Pilot Pens F And Ef Can They Be Smooth, Wet Writers?

[XiaoMG]

I wish you would expound on this. I used brass sheet from Goulet to floss the tines; I also tried that Steven Brown trick of trying to raise up the tines to make the pen wetter - neither technique yielded any positive results for me with the Pilots. Ironically, I do have a Lamy that was a little dry when I first got it and flossing the tines did work for that one.

 

Best regards,

 

Chris

The tines are tight out of the box; flossing doesn't loosen them really. a thin sheet of mylar or the brass shim slid between the tines, then pulled gently to the side will spread the tines a little. It's easiest if the nib is removed from the feed. If pulled too far, you can cross the tines to bend them back a bit.

 

Pressure writing is a fine way to bend the nib but doesn't increase the flow much. You're more likely to increase the flow by bending the nib downward (also not recommended), rather than upward.

[Christi0469]

I found the EF Penmanship to be too fine for my taste and I found it to be a little scratchy, but that didn't surprise me since it is such a needle point nib. My kids both have Pilot pens with fine nibs (a Kakuno and a Metropolitan). They have a little feedback but are excellent writers. They work well for poor school paper because they are a little drier and the ink dries quickly enough to avoid smearing. The medium Metropolitans are even smoother. They aren't gushers but they certainly lay down enough ink. Pens that are wet enough to require a long dry time are fun to play with but are inconvenient to use for work. My one broad Pilot nib pen (78G) is an untipped factory stub. I find it smooth and a little bit wet. Of all of my Pilot pens I would only consider the Ef to be dry, but if it were wetter it would lose that super fine line. The rest aren't super wet but they aren't dry either. They have no hard starts and lay down sufficient ink without sacrificing quick dry time. I think I will try Waterman ink in the EF to see if it makes it more to my liking.

 

If you want a super wet F or EF nib Pilot probably isn't you pen, but if you want one that lays down a nice line with a quicker dry time I would go with the F rather the EF. If you want a needle fine line the EF is the way to go, but it is going to be drier with more feedback.

 

For the record I write mostly in cursive, sometime quickly, sometimes slower to make my handwriting look prettier.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Christi0469

[PAKMAN]

I don't understand the desire for a wet fine or extra fine nib. If I buy a fine or extra fine I want to write a line that is fine or extra fine, making the nib wet just makes a fat line and I might as well buy a medium nib.

[Water Ouzel]

Those remarks were not based on any conjecture on my part, but rather from the owner's manual TWSBI includes with the pen. Who should know the pen's faults better than the company that manufactures it?

 

I also reiterate the fact that out of the 13 Pilot pens I've owned, NONE of them were wet writers.

I would argue that a feature called out in the pen manufacturer's documentation isn't a bug, and the ink shut off valve of the Vac 700 was clearly intended as a functional feature.

 

(And I say that after 30+ plus years writing documentation for various high-tech companies, in an industry where dressing up bugs as features can be something of an art form. I never worked for any company that did that; if it was a bug, it was listed as such in one or more clearly-defined places in the product documentation.)

 

I write somewhat slowly on paper, and wetness may be more evident for me than it might for some others. My 823 F, even so, is almost too wet for me to use, given certain inks.

[Sleepyside]

I, too, don't understand wanting a fine nib to be really wet. But if you find your Pilot nibs a bit too dry, might I suggest switching to a Pilot ink? The Asa Gao that turns my Pel into a fire hose, is just lovely in one of my Pilots (and, yes, I have a large sample, Petit 1 on up. )

[ac12]

 

 

I wish you would expound on this. I used brass sheet from Goulet to floss the tines; I also tried that Steven Brown trick of trying to raise up the tines to make the pen wetter - neither technique yielded any positive results for me with the Pilots. Ironically, I do have a Lamy that was a little dry when I first got it and flossing the tines did work for that one.

 

Best regards,

 

Chris

 

A brass sheet will "pry" the nib tines apart, a rather brutish way to do it, but sometimes that is all you can do.

Lifting the tines is tricky, you could spring or mess up the nib, I reserve this for pens that I cannot adjust the tine slit, like Lamy pens.

 

Here is my procedure

1 - pen nib up, nib away from you/feed towards you

2 - put your thumb nail under the wings of the nib

3 - VERY CAREFULLY and in SMALL movements GENTLY pull the wings out

4 - constantly check the slit spacing, and test as you go, so you don't spread it too far

5 - check that the tip alignment is still good.

[MTHALL720]

I don't understand the desire for a wet fine or extra fine nib. If I buy a fine or extra fine I want to write a line that is fine or extra fine, making the nib wet just makes a fat line and I might as well buy a medium nib.

[MTHALL720]

With mine the EF has so little ink it is very faint Almost looks watered down.

[Lou Erickson]

I have a Pilot Metro in medium and one in fine. I don't find either of the particularly dry writers. The fine is quite smooth, especially given the size. I tend to use the Pilot inks though - it has Pilot blue in it right now.

 

The only other fine point I have that is as smooth - and is not dry at all - is a vintage Sheaffer with a Triumph conical nib. They can be exceptionally smooth and very fine all at once.

[ac12]

 

With mine the EF has so little ink it is very faint Almost looks watered down.

 

This is an inherent issue with ALL EF nibs.

It is an optical illusion.

If you use a magnifier, the ink will look as dark as a M nib. The problem is when you look at the line w/o magnification, your eye sees the very narrow line of ink, and more white paper than ink. So to the eye, the line looks lighter. This is one reason that I only use BLACK ink in my XF pens.

[XiaoMG]

I have dry EFs that do make inks seem fainter, even under magnification. They are certainly out there. I typically adjust mine to balance line width and ink density...some need almost no adjustment, and some need a lot.

[alc3261]

I have pretty much come to the conclusion I want one or more of the following but the ones I am looking at are all Fine or Extra Fine. Wonder if any or all of these will still be smooth, wet writers with very little tooth feel to them?

pilot Prera, Elite, Cocoon, Metro.

Any thoughts? Thank you. I have Google all of these and read a lot but still not too sure about these aspects.

Generally I don't find Pilot pens toothy, scratchy or similar. They are reasonably wet.

Sailor pens by comparison do tend towards tooth and are drier.

Cocoon=Metropolitan same pen.

Edited September 30, 2014 by alc3261

[ScottT]

I have pretty much come to the conclusion I want one or more of the following but the ones I am looking at are all Fine or Extra Fine. Wonder if any or all of these will still be smooth, wet writers with very little tooth feel to them?

pilot Prera, Elite, Cocoon, Metro.

Any thoughts? Thank you. I have Google all of these and read a lot but still not too sure about these aspects.

 

I had around ten 78G fine nib pens, and on all but three they were either scratchy or misaligned. Maybe just the luck of the draw, maybe not.

 

The two medium nib Pilots I have, a 78G and a Metro, are wonderfully smooth, no real surprise there.

 

As a Prera is a fancier body with a 78G nib, if you are looking for one pen that writes well out of the box, you might want to look elsewhere.

The Cocoon/Metro is interchangeable with the 78G. Are they the same just different colors?

 

Don't know enough about the Elite, please post what you find out. The more knowledge the better.

[Water Ouzel]

 

I had around ten 78G fine nib pens, and on all but three they were either scratchy or misaligned. Maybe just the luck of the draw, maybe not.

 

The two medium nib Pilots I have, a 78G and a Metro, are wonderfully smooth, no real surprise there.

Most of the 78g/Prera fines have needed some adjustment for alignment, but wrote well after, as well as being smoother. The only M's I've used were very smooth out of their ...um... packing sleeve.

[alc3261]

I do believe the Metro comes in a medium nib?

 

But yes, the F and EF of Pilots are smooth enough... not glassy smooth, but not what you'll call scratchy. Feedback (ever so slightly) seems to be the right word.

 

 

~Epic

Metros also come in Fine.

[Kuhataparunks]

I use the Prera F nib every day, and it is without hyperbole the smoothest F nib I've ever used, never tinkered or modified, I am so glad (and lucky?) it always wrote silky smooth out the box even smoother than a Lamy EF.

NOTE: I will state, this smoothness has only been the case with Iroshizuku inks. I have used Aurora and Noodler's Black, and black and blue pilot carts, and none of those inks wrote nearly as smooth as Iro inks in the Prera.

 

I also have a second Prera with a Pilot Penmanship nib, which is a Pilot EF steel nib. Both are absolutely superb, and writing with both side by side, I really cannot choose which I prefer better. The EF is truly an EXTRA fine line, and the F is a fine line. And what I love is both lines are consistent, solid, and crisp. Consistent width throughout, very much unlike many other FP's I've used.

I will eventually be tempted to buy a Prera in M and maybe even broad. They are affordable quality pens. Same goes for the Metro, too!

 

Also for my opinion, I have had 2 Elites and hated them both. One was an EF which wrote a thicker line than a Prera F, and a PO nib which wrote with the width a Prera F nib.

If you like the elite design, you could try a Pilot Desk Pen, which writes a similar line to the Penmanship.

Edited September 30, 2014 by Kuhataparunks

[arcadeflow]

I use the Prera F nib every day, and it is without hyperbole the smoothest F nib I've ever used, never tinkered or modified, I am so glad (and lucky?) it always wrote silky smooth out the box even smoother than a Lamy EF.

NOTE: I will state, this smoothness has only been the case with Iroshizuku inks. I have used Aurora and Noodler's Black, and black and blue pilot carts, and none of those inks wrote nearly as smooth as Iro inks in the Prera.

 

I also have a second Prera with a Pilot Penmanship nib, which is a Pilot EF steel nib. Both are absolutely superb, and writing with both side by side, I really cannot choose which I prefer better. The EF is truly an EXTRA fine line, and the F is a fine line. And what I love is both lines are consistent, solid, and crisp. Consistent width throughout, very much unlike many other FP's I've used.

I will eventually be tempted to buy a Prera in M and maybe even broad. They are affordable quality pens. Same goes for the Metro, too!

 

Also for my opinion, I have had 2 Elites and hated them both. One was an EF which wrote a thicker line than a Prera F, and a PO nib which wrote with the width a Prera F nib.

If you like the elite design, you could try a Pilot Desk Pen, which writes a similar line to the Penmanship.

 

My fine slate gray Prera writes pretty smoothly with Pilot Black, you made me wonder how big is that difference with Iroshizuku.

[jeffkoch]

I don't understand the desire for a wet fine or extra fine nib. If I buy a fine or extra fine I want to write a line that is fine or extra fine, making the nib wet just makes a fat line and I might as well buy a medium nib.

 

ditto.

I would add that in my observations, manufacturers seem to mirror this philosophy. On Pilot and Platinum nibs, the PO, UEF, and EF nibs are usually factory adjusted with the tines touching lightly. F nibs usually have a tiny gap on Platinum, but still touch on Pilots. I only have one Sailor EF which came from the factory with a tiny gap - so it's a bit wetter.

[tdzieman]

My recent purchase of a metro was one of the best I have made in a while.

[Algester]

my best advise is just to stick to dark inks with F and XF either way the F nib I first tried in Ito-ya was just fine yeah... puns... it's Fine and smooth but not that spring at least compared to the SF