What's Wrong With Journals?

[jesse.bo]

I am working on a project, a quest if you will, for the ultimate FP friendly journal(s). Now I haven't been using fountain pens as long as many of you, but I have become pretty well versed in making journals and books. So I figured, what better place than FPN to share with me their qualms and disappointments with commercially available journals.

 

Take a few seconds and join others in the poll. Take a minute and put into your own words what you think is the biggest problem(s) with journals in the comments below. I know people will enjoy this discussion, I will.

[Cognaticrotty]

http://www.basecampx.com/the-works/

Check out the legacy journal....

 

I've had one since his original batch, and LOVE it

[mAnuscript69]

In my opinion, the ultimate journal should have paper that resists bleedthrough and feathering, but isn't too thick. Also, the paper should be smooth but not too smooth so as to cause skipping and long dry times. Tomoe River comes to mind. Paper options are always great; it's always good to have a choice between ivory and bright white paper, as well as a variety of rulings to suit the needs of the masses.

 

Besides that, the journal must lay flat anywhere in the book, ala Moleskine and Quo Vadis Habanas. Cover wise, I'm not too picky as long as it is dark coloured and preferably made of some kind of faux leather e.g. Quo Vadis covers.

[inkstainedruth]

The poll doesn't really include/address *my* main complaints -- I want something that has lots of pages (when you write 3 pages a day, you want something that you're not filling up in a short amount of time and having to go buy another one every time you turn around). And I'm less concerned with the paper weight/thickness and color as I am that most companies think lined paper = "journal" but *unlined* paper = "sketchbook" (apparently they think their customers are incapable of writing a straight line of text without having it go sloping off at an angle if there aren't printed lines -- or even dots -- for them to follow; and the lines are often so far apart that when I write small I can squeeze two lines of writing in....).

I want a moderately fat (over 200 pages if at all possible), reasonably sized (5" x 7"/6" x 8") journal, that is relatively inexpensive (< $20 US), isn't going to fall apart if I look at it cross-wise, opens flat, and has unlined pages that take a variety of FP inks moderately well (smooth, but not so slick that it takes an eternity for ink to dry; and not so cheap that I get a lot of show-through or feathering).

I know, I know -- I don't want much, do I?

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[jesse.bo]

The poll doesn't really include/address *my* main complaints -- I want something that has lots of pages (when you write 3 pages a day, you want something that you're not filling up in a short amount of time and having to go buy another one every time you turn around). And I'm less concerned with the paper weight/thickness and color as I am that most companies think lined paper = "journal" but *unlined* paper = "sketchbook" (apparently they think their customers are incapable of writing a straight line of text without having it go sloping off at an angle if there aren't printed lines -- or even dots -- for them to follow; and the lines are often so far apart that when I write small I can squeeze two lines of writing in....).

I want a moderately fat (over 200 pages if at all possible), reasonably sized (5" x 7"/6" x 8") journal, that is relatively inexpensive (< $20 US), isn't going to fall apart if I look at it cross-wise, opens flat, and has unlined pages that take a variety of FP inks moderately well (smooth, but not so slick that it takes an eternity for ink to dry; and not so cheap that I get a lot of show-through or feathering).

I know, I know -- I don't want much, do I?

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

No you're not picky at all. Good stuff keep it coming.

[GRJP]

Ok, so let me get my 2 cents in.

 

Let's start by what I'm currently using and what I still have stored away.

What I currently have: http://www.centralcrafts.com/pp/Journals_And_Guest_Books/Small_Journals/Small_Enya_Journal.html

I have 3 of these stored away (bought them at sale price in a place which was fire selling everything: http://www.peterpauper.com/moroccan-red-journal-4461

Before continuing, I'll leave a disclaimer - I have no commercial interest in any of these! LOL and I plan on reviewing both of them later on (maybe during the holidays when I have the time, despite the lack of variety of inks and fountain pens).

 

Ok, so... What's wrong with most journals: the thin, low quality paper. That's something I personally like and many of the off the shelf brands can take ballpoint and that's pretty much it. Even rollerballs sometimes bleed through. Let's be honest, there's nothing wrong with a cheap rollerball (heresy I know) - Hell I keep a blue Bic medium at my desk. I like the Orange fine ones better, but they are getting harder to come by. Anyway, back to topic - paper: good quality, good weight, resistant and that feels good to write on.

 

I like a rugged journal, but if possible one that looks good - considering it's always with me I'd rather have a sober booklike look. Being a corporate lawyer and imagine mattering - Silly I know, but something that doesn't look out of place at an impromptu meeting because the CEO decided he wanted to see me and drops by the office is a must.

 

I prefer them A5, though I can live with A6, since portability is an issue. I like them leatherbound for the simple reason that adds to the resistance (that first one I put up there is unmatched in all my journaling history as far as ruggedness goes). And that need will only grow with me being away from home. I like it beter when they open flat at any point and I prefer that they have some sort of band to keep them closed when I'm not using them.

 

Ohter than that I like a journal better with a high page count. The first link I posted... well I got it in July/August this year and I'm almost done with it. So need more writing real estate. That means bigger pages or more of them...

 

As for price range... considering I'm willing to go up to the 20 Eur. mark for a really good one, it's not that bad - I understand quality has a price tag.

 

I know I'm not telling you what's wrong with journals, just what I look for in one, but hope it helps.

[H.M. Murdock]

My problem with journals off the shelf:

 

1) Price. It feels like, in order to get a good journal, you have to pay big bucks, and you don't get a lot. I don't mind $10 for a smaller journal, or maybe one that's less than a hundred pages. But when I top 100 pages that are worth writing on, why should I have to pay $40?

2) The paper never strikes a happy medium. It's too thin, or it's too thick. It's too slick or too coarse. It's too white or it's too... not-white. I prefer smooth paper, but by no means slick- I like feedback. But I hate feeling like I'm dragging my pen across a gravel road.

3)When I open it, it needs to lay open for me to write. The pages need to have minimal warping, and my right hand should not be tired from prying it open to write in it.

4) Either it's minimal and good-looking and too small, or it's the right size and looks atrocious. I just want a plain book, A4, with college ruling or smaller- seyes would be amazing!- and a plain, canvas hard cover.

 

Is that too much to ask?

[Paddler]

The biggest problem with journals is that they were made by people who think every writer uses a ball point pen. That leaves them free to make the journal from any low quality paper that looks good.

[wallylynn]

I'd say price also. I can't justify paying 10, 20, per journal (refill) every few months. I've resorted to binding my own journal refills.

 

Save for the wettest of inks, I didn't have any feathering nor bleeding problems with the original paper.

[Letterman]

This is a good topic. I'm using three hole punched, loose leaf, 24#, 25% cotton, 8 1/2" x 11", paper in a one inch notebook of a hundred pages. I plan on transferring the pages into a bigger notebook as I go. So the paper has some tooth but is not too rough. It's about the right weight. You can get notebooks with leather covers for a more professional look. For portability I'm using a Rhodia Number 16 with a leather cover. It doesn't have the two hundred pages you want though. Maybe we could take any A4 paper we like, cut it in half, get an 5 1/2" x 8 1/2" binder http://www.buyonlinenow.com/search.asp?keyword=8-1/2+5-1/2+BINDER, and three hole punch it or spiral bind it. Just musing.

[zemof]

Fountain pen-friendly may be few but they aren’t rare. Binding, cover, colour and texture aside, I think what we all mainly look out for is:

 

- no feathering

- no bleed through

- no show through (even with dark colours)

 

If one is willing to pay, there is always suitable papers around and with a thicker gsm paper who has to worry about bleeding let alone show through?

But of course, we like to factor in the size, binding type, colours and other preferences…hence, the birth of customised journals!

 

additional personal requirements prior to above:

- opens flat

- nothing over 120gsm

- off-white

- grid/dotted/blank or a mixture!

- affordable!

[bogiesan]

The poll doesn't really include/address *my* main complaints -- I want something that has lots of pages (when you write 3 pages a day, you want something that you're not filling up in a short amount of time and having to go buy another one every time you turn around). And I'm less concerned with the paper weight/thickness and color as I am that most companies think lined paper = "journal" but *unlined* paper = "sketchbook" (apparently they think their customers are incapable of writing a straight line of text without having it go sloping off at an angle if there aren't printed lines -- or even dots -- for them to follow; and the lines are often so far apart that when I write small I can squeeze two lines of writing in....).

I want a moderately fat (over 200 pages if at all possible), reasonably sized (5" x 7"/6" x 8") journal, that is relatively inexpensive (< $20 US), isn't going to fall apart if I look at it cross-wise, opens flat, and has unlined pages that take a variety of FP inks moderately well (smooth, but not so slick that it takes an eternity for ink to dry; and not so cheap that I get a lot of show-through or feathering).

I know, I know -- I don't want much, do I?

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

I was cruising the shelves at Barnes and Noble last week and foiund the Piccadilly line of Primo journals are in stock again, at least at my local store. Very cheap: $5, 7 and 9 for the three sizes; 288 pages; reasonablly good paper (you get what you pay for there); selection of cover colors; and cheap.

 

Personally, I like a journal with fewer pages/leaves. Since my prefered writing instrument, the fountian pen, is expected to show through and bleed a bit, I only use one side. In some notebooks I even skip a line if I'm using a broad or wide italiic nib. The largest benefit for me is the reduced density of the information contained within each volume of my persnal reflections and notes. Much easier and pleasurable to find stuff later. Plus, I have acquired a large stack of notebooks by requesting them as gifts so I'm not concerned about the economics of using them up quickly. Plus, I get a great sensual and intellectual rush each time I perform this ritual: retire a book, print a lable for it, place it on the Retired Notebook shelf, choose a new one from the various mfrs and colors, unwrap it, choose a pen, write my perosnal information in the front matter and begin.

[Linsolv]

I'm having a bit of trouble with picking options on the poll. So instead, a verbal response.

 

My problems are twofold:

 

First, bindings which are too stiff and prevent me from using space that I feel should be outside of the margin of a notebook or journal. This is especially common in the leatherbound journals I have used, although I've never used one that cost more than, say, twenty dollars, so I'm sure that is at least partly the result of shoddy craftsmanship.

 

Second, if I manage to get past my binding worries (as I did with, eg, the Midori MD notebooks) I start to worry about wasting paper and the like, which is a common problem for me and as I understand it a lot of people when first using a nicer notebook.

 

It's especially a problem for me because I can be a bit obsessive, and if I don't compartmentalize notebook use properly, then the rest of the notebook/diary is wasted because I've used a page in the wrong way; therefor, the question of "wasting" paper is a very real issue because I'll have an even bigger mental block against using the thing if it's got a page or two missing, or I have two solid pages of notes about a project that I then set aside and moved on to a different one.

[mm1624124]

Personal:

a. Blank

b. 50-75 gsm

c. Egg shell, off-white color

d. around 100 sheets

e. no bleeding, no feathering, no spreading, some show through--minimal

f. smyth sewn, saddle stitch, but glued is ok

g. A5 or B5--8x6 or 10x7--8x5 is too "skinny"

h. smooth or textured paper--Midori or Tsubame as example

i. minimal branding on paper

j. blank cover--hardbacked preferred or sturdy softcover

k. lies flat

 

Midori MD A5 is my go to--fantastic paper, ideal weight paper, smooth--Nirvana would also include off-white instead of cream colored paper and leather cover.

 

Work/Research/Project:

Lined--6.5-7.0 mm

paginated

indexed

outside margin for annotation--example Ledgerdomain

top margin for title/subject/date

for the rest see above(b-k) except for item d.--15-30 pages "slim" for topic/project specific or "thick" 150-200 pages for extensive research and notation. Slim notebooks need not have pagination, index or margins.

 

Tried many but have decided to work with Tsubame because of the paper . I use the 40 sheet or the 200 sheet from mymaido depending on my needs and will use a template to create page numbers, margins, and indices. I wish the 200 sheet notebook was bound better and was hardbacked, but the binding seems sturdy enough. Now that I have learned about Rakuten and Tenso, I plan to buy by bulk as opportunity arises.

 

I'm currently using Lee Valley Everyman's Journal for work, but have decided that it doesn't open up wide enough or lay flat well enough and the paper is marginally acceptable. Levenger Ledgerdomain would have been "perfect" but the paper is atrocious.

 

I'm using Muji notebooks for math or chemistry work, simply because they are cheap, have absolute anonymity and great paper for fountain pens. For $1.50/each (saddle stitched) or a 5-pack/$3.95 (glued), they are hard to pass up.

 

I have Tomoe River and vintage onion skin paper, but the show through isn't really acceptable for journaling or daily writing. For personal correspondence, I think they are tops. :clap1:

Edited December 15, 2012 by mm1624124

[StyloBug33]

I think my requirements are very similar to what other's have said:

 

Smooth paper that doesn't bleed or show through

Lies flat when open

A good size - I like something roughly 6 x 9

Is pretty, but not annoying

 

I am currently making my own Levenger Circa notebooks with their Jr. size covers, 1/2 inch rings and HP Premium 32# paper cut to 8.5 x 6 inches. I print lines on the paper and then punch it. The paper underneath the translucent Levenger cover is from the inside of envelopes of nice stationery. Scrapbooking paper works very well also.

 

Here is my current one:

http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k526/stylobug33/Pens%20and%20Paper%202012%20and%20earlier/EE33204F-7441-41E0-BA5C-E4A2E880BB46-11757-0000077CA03F9195.jpg

http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k526/stylobug33/Pens%20and%20Paper%202012%20and%20earlier/C5163B21-2712-4117-9134-D792256AAE15-11757-0000077D1FF2C426.jpg

Edited December 15, 2012 by StyloBug33

[Linsolv]

I think my requirements are very similar to what other's have said:

 

Smooth paper that doesn't bleed or show through

Lies flat when open

A good size - I like something roughly 6 x 9

Is pretty, but not annoying

 

I am currently making my own Levenger Circa notebooks with their Jr. size covers, 1/2 inch rings and HP Premium 32# paper cut to 8.5 x 6 inches. I print lines on the paper and then punch it. The paper underneath the translucent Levenger cover is from the inside of envelopes of nice stationery. Scrapbooking paper works very well also.

 

Here is my current one:

http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k526/stylobug33/Pens%20and%20Paper%202012%20and%20earlier/EE33204F-7441-41E0-BA5C-E4A2E880BB46-11757-0000077CA03F9195.jpg

http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k526/stylobug33/Pens%20and%20Paper%202012%20and%20earlier/C5163B21-2712-4117-9134-D792256AAE15-11757-0000077D1FF2C426.jpg

 

I was WONDERING how to have a personalized cover design. Just picked up an Arc (and punch) a week or so ago, and I was contemplating putting together a few personal notebooks, but I didn't want to have to limit myself to buying full notebooks just so I could have a cover. So... thanks for the accidental tip!

[iamchum]

I've struggled to find relatively cheap lined a4 notebooks/notepads for works sake. Seems like that market has become dominated by cheap brands in officeworks where I come from (it's like a crapper version of staples). So, I have resorted to making my own using HP 32lb paper and whatever else is lying around the house. my predominate requests in an ultimate journal would be for it to have decently smooth heavyweight paper, be durable, but not flashy, and economical.

 

This is a notepad I just made recently

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9881/dsc00566dg.jpg

[jesse.bo]

I've struggled to find relatively cheap lined a4 notebooks/notepads for works sake. Seems like that market has become dominated by cheap brands in officeworks where I come from (it's like a crapper version of staples). So, I have resorted to making my own using HP 32lb paper and whatever else is lying around the house. my predominate requests in an ultimate journal would be for it to have decently smooth heavyweight paper, be durable, but not flashy, and economical.

 

This is a notepad I just made recently

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9881/dsc00566dg.jpg

That's a handsome Japanese stab journal there. I have yet to try that binding style. I have a monopoly board that is calling to be one.

[Runnin_Ute]

Just bought my first Black n' Red journal/notebook - clothbound in A4 size at Office Depot. Thanks to a card I was given by a former employer a $10+ purchase turned into $5.52 after sales tax. (I think price before tax would have been $9.99 if didn't have the card.)

 

I haven't really spent any time writing in it yet. But will post my impressions once I have written in it some. I had previously noticed that at least some have used it.

[inkypete]

Get hold of the original Habana and do that in a couple of sizes. Problem solved.