Rapidograph restoration

[Tweel]

I have an old piston-filler Kohinoor Rapidograph that I'd like to get writing, if possible. It looks like it's thoroughly cemented together with hardened india ink, and I have a couple of questions:

 

- Is it safe to use ammonia solution to soak these pens?

- Where and how does it disassemble at each end of the barrel?

 

Thanks!

Brian

 

[Gerry]

The best cleaner for drafting ink that has dried is the Koor-I-Noor RapidEze cleaner you can get at most art and drafting stores. A long soak will loosen most clogs. An ultrasonic cleaner helps a lot.

 

The nib end screws off normally, but they used to have a handy plastic wrench that fit over the 'feed' that would help a lot. It was a disc with a slot in it that fit the flat sided of the nib holder.

 

The other end? All I remember is a blind cap that unscrews to reveal the piston filler...

 

Regards,

 

Gerry

[Ron Z]

QUOTE (Gerry @ Mar 10 2007, 03:24 AM)

The other end? All I remember is a blind cap that unscrews to reveal the piston filler...

The filler end unscrews. The ring betwen the blind cap and barrel unscrews. It's been long enough that I don't remember whether or not it's a left hand or right hand thread - I think it's right hand.

 

You may need to warm the barrel a bit, and use a piece of rubber to grip it enough to get it out

[Tweel]

QUOTE (Ron Z @ Mar 10 2007, 07:37 AM)

The filler end unscrews.  The ring betwen the blind cap and barrel unscrews.  It's been long enough that I don't remember whether or not it's a left hand or right hand thread - I think it's right hand.  You may need to warm the barrel a bit, and use a piece of rubber to grip it enough to get it out

Thanks, Ron. I wondered whether it came off, but the fit is so nice that I was afraid it was permanently installed.

 

Speaking of barrel-warming, do you happen to remember if the section is a friction-fit?

 

-- Brian

 

[Tweel]

QUOTE (Gerry @ Mar 10 2007, 02:24 AM)

The best cleaner for drafting ink that has dried is the Koor-I-Noor RapidEze cleaner you can get at most art and drafting stores.

I asked at the best-bet store around here recently -- the guy squinted, chuckled, and said it had been a LONG time since he'd ordered any :\ . I'll have to order some myself sometime...

QUOTE

The nib end screws off normally, but they used to have a handy plastic wrench that fit over the 'feed' that would help a lot.  It was a disc with a slot in it that fit the flat sided of the nib holder.

I have a couple around (BTW, I like the key built into Staedtler barrels better), but I will have to soak it first before I try. The point is the main reason I asked about the safety of ammonia -- it's great for dissolving waterproof india, but destroys the points of the aforementioned Staedtler pens. The plastic balloons, so that (with their swelled ink-baffles) they look like horrible rubber concertinas.

 

-- Brian

 

[Ron Z]

QUOTE (Tweel @ Mar 11 2007, 02:03 AM)

Speaking of barrel-warming, do you happen to remember if the section is a friction-fit?

The section does not come off of the pen. Don't even try!! The piece that holds the nib/tube screws into the section with enough turns that you wonder if it'll ever come out. Inside that, sometimes with a retainer, sometimes not, is a wire with a weight attached to the back end.

 

If you can't unscrew the piece, a good soak, or a soak in pen cleaner, or a soak in an ultrasonic with pen cleaner may be needed. Don't force it - the piece can snap off, and then have a nice problem on your hands. The good news is that you should be able to get a modern nib unit to screw into the pen.

[Tweel]

QUOTE (Ron Z @ Mar 11 2007, 07:10 PM)

The section does not come off of the pen.  Don't even try!!

Really? Oh, okay -- I'll leave it alone then.

 

QUOTE

The piece that holds the nib/tube screws into the section with enough turns that you wonder if it'll ever come out.  Inside that, sometimes with a retainer, sometimes not, is a wire with a weight attached to the back end.

I'm OK there. I've been using technical pens for around 30 years, and completely break down & clean them before every refill -- but the refillable-cartridge type, not piston-fillers. I wasn't sure how to approach those.

 

Thanks,

Brian

 

[MYU]

Yep, I agree with Ron--none of the Kohinoor branded stylographs had sections that unscrew (just one long integrated barrel).

 

Do you buy broccoli? Take two of those really big rubber bands that you get on broccoli bunches, stretch one around the barrel and one around the base above the piston screw (with the blind cap off), and twist gently but firmly to remove the piston mechanism. If you don't get much traction, you'll have to do some soaking. Also, be sure to have the piston retracted, in case you inadvertently turn the screw. I once popped the section off because I was applying too much force and the piston was already fully extended! (it was on an older marbled celluloid stylograph with an ink window--thankfully Richard Binder was able to fix it for me!).

 

Be careful with some of the older models, as soaking the black barrel in water will cause it to turn dark grey/brown.

 

Does your stylo tip have flat spots? Many of the vintage stylo tips were completely rounded (before Kohinoor realized the great functionality of making them with flattened sides and providing a nib screw key to remove them). If your stylo tip is fully rounded or you don't have a key, use a nice big fat rubber band for a good grip. If you find the nib is pretty well locked in place, then draw a warm water/cleaner solution inside the pen and let it soak overnight. I find this usually works well enough to get the stylo tip out of the section. Once you get the stylo tip off, you can use a Q-tip and clean out the section.

 

The biggest difficulty is dealing with a fused stylo tip, where the ink feeder wire doesn't move. If the ink feeder wire is stuck inside the tip, you'll have to use an ultrasonic bath with cleaning solution to loosen it up. Never give a firm pull on the weight that the wire goes into--you can actually separate the wire from it and then you're out of luck and will need a new tip. If your rapidograph is a fairly common vintage model (like a 3060), you can obtain a stylo tip replacement. But if you want to keep it as original as possible, you'll have to soak, soak, soak it until the feeder wire loosens. Sometimes it can take multiple soaking sessions with an ultrasonic bath.

Edited March 13, 2007 by MYU

[Tweel]

With patient soaking and care, I got the pen apart, cleaned, and working smoothly again.

 

QUOTE (MYU @ Mar 13 2007, 11:13 AM)

Yep, I agree with Ron--none of the Kohinoor branded stylographs had sections that unscrew (just one long integrated barrel).

When I looked at the joint from the outside, it did look fused, and once I was able to look at it from the inside, I could see some "flash" -- either cement or melted plastic. But then, once I had it apart, I could see that there's no need to take the section off.

QUOTE

Take two of those really big rubber bands that you get on broccoli bunches, stretch one around the barrel and one around the base above the piston screw (with the blind cap off), and twist gently but firmly to remove the piston mechanism.

I used a smooth-jawed, pliers-type nutcracker with surgical rubber tubing pushed on over the jaws. Kind of like a small, homemade section pliers.

 

QUOTE

Also, be sure to have the piston retracted, in case you inadvertently turn the screw.  I once popped the section off because I was applying too much force and the piston was already fully extended!

Ow!!

 

QUOTE

(it was on an older marbled celluloid stylograph with an ink window...

OUCH!

 

Do you know of an "official" spec for how far to turn the filler knob in before inserting and engaging the piston rod? I used two full turns, to avoid having the knob's knurls "lock" onto the inside of the blind cap when it's all the way up. Of course, doing it earlier would give a tiny bit more ink capacity, but I don't want to snap the knob trying to get the blind cap off!

 

QUOTE

The biggest difficulty is dealing with a fused stylo tip, where the ink feeder wire doesn't move.  If the ink feeder wire is stuck inside the tip, you'll have to use an ultrasonic bath with cleaning solution to loosen it up.

 

Kind of OT, but the damnedest technical pen I ever tried was the "Stanopen" that Standardgraph was selling in the early '80's. I *guess* to give the metal point a thicker wall for slower wear, they used hyper-thin guide wires (I mean near-microscopic). It was virtually impossible to put back in if you took it out, so they sold cans of special cleaning foam for the pen. You'd take the section-and-point assembly, screw the whole thing into a big threaded hole in the nozzle, then blow foam through it until it started coming out white. Even with the foam, the working lifetime of those pens was maybe a few weeks before the tiny, tiny ink channel permanently clogged. -- And they cost probably twice as much as a Mars 700 (what I bought was some superlative hype).

 

-- Brian

 

[Gerry]

If your art / drafting supply store doesn't carry it - why not try Michaels - here in Canada they apparently carry the pens - maybe they carry the cleaner too...

 

Gerry

[MYU]

QUOTE (Tweel @ Mar 15 2007, 11:33 PM)

Do you know of an "official" spec for how far to turn the filler knob in before inserting and engaging the piston rod? I used two full turns, to avoid having the knob's knurls "lock" onto the inside of the blind cap when it's all the way up. Of course, doing it earlier would give a tiny bit more ink capacity, but I don't want to snap the knob trying to get the blind cap off!

You should never need to attach the blind cap with the piston fully extended, so there's no need to be concerned about the knob knurls rubbing against the inside of the blind cap.

 

When reattaching the piston to the piston screw shaft, make sure to line up the grooves and then turn the knob all the way until it won't turn anymore. The piston head will then be in its fully retracted position. Reinsert the piston mechanism back into the barrel. You should be able to get near full ink capacity when filling. The screw mechanism is pretty solid--when it's fully retracted, you'll feel a solid stop. Likewise when extending the piston.

 

These pens have become rather inexpensive on FleaBay... you can often get one for just $10. So, if you ever damage a part it's quite cheap to fix it. Even nibs are frequently available and not costly. If you have an earlier rounded vintage stylo tip, you can sometimes find replacements by buying a vintage rapidograph with a beat-up body but a good nib.

[mmoncur]

I've restored a bunch of piston-filler Rapidographs. I'm coming to this thread late, but here are a couple of things I haven't seen mentioned yet:

 

1. The brand new tips from the current version of Rapidographs will screw in and work fine in an old piston-filler. They don't look 100% correct but they work very well.

 

2. The barrels on these pens are made of hard rubber. Avoid soaking the barrel as it can be discolored - and when buying them on eBay, watch for brown-colored barrels.

 

3. The Cap ends and the bands near the blind cap are color-coded to indicate point size. This ranges from 0.18 (4x0) (lavender/pink) to #3 (.80) (green). I believe there were a total of 7 colors/sizes sold. The current pens come in a 0.13 (6x0) size that was not available in the old piston-fillers, but I use a piston-filler with a 0.13 tip and it works fine.

 

They're very nice drawing pens. Much more ergonomic than the modern version, and MUCH easier to fill, start and clean - the piston filler automatically flushes the tip and fills it with ink. Imagine that.

 

I'm working on a website that will have a lot of information on these pens, eventually.

[Fox in the Stars]

Necro-posting here, but Jinnayah and I got a couple of these in a lot of pens---she had wanted it for a couple of Inkographs that were in the lot and the Koh-i-Noors went in the "junker" tin, and I started tinkering with one today. The piston turns and disassembles easily, and I can definitely tell it's drawing a good vacuum. The tip is still stuck, though. At present I'm trying to get the "feed" out, and have put it through the ultrasonic again, trying to unscrew the feed between sessions (right now I'm tired for awhile and it's drying). So far I just have water in the ultrasonic, tho, prob'ly not so good. I'll have to get some of the Rapid-eze next chance I get.

 

Somewhere I have some modern Rapidographs that I got as an art student (before discovering that I prefer a more expressive, shaded line), and some of them are gunked up, too. Maybe this will teach me what I need to fix them, or they're there if I need donor parts...

[Tweel]

Somewhere I have some modern Rapidographs that I got as an art student (before discovering that I prefer a more expressive, shaded line), and some of them are gunked up, too. Maybe this will teach me what I need to fix them, or they're there if I need donor parts...

As mmoncur mentioned, the points will probably fit the piston-filler, giving you more line-width choices. Assuming you break the pens all the way down for cleaning (I always do, every time I refill them), be careful that you don't bend the guide wires when reassembling the points. You'll learn to feel when the wire enters the tube, allowing the weight to drop in without pushing.

 

-- Brian

[danielfalgerho]

I used ammonia and water many times on these in a former life, it is safe but without a ultrasonic cleaner you may need time and poking (carefully!) with the wire to clear hardened ink. A Q-tipcan be used as a plunger to clear final residue.

Good luck!

I have an old piston-filler Kohinoor Rapidograph that I'd like to get writing, if possible. It looks like it's thoroughly cemented together with hardened india ink, and I have a couple of questions:

 

- Is it safe to use ammonia solution to soak these pens?

- Where and how does it disassemble at each end of the barrel?

 

Thanks!

Brian

 

[Quackedo]

I just acquired a grey banded Kohinor 3060.

 

The nib is broken. Where can i get a replacement? I'd like the one that matches the pen.

 

I got the rest of the pen completely disassembled, but I worry about how to get a broken nib out of the feed?!?!?!?

 

Now I hear that soaking the barrel may be a bad idea (barrel discoloration)?

 

Can I stand the pen up and just soak the feed & section?

 

Thanks,

 

C. Don

[WirsPlm]

Thank you to everyone who posted here, especially the suggestions for disassembling the back end and the piston!

 

I just acquired a grey banded Kohinor 3060.

 

The nib is broken. Where can i get a replacement? I'd like the one that matches the pen.

 

I got the rest of the pen completely disassembled, but I worry about how to get a broken nib out of the feed?!?!?!?

 

Now I hear that soaking the barrel may be a bad idea (barrel discoloration)?

 

Can I stand the pen up and just soak the feed & section?

 

Thanks,

 

C. Don

I ordered a bunch of replacements on eBay, they're cheaper there than from art stores.

[Hanamizu]

Thanks to all of you who provided info in this thread. A few months ago I got a bunch of pens from an antique dealer, including a Rapidograph. The filler knob didn't turn and I couldn't figure out how to take it apart. This thread, along with heat, many trips to the ultrasonic bath and plenty of patience have finally got it working again. Thanks again for the help.

[TXKat]

I'm late to the party (story of my life), but I've taken photos of the directions that came with the pen I purchased in college in hopes they might be of help to someone. I have to figure out how to get them off the phone without hitting the pic limit.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 30, 2014 by TXKat

[TXKat]

Duplicate!! ** removed ** Sorry! Guess I'm impatient when it comes to uploading from my phone.

Edited January 30, 2014 by TXKat