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Red Ripple ? Ring


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#1 Force

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 15:21

I was browsing this afernoon when this RR popped up BIN £75 free delivery

 

It is missing the clip and probably the sac bar but the price looked good and I did not want to let it slip away so I bought it.

 

If I don't have one I know where to get a sac but the clip and bar are obviously going to be difficult to find...perhaps 3rd party only.

 

So it's a No 7. Now is that ring Blue, Mauve (Purple) or Black. I will not know until next week.

 

In my research I am getting the felling the nib is wrong :blush: in that it should be engraved with the ring colour.

 

fpn_1402413644__rr_04b.jpg

 

fpn_1402413544__rr_01b.jpg

 

fpn_1402413583__rr_02b.jpg

 

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Edited by Force, 10 June 2014 - 16:35.


#2 pajaro

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 18:09

That's one beautiful pen.  I love that nib. 


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#3 Force

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 18:27

I think this is going to have to go to a pro repairer in the UK. I can import a clip but fitting it would concern me through the 'rubber' cap. I would hate to split it...I would hate the expert to split it.

 

Who can we recomend.

 

Battersea Pen Home

Classic Pen Engineering

Pen Museum

Pen Box

Vintage Fountain Pens

Penfriend

 

or any other...who must have a clip I suppose.



#4 rhr2010

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 18:36

Beautiful pen. The nib might indeed be wrong, as it would have a nib market "blue" normally. But yours might have been assembled in UK possibly? I don't know about the history of the early days of Waterman and penetration in UK. The keyhole in the nib is indeed appropriate, but normally it would say "blue" where it says England. Also the blue nib was the "ball tip" one, smoooth and round.

 

Anyway, you have a great pen there, source a clip and you are all set!


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#5 crescentfiller

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 12:36

Battersea Pen Home every time!

 

 

Best,

Daniel



#6 Force

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 14:02

I have only had a reply from #5 but it's early days.



#7 Procyon

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 06:56

Actually, the blue nib is a stub.  It's the yellow that is a ball tip.  And yes, to be entirely correct, the nib should be marked blue.


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#8 Force

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 21:25

The pen arrived today and it is a No 7 (stamped on end) with a dark blue or black ring. The colour and pattern is a wonderful orange...oh no I can see more of these coming.

 

I can see why people love these pens and collect them. They are something else to look at and hold. They have a feel of quality while stinking of rubber :wacko:

 

I will knock the nib out and renew the sac to bring it back to life.

 

Unfortunately, though not a major problem, there is a crack between the clip holes and a little heading north from the top hole.

 

The cap/barrel thread is firm and like new I would think.

 

I feel my £75 was well spent.

 

The barrel is engraved Waterman's and I will try a pencil rubbing tomorrow for the rest.

 

I am thinking of a repro clip and fit myself.

 

What a pity my simple question to the only two sellers of the clip have not replied. The holes in the cap have a 4mm pitch it really is that easy with a rule.


Edited by Force, 14 June 2014 - 05:01.


#9 Force

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 04:55

Does anyone know what type of pressure bar should be fitted.

 

I am now 100% sure the cap ring is Black.

 

fpn_1402734072__dscn1267.jpg

 

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fpn_1402734328__dscn1276.jpg

 

fpn_1402734763__dscn1284.jpg

 

fpn_1402735023__dscn1282.jpg


Edited by Force, 14 June 2014 - 08:37.


#10 RMN

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 12:22

apart from that crack it's looking very nice, Force, well done again.

 

D.ick


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#11 Force

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 14:11

The block, feed & nib overhaul. The parts tapped out fairly easily.

 

fpn_1402754775__dscn1290.jpg

 

fpn_1402754860__dscn1292.jpg

 

fpn_1402754827__dscn1291.jpg

 

Its a big'ish No 4 nib, 33mm long. No gold markings, but I am sure as eggs is eggs it is.

 

fpn_1402754910__dscn1302.jpg

 

part way in,

 

fpn_1402754971__dscn1303.jpg

 

fully home,

 

fpn_1402755026__dscn1312.jpg

 

fpn_1402755057__dscn1313.jpg


Edited by Force, 14 June 2014 - 14:20.


#12 Force

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 14:37

Interesting that the barrel/cap thread is a 4 start.

 

I have ordered a few 6.5mm & 7mm sacs plus 54mm and 62mm J bars. I think the 62mm measures up to be the right size.

 

A diagram to explain hole pitch.

 

fpn_1402767915__dscn1317.jpg


Edited by Force, 14 June 2014 - 17:47.


#13 Procyon

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 18:57

A j-bar isn't correct.  It might be possible to use it if you rip the spring part out, and if it is wide enough to bend the sides over to hold the tabs on the lever. That sounds very difficult to me.  The tabs are supposed to move a bit with the C-channels on either side of the pressure bar or it may bind up or harm the sac.  You would be better off I think to try and find an actual Waterman pressure bar.  I believe one from a 52,54, or 55 pen would work as well as from a 7.  Maybe from a 5 also.

 

See Richard Binder's website for a look at the lever tabs and pressure bar.  (The section on replacing a Waterman lever box)


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#14 Force

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 20:23

A j-bar isn't correct.  It might be possible to use it if you rip the spring part out, and if it is wide enough to bend the sides over to hold the tabs on the lever. That sounds very difficult to me.  The tabs are supposed to move a bit with the C-channels on either side of the pressure bar or it may bind up or harm the sac.  You would be better off I think to try and find an actual Waterman pressure bar.  I believe one from a 52,54, or 55 pen would work as well as from a 7.  Maybe from a 5 also.

 

See Richard Binder's website for a look at the lever tabs and pressure bar.  (The section on replacing a Waterman lever box)

Ahh OK thanks. I can cancel those parts. It's not easy buying these parts in the UK. Repairers want to do the work and not sell you the bits. Even RB does not sell them.


Edited by Force, 14 June 2014 - 20:31.


#15 gregamckinney

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 23:14

Keyhole nibs on English pens and on later-production US pens are not uncommon.  I don't recall ever seeing a definitive "reason" provided, but I have several, and have seen many.

If you define "correct" as "started life with the pen," then it is not at all unlikely that your nib is correct.

 

Clip replacement is not an easy repair, even with a perfect cap.  I personally doubt your cap could be repaired to the point that a usable clip could be attached.  Hard rubber repair can be difficult, and IMO will not result in a stable enough surface to attach a clip that can handle the pressure of being used.

 

All that said, it is a lovely pen, and you've done a great job of cleaning it up.

 

Once you get a workable lever/ pressure bar in there, you should have a great user pen.

 

Regards, greg



#16 Procyon

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 00:12

Many of the cap rings turn dark.  The purple ones usually appear black, in fact.  Often the green ones do too.  It is very unlikely your cap band started off black, since that is quite rare.  Of course, a truly black cap ring should have a BLACK nib.

 

Regards, Allan


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#17 Force

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 04:15

Thanks, I would just be looking to have a clip in place and not to use it in anger.

 

This pen repair beats work any day :)

 

I must get back to that Carene rework, it's been a few months now

 

I think I still did OK when you see this  :blush:


Edited by Force, 15 June 2014 - 04:50.


#18 pajaro

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 16:49

A Laureat rollerball for all that money?  I would expect it to still be for sale at Christmas.


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#19 Force

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 18:09

Difficult call here now.

 

I can only buy the sac in the UK which is easy to fit myself. The correct pressure bar is a problem for me to buy though a repairer would do it for me.

 

The cap clip is the main problem. It would have to come from the USA supplied with a non-standard rivet which would be externaly peened.

 

I can though, as advised by a very good Waterman expert in the USA, have all the work carried out there. The re-gold plated original clip would look precisely as it was when new.

 

I wonder how much it would be worth if I spent another $190 - $200.

 

There is no point in buying another pen just to rifle the parts.