Overpriced

[FoszFay]

 

You must mean the Monegrappe Miya? Yeah, I was almost sold on getting that (I'm curious about Italian pens), but when the price came up near the end of the vid... yeah, I pretty much dropped my jaw on the floor )

 

Anyway, about overpriced pens: this topic really is a hot one, huh? It's always a balance of cost of production, marketing, wanting to make a tidy profit, and how consumers perceive the worth of these things. It's overpriced if you can't afford it or if you don't want to shell out X amount for a particular item; it's reasonably priced if it's within your budget or, more importantly, how much you think it should cost, and meets your own personal standards, irrespective of how others might perceive the product.

Haha, I wonder how many people that happened to. I seen it and I love CF, so I was about to look it up, but when he said "it's expensive" I skipped to the end and cried.

 

Tom.

[georges zaslavsky]

Overpriced means for me a high price for a medium or beyond average quality control or avarage quality nib or dull nibs, you want brands names, here are they:

Visconti, Delta, Aurora, Modern Parker, Post 1999 made Waterman, Sailor, Botticelli, Olga Alloy, Twisbi, Noodler's, Ancora

[FoszFay]

Overpriced means for me a high price for a medium or beyond average quality control or avarage quality nib or dull nibs, you want brands names, here are they:

Visconti, Delta, Aurora, Modern Parker, Post 1999 made Waterman, Sailor, Botticelli, Olga Alloy, Twisbi, Noodler's, Ancora

Yes. Any product must offer good value-for-money, but this varies from person to person, hence why some certain companies are still in business. Maybe people think "precious" resin is worth a little more than "normal" resin.

 

Tom.

[Cryptos]

Precisely, it's an illusion.

 

Any purchaser who thinks that a $900 MB 149 is a better quality pen - based on price alone - than a $600 Nakaya (for example) needs to go back and do their homework properly IMO.

Edited September 20, 2014 by Cryptos

[Lyander0012]

To be perfectly fair about it, the quality of MB's resin does seem good. It's just that the actual bodies seem to be a bit on the thin side (meaning that the resin is used sparingly). I suppose that adds to ink capacity somewhat, but it may also contribute to those cracking issues I've heard are so characteristic of the brand.

 

Precisely, it's an illusion.

 

Any purchaser who thinks that a $900 MB 149 is a better quality pen - based on price alone - than a $600 Nakaya (for example) needs to go back and do their homework properly IMO.

 

Hmm, as far as I'm aware, when it comes to material things, issues of craftsmanship and material scarcity aside, all things relating to cost is an illusion. I don't suppose it'd be too far fetched to say that the only reason gold costs so much, apart from it being a finite resource, is that people say it should cost a lot. Be it out of simple want or inexorable need, market demand is market demand, and the scarcer a product, the more suppliers will feel justified to ramp up price.

 

I also lean towards Nakaya's aesthetic and image myself, but you have to admit that the name doesn't quite invoke the same level of dolce vita living as does Mont Blanc. I agree unreservedly that the craftsmanship on those, and pretty much all other urushi pens, far surpass the machine-calculated lines of the Meisterstuck series, but it's not for everyone. Some don't want urushi and would prefer a simpler design, and a smaller percentage of those users are both affluent (or willing to spend a lot) and are attracted to big brand names. To each their own, I say; as long as no one tries to force me into liking something I don't myself care for, then I see no problem with others supporting one brand manufacturer over another, though I suppose it is this movement that allows another German company the freedom of movement to increase their own prices in an attempt to appear more luxe (hint: involves a certain type of avian).

 

 

Saludo!

Kevin

 

P.S.

Thanks to MB's having a lot of money in the bank, though, they get to come up with cool things like this: http://www.forbes.com/sites/anthonydemarco/2012/05/03/the-bespoke-nib-the-final-frontier-in-making-the-perfect-writing-instrument/

 

Agreed, this could be easily matched by a proficient nib meister (and it'd probably be a lot cheaper asking for one's services, too!), but you have to admit that this "bespoke nib" business is pretty impressive )

Edited September 20, 2014 by Lyander0012

[georges zaslavsky]

Yes. Any product must offer good value-for-money, but this varies from person to person, hence why some certain companies are still in business. Maybe people think "precious" resin is worth a little more than "normal" resin.

 

Tom.

I have some 1964-1984 Mb pens made of precious resin the older formula before they changed in 1985 and they haven't exploded nor shattered. Don't use your pen as a dart and it will last you a lifetime , older MB 149s and 146s are far beyond reliable

[FoszFay]

I have some 1964-1984 Mb pens made of precious resin the older formula before they changed in 1985 and they haven't exploded nor shattered. Don't use your pen as a dart and it will last you a lifetime , older MB 149s and 146s are far beyond reliable

I have a Waterman's 52 1/2V from c.1910 and it is in Near-mint. I don't think it is the material, but rather the owner(s). Like anything, treat them good and they'll last.

 

I never said MB resin was poor quality, just not superior (or different) to others.

 

Tom.

[Buzz_130]

I always struggle when people talk about items being "overpriced." Go to the Mont Blanc forum here at FPN, and you'll see a wide range of people who are avid users and collectors of this luxury brand. Overpriced or price of admission?

 

This topic seems to have some comparisons to the iPhone 6 and 6 Plus discussions out there. People are lining up for a phone which will cost far more than your $800 pen. But Apple has also built a loyal community of consumers who are willing to pay a premium for their products. Overpriced?

 

It's a matter of what price the consumer is willing to pay for the product. But it's also an individual perspective on what you are willing to pay for any product.

 

With a very few exceptions, I enjoy the vintage market of fountain pens. I feel that I can get a feel of the past and a great writing experience for far less than what most modern pens are going for. To some, $100 for a 70-year-old pen... overpriced. Not me.

 

Buzz

[FoszFay]

I always struggle when people talk about items being "overpriced." Go to the Mont Blanc forum here at FPN, and you'll see a wide range of people who are avid users and collectors of this luxury brand. Overpriced or price of admission?

 

This topic seems to have some comparisons to the iPhone 6 and 6 Plus discussions out there. People are lining up for a phone which will cost far more than your $800 pen. But Apple has also built a loyal community of consumers who are willing to pay a premium for their products. Overpriced?

 

It's a matter of what price the consumer is willing to pay for the product. But it's also an individual perspective on what you are willing to pay for any product.

 

With a very few exceptions, I enjoy the vintage market of fountain pens. I feel that I can get a feel of the past and a great writing experience for far less than what most modern pens are going for. To some, $100 for a 70-year-old pen... overpriced. Not me.

 

Buzz

P.S. - iPhone is overpriced.

 

Tom.

[Redblur]

 

 

I'm reminded of something I saw in the mall today. A salad bar selling a full bowl of salad for $10, but a half bowl of salad was $7.50.

 

Barnum had it right.

You are assuming that a salad has a cost, and that thus half a salad will have a cost of x/2, which is almost certainly incorrect. Although the cost of goods is 1/2, and prep likely close to 1/2, the other costs remain the same as a whole salad. It's just like a can of soda costing nearly as much as a 2 liter bottle of soda.

[de_pen_dent]

EDIT: I mean yes, a company will sell at a price point that the market will bear, but that has nothing to do with the product value and everything to do with perception.

 

Why is brand creation and perception not part of the value? Just b/c *you* do not ascribe any value to the MB star or the Gucci stirrups or the Mercedes logo or whatever doesnt mean that other people dont. Isnt it a bit presumptuous to assume that your preferences on what is good value is the only correct one?

 

FWIW, I personally find a current-production MB 149 over-priced - but that "overpriced" is only in the context of the Montblanc 149 AND me. I would never think of dream of ascribing a universal "overpriced" tag.

 

I'm reminded of something I saw in the mall today. A salad bar selling a full bowl of salad for $10, but a half bowl of salad was $7.50.

 

Barnum had it right.

 

When you buy a salad in a restaurant, you are paying for:

- the variable cost -- which is the amount of food in the bowl

- the fixed costs -- rent, electricity, staff salaries, etc. etc

Just b/c you use half the portion of food doesnt mean that the cost of providing that service has halved.

 

With MB, there is a certain premium for the brand, the image, the stores, etc. That may not mean anything to you, which is fine - but to imply that everyone must feel this way or be a gullible fool is what I take exception to.

 

I seem to be seeing a lot of that on FPN these days - "oh, they are fools for spending so much on a pen" - where "so much" is an arbitrary number that the particular poster seems to have a problem with.

 

And talking about FPN's favorite Nakaya - how come paying a premium for MB's brand is bad, but paying a premium for the artistic/cultural trappings of Nakaya isnt? Oh wait, they spin a great story about how the pen is made out of urushi and handcrafted by virgins on the foothills of Mt Fuji - so suddenly, paying for an inefficient manufacturing process is ok? Outsource it to China - I am sure someone there can handcraft it just as well for a lot cheaper. Heck, Platinum can make an amazing urushi Izumo for $400 and Nakaya cannot go under $550? Or for that matter, Platinum can sell the *exact* same Briarwood pen for a lot less than Nakaya? How does that work?

 

For the record, I am not slagging on Nakaya nor do I mean to get into an argument about the points above - I am merely making a point that*value* is all a matter of perspective.

 

Bottom line: if you are paying more than $2 for a pen, you are paying too much purely from a utilitarian point of view. After that, it is all about aesthetics and preferences. To argue that XX is overpriced is basically another way of saying "everyone else should have the same beliefs, budgets and priorities I do". There is a word for that: hubris.

Edited September 20, 2014 by de_pen_dent

[prf5]

At the risk of overgeneralizing, enthusiasts or collectors evaluate pens differently than the average user. They are more likely to overpay because they focus on a particular brand or model, and they are less inclined to evaluate cost against benefit. The actual value of a pen is discussed more frequently with lower cost pens. In part, that's because reviewers and prospective buyers are more cost-conscious, the value of the pen may be one of its outstanding features, and brand loyalty is less important.

[Bo Bo Olson]

What auction places?

 

I see the bay for old and used pens going higher than some modern pens.

 

 

I go to live auctions....some times get a pen for a good price.....mostly if it's not an MB.

I got 5-6 pens in live auctions this year....none in Ebay.

 

Some times I look up in Ebay to see what they sold for....in I want them for me, I sometimes go more than dealers, who need to sell for a profit.

I paid €160 or so for a standard sized rolled gold MB 742.....liked that nib...was missing an MB 'flexi'/maxi-semi-flex from the early '50s.

Got a couple of barley corn 800 silver overlays for @ €25.

 

Depends on what price you are looking at "modern" pens.....some old pens are 1/3 of what some new pen of the same make is or even less.

If you are looking at $20-30 new....you can get better pens, with better balance, better nibs for $30 and some times less. What pens are you looking for? What nib????

 

Price of a P-51 has climbed....price of a P-75 not so much....new price 22 silver dollars....price a silver dollar today. It has come back well since the depression, when they could be had for $75-120.

 

Top of the line Snorkels are affordable.

 

Depends on where you buy....there are some German Baltic Sea pirates that charge $85 on US Ebay for a Geha school pen that can be picked up with patience for €12-19.

A 790 can be picked up from near €20 to more than likely 30-35....on German Ebay.

 

Look in Eglish Ebay for a Parker Jr. Duofpld, with a semi-flex nib. Not going to get that nib in the States, where nails ruled. But in England then, Swan still exhisted and had nibs like that, so Parker had to compete.

Edited September 20, 2014 by Bo Bo Olson

[mrchan]

Have you ever seen a really nice pen and thought: ''Oh man I want that pen!'' Then you saw it was like $800 and you just couldn't afford it. There are so many overpriced pens out there and it's just not fair! Share your opinions!

What a meaningless post. Everything out there can be overpriced. Why don't you start a post about over priced watches, knives, cars, houses etc? Sorry but I don't see the purpose of this post.

[JotterAddict62]

Last weekend while I was in the Chicagoland area I saw a Chilton fountain pen for $295.

Now I do not know anything about that vintage pen brand so it stays in the shop.

By the way the pen has been in the shop at least a year as I have been in there 3 times in the past year.

I know It will be there when I travel back there next year.

[Cryptos]

 

What a meaningless post. Everything out there can be overpriced. Why don't you start a post about over priced watches, knives, cars, houses etc? Sorry but I don't see the purpose of this post

 

And yet you still took the time to respond with this negative comment

 

 

I guess I wasn't being terribly clear in my earlier posts. In my opinion something is overpriced when the price exceeds - by a certain factor - the quality of the item. Then the price becomes not a reflection of the product but an indication of the market.

 

Example, if I have a Walmart plastic bag and I send it to Montblanc (they're the whipping boys for me in this thread!) and they put their logo on it, this does not mean the quality of the bag has changed in any way. However, I could (theoretically) sell the bag for more than it's worth based on the cachet of luxury association... but it would be overpriced for what it actually is.

 

That's how I view everything I purchase. For me it's not just an exercise in budget restriction but in whether I believe the price reflects the quality of the product.

 

Incidentally, if you take the branding off an MB pen have you changed the quality of the pen? No, but you have changed the Barnum factor.

 

Anyway, that's just how I see pricing. It's just my opinion. However it is based on an appreciation of how long I have to work to earn a specified sum of disposable monies. I guess that I am a product of the working class that places value that way. I would also guess that people born into affluence have no real understanding of that concept. YMMV

Edited September 20, 2014 by Cryptos

[jsmn4vu]

"Overpriced" is so subjective. If a willing buyer and a willing seller consummate a deal, then the price was fair. For my part, I'd never pay >$1,000 for a fountain pen, but I wouldn't begrudge the buying experience of someone who wants to.

[Christi0469]

Are there pens that are overpriced for me? Certainly there are, loads of them in fact. I am fairly utilitarian in my tastes so I prefer pens that give me a lot of utility for a small price tag.

 

Does that mean those pens are strictly overpriced? No, of course not. The true price of an item is what the market will bear. If those items are selling at the desired rate then they are priced correctly. It does not matter if they are selling at 500X production cost. I would not buy an $800 pen but obviously they are being sold or the price would have dropped.

[_Stormin_]

 

Any purchaser who thinks that a $900 MB 149 is a better quality pen - based on price alone - than a $600 Nakaya (for example) needs to go back and do their homework properly IMO.

 

Tell me about the Nakaya's piston, because I thought they were all C&C pens.

 

Anyone who thinks that any product is better just because of a higher price is simply foolish or ignorant. That said, details matter.

Edited September 20, 2014 by _Stormin_

[ParkersAndPaper]

I agree with the OP.

 

I'm sure that I will offend many here with my statements, but it's a pen. It's just a pen. We write with them. Before you jump all over me, remember that I like pens, otherwise I would't be on this site. I mean come on. Hundreds of dollars for a pen? Get perspective. There are kids starving in Africa. [/rant]