Nib-Paper Angle For Italics

[TheRealScubaSteve]

Hi all,

 

I am really struggling with my Monteverde Intima 1.1mm stub to get any noticeable line variation out of the pen. I find that I have to really focus on the angle of the nib - I simply draw /\ on the paper to determine the best angle of attack which is approximately 45 degrees (as with all of my other italic nibs).

 

Let me say first that this is my first and only stub. I also have a Pilot Plumix and several Nemosine nibs (.6 and .8mm) which I imagine are some type of cursive italic grind since they're fairly smooth. I also made my own Noodler's non-flex nib into a very large Italic (after dropping and bending it).

 

Is this more a trait of the stub (VERY subtle line variation) or is it my nib angle, posture, arm movement, etc.? I have always used ballpoints or gel pens in the past and tend to write more with my wrist than move my arm/shoulder. Even so, I don't find any problems with line variation with other nibs.

 

Thanks for any feedback.

 

Steve

[bardiir]

1.1mm stub is a pretty small stub nib, that will only give you a limited amount of variation, nothing calligraphy like. A crisp italic 1.1 would give you a bit more variation, you can also try an ink that is not as wet to get a finer line.

[TheRealScubaSteve]

Thanks, maybe I've just "ruined" it by making it too wet. I'll try a dryer ink out and could always make the nib a bit dryer too.

[ac12]

I have a 1.1 and if it is too wet, the horizontal stroke will have so much ink put down, that as was mentioned, the amount of ink overpowers the narrow horizontal stroke of the nib. So the horizontal stoke is wider than it could be with a dryer pen/ink. This is a balance that you have to achieve, wet enough to give you good ink coverage, yet dry enough that the horizontal stroke is not thick because of the volume of ink.

gud luk

[Mickey]

The single most important factor in getting line variation out of a stub nib is direction. The pen must point in one direction, relative to the writing line, and one direction only. For a relatively upright hand (hopefully italic), the pen should point across the writing line at 45 degrees, i.e., from 4:30 to 10:30. The second most important factor is choice of alphabets. Not all hands are created equal. Italic, Humanist, Roman, Uncial, et al., i.e., hands intended to be written with edged pens, will show the great amount of line variation. American cursive (Spencerian, Palmer and their kin) won't do so well. Third most important is ink and paper - dry and feather-free, respectively, work best.

[TheRealScubaSteve]

Thanks for all of the tips. As far as my cursive alphabet is concerned, I haven't the faintest idea of what type of cursive it most closely resembles. I have just adapted my own way, I suppose, over the years. I've changed styling of some letters (most notably F and T) to mimmick writing I thought looked pretty cool.

 

Here's a writing sample with a Pilot Plumix (Platinum Black) and Noodler's Ahab (Chesterfield Night Sapphire) with a .6 mm Nemosine italic nib.

http://i.imgur.com/4GGVZA8s.jpg

 

Here's my Monteverde Intima (Noodler's Bernake Blue) with 1.1mm stub nib. Looking at the writing sample, I can see barely any line variation. I'd attribute it to too wet a nib, but the confusing part is that my /\ doodles have great line variation. It seemed like I was holding about 4:30-10:30. Perhaps +/- :30 in either direction. Is it that critical on a stub nib?

 

http://i.imgur.com/MD4538Ns.jpg

[Mickey]

Thanks for all of the tips. As far as my cursive alphabet is concerned, I haven't the faintest idea of what type of cursive it most closely resembles. I have just adapted my own way, I suppose, over the years. I've changed styling of some letters (most notably F and T) to mimmick writing I thought looked pretty cool.

 

Here's a writing sample with a Pilot Plumix (Platinum Black) and Noodler's Ahab (Chesterfield Night Sapphire) with a .6 mm Nemosine italic nib.

http://i.imgur.com/4GGVZA8s.jpg

 

Here's my Monteverde Intima (Noodler's Bernake Blue) with 1.1mm stub nib. Looking at the writing sample, I can see barely any line variation. I'd attribute it to too wet a nib, but the confusing part is that my /\ doodles have great line variation. It seemed like I was holding about 4:30-10:30. Perhaps +/- :30 in either direction. Is it that critical on a stub nib?

 

http://i.imgur.com/MD4538Ns.jpg

 

The actual direction is not critical. Uniformity is. Some wandering is evident in your writing, but I've seen worse. As for alphabets, what you are writing could be described as American Cursive, a derivative of Spencer via Palmer. It is not a particularly good hand to wrench the maximum line variation from a stub or italic nib.

[TheRealScubaSteve]

I do typically write at a slighted slanted angle and find that the paper or notebook turned somewhat counterclockwise to be most comfortable for me, which sometimes tends to lead to wandering. It seems I need to work on a more consistent hand first and then perhaps dabble in a different writing style for cool line variation. Thanks for the pointers.

 

Steve

[bardiir]

Well the problem with /\/\/\ is it will probably come out with line variation anytime because the thin line is so long. If the pen is overly wet and there is s puddle of ink then the line will draw out of that puddle and seem rather normal only a small bit at the start is thicker. But on writing this evens out the line variation.

 

This is a sample, same pen, same ink. Once with a saturated feed, once with a dry feed. The wet one does seem to have less line variation, the free flow of ink will widen the line a bit and since everything is dark it looks just uniform.

 

If the finer lines get lighter the line variation is more pronounced...

[TheRealScubaSteve]

There is so much to learn my head hurts! Simple but very effective demonstration. This sounds like an excuse to try more inks to find one that works well for me in this pen. Maybe I'll pick up some grid paper and see if that'll help my handwriting to be more consistent while I'm at it, too.

[bardiir]

Try to get a hold of Rohrer & Klinger Salix:

http://www.fp-ink.info/colorcard/74.png

 

This ink is extremely dry and very well behaved. It shades perfectly and if you got a stub this will provide you with line variation at any time. One of my favorite inks, this works on almost any paper. If this doesn't work, no other ink will work 99.9%

 

This is another example for this. It's Sailor Kiwa-Guro, artificially made very free-flowing to be extremely wet writing, with every sentence the ink is reverted to original again thus making the ink drier writing. Same ink, paper, nib, pen - only parameter that changes is the surface tension and viscosity of the ink. The last sentence is writing with a starving feed then, even drier than the original ink.

 

Compare for example the line variation on the x, it's the most harsh and in the first sentence it's almost not there.

 

Edited September 29, 2014 by bardiir

[Algester]

as a lefty I do see how the position of the nib really does affect the line variation it doest help because being a lefty I can do it as a hooked handed, a sided handed and a under handed grip... but alas I'm not sure what is the "sure standard" for a stub nib especially for a lefty so in my observation and experience I grounded a lamy 1.5 italic into a right oblique and started writing hooked handed it's the closest thing I could get to people writing with a right hand

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/224534-left-handed-italic/?p=3111011

Edited October 1, 2014 by Algester