "flexing". One thing I noticed is that the metal of the nib seems noticeably thinner than that of my Vector. Its also a bit longer, so that may contribute to it being able to flex a bit. I actually wrote for over an hour last night and I'm starting to think the ink is the issue. Out of the 4 inks I've tried so far, this is the only one that seems to bleed through no matter how thick of a line is put down. Even with my lighter hand, it still does it.

 

I'll swap inks and get some samples of Pelikan ink before I do anything about the nib. I've heard about Binder nibs, might be something for the future...

[prf5]

It's nearly impossible to describe how how wet is wet, in this case. Keep in mind that you have 30 days to change nibs, and if you begin working with Chartpak within your 30 day period they will continue changing nibs until you are happy with the result. I had to change nibs twice on my m400, and I finally had to send it away for custom grinding.

 

When the pen arrived, it was similar to what you describe here. But Chartpak will expect you to try the pen out out a Pelikan ink, so you might as well go for it now. They will also insist that you load ink the "Pelikan" way. The method is on the website.

 

The inconsistency in nibs, the back-and-forth, the requirement to use Pelikan ink, and ultimately the need to spend more money getting the thing right has not exactly endeared me to the product. Fortunately, the pen will be gone for 4 to 6 months. Maybe I'll miss it by then.

[arcadeflow]

I've learned the hard way that my Pilot pens prefer their brand of inks (or inks that behave similarly). I have seen a lot of people, experienced and not, agreeing that not all inks work with all pens, that there are dry and wet pens, dry and wet inks. But some people still consider pens that don't work well with any major brand of ink, pens with problems. I doubt that is true. I would try Pelikan ink first, and compare it to other pen your know, with the ink of your choice, and see if it is a great pen or not. My Pilots with Pilot ink are the best fountain pens I have tried, with mismatched inks they sometimes felt horrible.

[sirgilbert357]

prf5 - sorry to hear about your issues. I don't think I need to swap the nib out. If anything, I'll try the Pelikan ink first.

 

arcadeflow - thanks for sharing your experiences. I see Goulet has samples of the Pelikan ink, so I plan to order a couple on my lunch today. I'm also going to drain the Noodler's Blue out of it, give it a very good cleaning and then load some Liberty Elysium to see how it writes in the Pelikan compared to the Vector. If there is improvement, I'll know its the ink. I also have some Noodler's Blue Eel that doesn't seem to write AS wet (or dark) as the Liberty Elysium, so I may do the "flush and try" with that too. I guess I'd prefer if it wrote perfect out of the box with any ink I put in it, but I know this isn't going to be the case, so I'm approaching this with all of that in mind. Once the Pelikan ink gets here, we'll see how that writes compared to all the Noodler's variants I try and I'll either buy a full bottle of the best performing ink or I'll order a fine nib and repeat the process...

In the meantime, my lowly Vector soldiers on and works well with the inks I've tried thus far...and I also have Parker cartridges to revert to if I run out of samples to put in it...

Edited September 30, 2014 by sirgilbert357

[prf5]

prf5 - sorry to hear about your issues. I don't think I need to swap the nib out. If anything, I'll try the Pelikan ink first.

 

 

it appears that a clarification is in order. Your warranty says that you have 30 days after purchase to contact Chartpak, assuming that you bought the pen new, that you have papers, and that you bought it in the U.S. It's important that you honor the 30 day period.

 

Before you contact Chartpak, you should use Pelikan ink to determine whether you are having a problem with the nib. There are other dry inks, but you should test with Pelikan ink. You should also fill the pen using the Pelikan method. If you contact Chartpak, they will ask you about the ink you've used and the method of filling.

 

Changing to a drier ink may solve your problem, but it may not. Nibs are a common problem with Pelikan pens. Within 30 days, you can change, for instance, from an M to an F or swap your F for another F, etc. Chartpak will replace the nib, but they will not tune it or modify the feed. In my case, a change of nib helped but it wasn't sufficient. Another user might have been satisfied with the third nib, and there are many happy Pelikan owners.

Edited September 30, 2014 by prf5

[sirgilbert357]

Well, I bought it from PenChalet.com, so I'll have to research if it has a valid warranty or not. I would assume it does. Anyway, I'll get some Pelikan ink on order shortly (didn't have a chance to do it on my lunch today). I'll have to research the filling method recommended by Pelikan too, as I haven't seen that video yet. Thanks for the info.

[ac12]

Ah yes.

After that long thread on making a decision, this is a bummer on the ink flow.

I use Cross/Pelikan ink in my Pelikan so I did not think of how it behaves with other inks.

 

That being said, pens and inks can be fussy.

I normally have to switch inks to match the flow characteristics of the pen. This is especially the case for pens where the nib is difficult or impossible for me to adjust (like the Parker 51s).

Or I adjust the nib to match the flow characteristics of the ink. But I can do this basic nib adjustment.

[Koyote]

I've learned the hard way that my Pilot pens prefer their brand of inks (or inks that behave similarly). I have seen a lot of people, experienced and not, agreeing that not all inks work with all pens, that there are dry and wet pens, dry and wet inks. But some people still consider pens that don't work well with any major brand of ink, pens with problems. I doubt that is true. I would try Pelikan ink first, and compare it to other pen your know, with the ink of your choice, and see if it is a great pen or not. My Pilots with Pilot ink are the best fountain pens I have tried, with mismatched inks they sometimes felt horrible.

 

I think you are talking about me!

 

I do agree that some pens are wetter writers and some are dryer writers, and so different inks may work better in some pens than others. e.g., I did once own a Pelikan, and -- as others have written -- it was tuned to run best on a dryer ink such as Pelikan's own. But it did write fine with other inks, if a tad wet for my preference. So, the OP may want to just buy some Pelikan ink - their black is terrific and many love their Royal Blue.

 

I still maintain that a pen that skips or hard starts with any reasonably good ink (Waterman, MB, Sheaffer, etc) is just a problematic nib, though.

[sirgilbert357]

 

I think you are talking about me!

 

I do agree that some pens are wetter writers and some are dryer writers, and so different inks may work better in some pens than others. e.g., I did once own a Pelikan, and -- as others have written -- it was tuned to run best on a dryer ink such as Pelikan's own. But it did write fine with other inks, if a tad wet for my preference. So, the OP may want to just buy some Pelikan ink - their black is terrific and many love their Royal Blue.

 

I still maintain that a pen that skips or hard starts with any reasonably good ink (Waterman, MB, Sheaffer, etc) is just a problematic nib, though.

 

Thankfully I've had no skips and no hard starts so far. Its quite juicy and writes right away.