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Qc Issue With M1000 Nib And Dissatisfaction With Initial Response By Pelikan


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#21 load81

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 21:33

There are some replies on this thread indicating they don't see any problem. I respect your opinions, which I disagree completely with due respect; but, as I am the one who has paid for the M1000, I have the vested interest in correcting this situation with Pelikan. 

 

I have to say that i had to look at the pictures for an extended amount of time to identify the issue. If this was my pen i would consider it a minor issue if i noticed it at all. Regardless of that it is of course your right to demand exchange, but i wouldn't be surprised if the response is not to your liking.



#22 johnkim424

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 00:53

One of the reasons why I enjoy fountain pens so much is that each one is unique, specially the vintage ones made during 40s-50s.  Pens made during this period were all hand made so imperfections were norm.  I have many pens with uneven tipping, where one side bigger than other which does not bother me a bit.  However, when you buy a pen costing hundreds of dollars, you have a right to get what you want as a consumer.  If your slit is not perfectly perpendicular or tip is uneven, Pelikan should find you a perfect nib you request.  How difficult can this be? 



#23 proton007

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:35

One of the reasons why I enjoy fountain pens so much is that each one is unique, specially the vintage ones made during 40s-50s.  Pens made during this period were all hand made so imperfections were norm.  I have many pens with uneven tipping, where one side bigger than other which does not bother me a bit.  However, when you buy a pen costing hundreds of dollars, you have a right to get what you want as a consumer.  If your slit is not perfectly perpendicular or tip is uneven, Pelikan should find you a perfect nib you request.  How difficult can this be? 

 

That's what surprises me.

 

Almost all modern nibs are machine made. I'm not sure what the tolerances are like, but a badly cut slit means the nib wasn't aligned properly during the cutting process.

 

This also means it's possible a whole batch was cut in the same way, until someone found out about the problem, and still decided to use these nibs anyway.

 

So, either they don't consider this as a problem (which is bad QC policy), or they didn't bother to mark these nibs as defective (bad QC).


Edited by proton007, 07 April 2014 - 01:38.

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#24 Tombstone

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 06:20

At the end we talk about an optical problem - until now I see no writing problem mentioned.

 

And the problem with optical problems: some care, some don't. So this will always be a "Jesses, don't waste your time" vs. "but I want to have it my way".

 

@ pen2009: if this is important for you, then fight for it! You want it to look good? Get a perfect nib. Others might check how it writes and don't care for the position of the slit. I am a user - and I do not care.

 

But I also do not care for misalignements on my cars - they are tools like pens.


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#25 Xof72000

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 08:17

Wise words, Tomstone ! 



#26 hari317

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 08:36

Perfection has its place. Companies like Pelikan should be able to satisfy the perfectionists amongst us, atleast for their most expensive pen in the regular souveran range.



#27 Pen2009

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 12:05

I am happy to report the Dealer got an approval from Pelikan for a nib exchange.  So, I am getting a new EF nib. Due to supply scarcity, my waiting time is up to 1 month. But, it is worth the wait for the pen in the class of the M1000.  No rush as I have already have too many Pelikans in my hands.

 

Kudos to Pelikan to listen to the customer and take a right action.

 

I am sending out the pen to the dealer this week. 

 

I will surely post the outcome after I receive the pen with the new EF nib. 

 

Yes, there are problems with the writing feels.  This misalignment is causing a fatter line and there is some weird feedback which is different from my other Pelikans. My "other" Pelikans have the perfect nibs.  


Edited by Pen2009, 07 April 2014 - 12:07.

My collection: 149 EF/F/B/OBB, Collodi B/Twain F/Mann F, 146 M, Silver Barley F, M1000/M800 B'o'B/M800 Tortoise/Sahara/415 BT/215/205 Blue Demo, Optima Demo Red M/88 EF & Italic/Europa, Emotica, 2K/Safaris/Al-Stars/Vista, Edson DB/Carene BS, Pilot 845/823/742/743/Silvern/M90/Makies, Sailor Profit Realo M/KOP Makies/Profit Makies/Profit 21 Naginata MF&M/KOP/KOP Mosaiques/Sterling Silvers,Platinum #3776 Celluloids/Izumos/Wood pens/Sterling Silvers,YoL Grand Victorian, and more (I lost counting)

#28 Tombstone

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 16:46


Yes, there are problems with the writing feels.  This misalignment is causing a fatter line and there is some weird feedback which is different from my other Pelikans. My "other" Pelikans have the perfect nibs.  

 

Attention: is this your first M1000? I ask, because there is a huge difference between the nib of the M1000 and all ther Pelikan-nibs.

 

So for this: it might be a feature, not a bug...


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#29 Flounder

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 17:44

Something I would be uncomfortable with is the fact that you have less leeway smoothing out a EF nib with unequal tipping material. I'm glad you're getting the nib exchange you want.


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#30 Albinoni

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 23:15

Hi

 

I know we expect perfection and at this price it is understandable but if that nib is within their production tolerances then you may not get what you want out of this and that I know will bug you until you sell the pen or get hold of a nib yourself and change it yourself.  It is an easy job on the M1000 as they just screw in and out.

 

Not what you want to hear I know but Pelikan are getting themselves quite a poor reputation for the delivered state of their nibs.

 

How does it write is what Pelikan will be looking at, if it writes fine they will send it back untouched. Don't know the relevant consumer law in America but you could try getting the dealer to refund you for it if you are allowed to reject it under your States laws.

 

Just remember an off centre tine slit is quite common and can have no ill effect on the pens ability to be a pen.

 

If it writes as it should I would suggest putting your loupe away and just enjoy your pen, you will grow to hate it otherwise.

 

Paul

 

1. But would you call a nib that is not cut properly to be accapeted within their tolerances, I would of thought  that when a nib is cut precisely within the centre than it would be within their tolerances

    Simply I would ask how came your other nibs were split in the centre and all of sudden this one isnt, but sorry to me not acceptable.  May as well go and buy and get a cheap Chinese pen where

    their nibs are split in the center. I love my Pelikans, dont get me wrong and they are one of my favourite fountain pens have a few here myself which all write flawlassly even my 1997 M800 is a

    beautiful writer, but sorry this to me is just not accepted.

 

2. Why didnt they just simply change and give the op a new nib, simple :-)



#31 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 09:45

I've only tried that giant 1000 in a B&M...some get nibs that are very nice and springy....the one I tried had a semi-flex nib.

I have some 26 so think I know the feeling.

Modern Pelikan nibs are the semi-nail 400/600 or the nail 800.

 

the 200 has more of the '83-97 M400 feel.

 

Try a medium long 400NN with a 'flexi/maxi-semi-flex nib some time....a real nib.

A 140 or any of the '50's pens in semi-flex are the better more fun nibs.


Due to Mauricio's improved definition of Super-flex, I try not use the term Easy Full Flex, but fail...sigh.

 

Semi-flex is an “almost” flex; not a ‘flex’ nib. It is great for regular writing with a touch of flair. It can give you some fancy; but it is not made for real fancy writing. For bit more of that get a 'flexi'/maxi-semi-flex. Both spread tines 3X.  Those are not "Flex" nibs. 

 

Odd, how many who should know better, compares Japanese F (which equals EF), with Western F, with out a second thought, but do not compare Japanese B with Western B.

 

Wider than Normal does not exist. Wider than Japanese does. Every company has it's very own standard + slop/tolerance. Developed from the users of it's pens only; not the users of other companies pens. The size you grind a nib to, is your standard only. Paper and ink matter to nib width. Thank god for 1/2 sizes or it would be boring.


#32 Pen2009

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 14:31

2. Why didnt they just simply change and give the op a new nib, simple :-)

Based on the reply I received from Pelikan, it seems my dealer did not request correctly what I asked. Even though my specific request originally was a replacement of this defective nib, they requested Pelikan "repair" the nib.  I have no idea why the dealer sent such a request.  I checked my email to the dealer and I can see clearly I littered my request with "replacement" and "replace." 

 

So, Pelikan said they would've accepted my original request if they heard that from the dealer originally. So, in a way, the dealer miscommunicated to Pelikan in this instance. 

 

In regard to the space between the nib and feed, Pelikan said that is how M1000 nibs are designed. So, that is good to know.  Interestingly, my older M1000 F does not have such space between the nib and feed, however.  This space thing may become the norm with the recent M1000 iterations. 


My collection: 149 EF/F/B/OBB, Collodi B/Twain F/Mann F, 146 M, Silver Barley F, M1000/M800 B'o'B/M800 Tortoise/Sahara/415 BT/215/205 Blue Demo, Optima Demo Red M/88 EF & Italic/Europa, Emotica, 2K/Safaris/Al-Stars/Vista, Edson DB/Carene BS, Pilot 845/823/742/743/Silvern/M90/Makies, Sailor Profit Realo M/KOP Makies/Profit Makies/Profit 21 Naginata MF&M/KOP/KOP Mosaiques/Sterling Silvers,Platinum #3776 Celluloids/Izumos/Wood pens/Sterling Silvers,YoL Grand Victorian, and more (I lost counting)

#33 Tadeyev

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 16:49

Correct me if I have missed something already stated, but as far as I can see there is still nothing said about how the pen wrote or writes presently.

Crooked or straight slit, with or without space between nib and feed - does it write - or not?

 

After reading about your pen for 2 pages now, I have become most curious about the results....

 

Good luck

Tadeyev


Edited by Tadeyev, 08 April 2014 - 16:51.


#34 Albinoni

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 04:45

Regardless of how the pen writes is pointless, if you bought a brand new Mercedes from a car dealer and it came with scratches would you accept it, I don't think so but hey again it will still drive wouldn't it.

#35 Pen2009

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 10:03

Regardless of how the pen writes is pointless, if you bought a brand new Mercedes from a car dealer and it came with scratches would you accept it, I don't think so but hey again it will still drive wouldn't it.

You are right on the mark. For the top line model of Pelikan product such as the M1000, the customer can expect perfection. In that sense, I am a perfectionist.  

 

For example, when I pick up my Montblanc from the boutique after the regular maintenance, I check the nib with my loupe before I leave the store. 


Edited by Pen2009, 10 April 2014 - 10:03.

My collection: 149 EF/F/B/OBB, Collodi B/Twain F/Mann F, 146 M, Silver Barley F, M1000/M800 B'o'B/M800 Tortoise/Sahara/415 BT/215/205 Blue Demo, Optima Demo Red M/88 EF & Italic/Europa, Emotica, 2K/Safaris/Al-Stars/Vista, Edson DB/Carene BS, Pilot 845/823/742/743/Silvern/M90/Makies, Sailor Profit Realo M/KOP Makies/Profit Makies/Profit 21 Naginata MF&M/KOP/KOP Mosaiques/Sterling Silvers,Platinum #3776 Celluloids/Izumos/Wood pens/Sterling Silvers,YoL Grand Victorian, and more (I lost counting)

#36 Pen2009

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 11:52

A quick update. I am expecting my M1000 with the newly replaced EF nib tomorrow. Stay tuned on the result.  


My collection: 149 EF/F/B/OBB, Collodi B/Twain F/Mann F, 146 M, Silver Barley F, M1000/M800 B'o'B/M800 Tortoise/Sahara/415 BT/215/205 Blue Demo, Optima Demo Red M/88 EF & Italic/Europa, Emotica, 2K/Safaris/Al-Stars/Vista, Edson DB/Carene BS, Pilot 845/823/742/743/Silvern/M90/Makies, Sailor Profit Realo M/KOP Makies/Profit Makies/Profit 21 Naginata MF&M/KOP/KOP Mosaiques/Sterling Silvers,Platinum #3776 Celluloids/Izumos/Wood pens/Sterling Silvers,YoL Grand Victorian, and more (I lost counting)

#37 Penryn87

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 12:25

Not what you want to hear I know but Pelikan are getting themselves quite a poor reputation for the delivered state of their nibs.

 

 

 

Pelikan's are great pens, but if you are going to buy one, you have to get one from Binder or Mottishaw.

 

I was in a local store recently and apparently Pelikan has changed their USA repair policies. 2 years ago I had a fantastic experience. I broke my M400 in a drier and the sent me a new pen for free. He told me to know expect that again.

 

Frankly the gold on the nib alone will likely net them a profit. IDK if Pelikan does their own metal fabrication or not, but the gold itself is likely worth just giving you a new nibs!


Edited by Penryn87, 30 April 2014 - 12:28.


#38 Pen2009

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 10:33

I am very pleased with the outcome. The wait was worth it.  Pelikan replaced the defective nib with the perfect one.  I checked the nib with my loupe and tines are perfectly aligned, as they should be.  

 

Not yet tested with ink. But, from what I can see with the loupe, I don't expect the issues with the nib.  

 

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My collection: 149 EF/F/B/OBB, Collodi B/Twain F/Mann F, 146 M, Silver Barley F, M1000/M800 B'o'B/M800 Tortoise/Sahara/415 BT/215/205 Blue Demo, Optima Demo Red M/88 EF & Italic/Europa, Emotica, 2K/Safaris/Al-Stars/Vista, Edson DB/Carene BS, Pilot 845/823/742/743/Silvern/M90/Makies, Sailor Profit Realo M/KOP Makies/Profit Makies/Profit 21 Naginata MF&M/KOP/KOP Mosaiques/Sterling Silvers,Platinum #3776 Celluloids/Izumos/Wood pens/Sterling Silvers,YoL Grand Victorian, and more (I lost counting)

#39 hari317

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 10:39

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#40 Pen2009

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 10:59

fpn_1398940739__img_4739_zpsaba76d98.jpg

You have the eagle's eyes.:)

I washed the nib and the plastic crumb is gone now. When I saw your post, I was concerned about the worst.  But, it seems this is my lucky day.


My collection: 149 EF/F/B/OBB, Collodi B/Twain F/Mann F, 146 M, Silver Barley F, M1000/M800 B'o'B/M800 Tortoise/Sahara/415 BT/215/205 Blue Demo, Optima Demo Red M/88 EF & Italic/Europa, Emotica, 2K/Safaris/Al-Stars/Vista, Edson DB/Carene BS, Pilot 845/823/742/743/Silvern/M90/Makies, Sailor Profit Realo M/KOP Makies/Profit Makies/Profit 21 Naginata MF&M/KOP/KOP Mosaiques/Sterling Silvers,Platinum #3776 Celluloids/Izumos/Wood pens/Sterling Silvers,YoL Grand Victorian, and more (I lost counting)




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