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Montblanc...worth The Money?


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#31 ZaphodBB

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 07:28


To those who buy them, of course.


To those who don't, of course not!


+1
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#32 andybiotic

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 07:33

This question can actually be answered rather objectively. Just look at the market as a whole. Is the brand / specific model survivable in the market and making a profit? If so, then that means that the majority of the target consumers think they are worth the money. Of course there are always a few people who think it is a ripped off but majorities always rule.

If the ratio those two groups of people were interchanged then the pen would have been long gone from the market.
To give you another example, McDonald, sure some think they are junk foods but there are a lot more people buying them than those who don't.

The market (formed by the target consumers of the product not every single person in the world) decides if something is worth the price tag and in this case with Mont Blanc (as well as McDonald), the market says yes.

There is a reason why there is a sub-forum here dedicated for Mont Blanc and has the most replies of all the brand focus forums and second most topics (just after of Parker).

Edited by andybiotic, 02 November 2011 - 07:47.

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#33 dickydotcom

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 07:41

The value of anything is what someone will pay for it.
Some people will pay the asking price for MB pen.
Therefore they are worth the money. End of.

Me, I'd rather have something that doesn't scream I bought this because I want people to think I have the best. (even if it is the best and I don't know the answer to that one.)

Dick D

#34 ethernautrix

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 07:44

Wait, what was the question again?
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#35 akrishna59

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 07:57

my friend,

montblanc has become a lifestyle brand, its focus is on exclusivity and the high cost (even for entry level pens) is one sure way of keeping it exclusive. the cost does not have much to do with how much the pen is worth, you see.

those who wish to be part of such a category can go ahead and buy it.

there was a time when they sold their pens as pens, not as a showpiece but that time is gone.

personally, i will never buy a montblanc, the way that company goes about disgusts me.

rgds.

krishna.
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#36 mirosc

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 08:00

I suggest that everyone answering here adds if he has a Montblanc or not :-)

Given the fact that almost every 5 seconds a person is starving on this planet, the answer is no.
Given the fact that a Montblanc is for some people not only a writing tool, but gives them daily pleasure and joy and makes them happy, the answer is yes.

I do have a MB149, but I don't like it so much (due to personal writing habits)


Greetings,
Michael

#37 Glenn-SC

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 08:15

I suggest that everyone answering here adds if he has a Montblanc or not :-)

This question just reinforces the "worth the cost or not" question.

My answer; "No, I do not own any MB pens."
I have written with about a dozen and only one wrote "well" (some barely).

#38 rockspyder

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 08:30

Simple question: are Montblancs worth the money?


Yes.

Does what Montblanc offers, justify the hefty price tag?


Yes.

With all the competition around, does Montblanc declare superiority?


Yes.

For example, can a simple, black Meiesterstuck declare superiority over a specificationally special pen, like the Homo Sapiens?


No, because pens are not able to declare. The owner of the simple, black Meisterstuk can make such a declaration. You may wish to rephrase this question.

Is the 149 worth the hundreds of $ extra over Dunhill's flagship Sentryman??


Yes.

I am just wondering if Montblancs have become slightly overrated, given the opinion of stylophiles, not simply the general populace.


I don't know what a stylophile is but I am a bonafide member of the general populace, and as a self-appointed spokesperson for that entire group, I declare that Montblancs have not become slightly overrated, nor greatly overrated. They are rated at exactly the correct amount.

What else do you want to know?

+1 :clap1: :clap1: :clap1: :clap1: :clap1: :thumbup:

#39 andybiotic

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 08:31

Given the fact that almost every 5 seconds a person is starving on this planet, the answer is no.


Then there is no need to buy anything other than a single basic bic? I feel horrible owning a fountain pen...

Edited by andybiotic, 02 November 2011 - 08:41.

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#40 troglokev

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 08:47

1. this is the first time i've seen this question around

You have, how many, 11 posts?

This is what is referred to on the interwebz as a n00b mistake.

It may well be your first time with this particular question, but it is far from the first time for the rest of us. We are fed up to the back teeth with n00bs who think that this is an original or interesting question. It is far from that.

If you wish to display your sophistication, I suggest that you explain the concept of hermeneutic respectability to Heidegger's English translators.

If you wish to make a contribution and become a respected member of this board, you need to find another topic.

#41 SamCapote

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 09:08


There is no other brand/model pen that is exactly the same as the models made by Montblanc, and trying to compare them on specific features is futile.



That's not the position Montblanc lawyers take when they sue another pen company.


Wait...you are bringing lawyers into this discussion? Lawyers will take any side of any case if someone is paying their fee. If not, they will zealously chase down ambulances to fill the gaps in billable hours. That's a specious argument since all of the major pen manufacturers have filed claims against competitors to defend their brand.
With the new FPN rules, now I REALLY don't know what to put in my signature.

#42 SamCapote

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 09:24

my friend,

montblanc has become a lifestyle brand, its focus is on exclusivity and the high cost (even for entry level pens) is one sure way of keeping it exclusive. the cost does not have much to do with how much the pen is worth, you see.

those who wish to be part of such a category can go ahead and buy it.

there was a time when they sold their pens as pens, not as a showpiece but that time is gone.

personally, i will never buy a montblanc, the way that company goes about disgusts me.

rgds.

krishna.


I paid roughly the same price for my Pelikan M1000, as my MB 149, as my Parker Duofold Centennial, as my Nakaya Aka Tamenuri, as my Visconti Homo Sapien, as my vintage Waterman 52 Red nib Wet Noodle flex nib.

I love them all and each has different aspects to appreciate. The adjectives used and way the OP worded their questions displayed an immediate bias, and seeking agreement for their viewpoint. Congratulations, your post fulfills their desire.

Personally, I find there are a lot more important issues in the world to get disgusted about than how a pen company runs its business. I usually start the search for disgust by looking in the mirror. Rarely can I then justify shifting my gaze upon others.
With the new FPN rules, now I REALLY don't know what to put in my signature.

#43 andybiotic

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 09:25


1. this is the first time i've seen this question around

You have, how many, 11 posts?

This is what is referred to on the interwebz as a n00b mistake.

It may well be your first time with this particular question, but it is far from the first time for the rest of us. We are fed up to the back teeth with n00bs who think that this is an original or interesting question. It is far from that.

If you wish to display your sophistication, I suggest that you explain the concept of hermeneutic respectability to Heidegger's English translators.

If you wish to make a contribution and become a respected member of this board, you need to find another topic.



That is a bit harsh, mate....

It is true that there are quite a few newer members lately repeating similar questions every other week but I just ignore them or go to another sub-forum. Too bad the sub-forums are not as popular...
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#44 SamCapote

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 09:33

5. 42 is the correct answer to the question "What is the meaning of life the universe and everything"


Thanks! I kept thinking it was 24. No wonder I'm so confused.

Despite his beliefs, may God bless Douglas Adams, who left us at way too young an age.
With the new FPN rules, now I REALLY don't know what to put in my signature.

#45 rockspyder

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 09:38

:thumbup: Attaboy, Sam! :thumbup: I agree all the way.

Not a day goes by without writing with one or more MB's. I will buy every single one of them all over again. I have bought more MB's in different countries than any other brand. Their presence and endurance in the market deserves some credit too, like it or not.
Interesting, how the negative comments invariably come from those who own no or few MB's. :hmm1:

#46 Edgar Allan Bo

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 11:26


The used materials?


What! Precious resin is made from second hand, used materials? Well, at least that is sort of green. . . .

And macaddicted says they have their own cache? Why would where they are stored have any affect on pricing? Are they in a cloud?

Just wondering. :ninja:


The materials they have USED to make the pen (I don't speak english.) are not worth the price. (of course!)

The pen itself (after it's been put together) is worth any price they're asking for (if the pen is in working order.)

Edited by Edgar Allan Bo, 02 November 2011 - 11:27.


#47 mirosc

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 11:26

Then there is no need to buy anything other than a single basic bic? I feel horrible owning a fountain pen...

Exactly. Whatever you feel is priced "right" or not is only based on your own personally chosen set of reference points.
How can anyone here possibly know by which standards another members wants to judge value???
Greetings,
Michael

#48 andybiotic

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 11:36

How can anyone here possibly know by which standards another members wants to judge value???


Yes, but the market knows. Just like I said in the post earlier. The market, hence the majority of the target consumers, says that Mont Blanc is worth it, otherwise they would have gone off the market already.

Edited by andybiotic, 02 November 2011 - 11:38.

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#49 mirosc

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 11:44

Yes, but the market knows. Just like I said in the post earlier. The market, hence the majority of the target consumers, says that Mont Blanc is worth it, otherwise they would have gone off the market already.


Of course, no doubt to that. Still I have the impression that the threadopener wants to learn reasons for this success - and actually I doubt if there can be an objective answer to that or if not many reasons to buy such a pen are purely personal....
Well, nothing new under the sun, isn't it? :-)
Greetings,
Michael

#50 olivier78860

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 12:22

I own a 149, a 254, a 344, a Poe, a legrand ballpoint, and classique ballpoint and pencil.
I really like the 254 and the 344, FP-wise. But the nibs aren't better than those on the pens of other brands from the same period. Both have nibs far superior to the modern 149's.

So my conclusion :
Nib-wise, you can find that quality in most major brands. Design-wise, no need to talk about, it's personal tastes.

I think MB does too much marketing, my view is that I don't like that, so I'm not interested in this brand anymore. Nowadays, I prefer S.T. Dupont or Pelikan.

Edited by olivier78860, 02 November 2011 - 13:41.

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#51 georges zaslavsky

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 12:31

For me vintage 149s and 146s are worth the money because of the better nibs and larger piston filling system.
Pens are like watches , once you start a collection, you can hardly go back. And pens like all fine luxury items do improve with time
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#52 chris.hale

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 12:35

I do believe that Montblancs are overpriced and that a high percentage of people are buying them for the brand cachet rather than their value as a writing tool. Having said that, my dream pen is a Pelikan 805 and you could probably say exactly the same about those.

The bottom line is that it's personal preference, if you don't think a Montblanc makes financial sense you don't have to buy one.

#53 jar

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 14:17

1. this is the first time i've seen this question around
2. a stylophile is a better term than a pen-lover
3. basically, my point is, given that everyone sells black resin pens, why does montblanc sell for more expensive than brands like waterman, dunhill, or parker?


btw, this is a serious debate; don't see a point to closing the thread.


Have you actually checked prices?

Sure, Montblanc sells some high priced pens, but guess what?

Dunhill sells models that have a higher MSRP than many Montblanc pens. So does Yard-o-Led, Conway Stewart, ST Dupont, Aurora, Visconti, Cartier, Ferrari da Varese, Montegrappa, OMAS, Waterman, Sheaffer, Graf von Faber Castell, Caran D'Ache, Classic Pens, Delta, Krone and I'm sure many I have forgotten to mention.

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#54 AltecGreen

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 14:53



There is no other brand/model pen that is exactly the same as the models made by Montblanc, and trying to compare them on specific features is futile.



That's not the position Montblanc lawyers take when they sue another pen company.


Wait...you are bringing lawyers into this discussion? Lawyers will take any side of any case if someone is paying their fee. If not, they will zealously chase down ambulances to fill the gaps in billable hours. That's a specious argument since all of the major pen manufacturers have filed claims against competitors to defend their brand.



If there are no pens 'exactly the same as the models made by Montblanc', then why do they keep on suing other pen companies. Are they not making the claim that someone is making 'identical' or at least 'simliar' pens when they file these kinds of lawsuits. The current case against Senator is an example. MB tried to sue Stipula for using three cap rings on their pens.

Then there was the case against Roger Cromwell. The list goes on and on and on.


Why is it a specious argument when you claim no one makes pens similar to MB yet they use that argument in their lawsuits? Do you have examples of other pen companies suing another in the modern era? Of course, there were many cases in the 'golden age' of fountain pens but those were often patent infringement cases in an era of active fountain pen development. The modern cases are egregious.

BTW-I do currently own one MB pen (trying to get rid of it) and have no problems buying and selling MB pens. I treat them as a commodity rather than as a pen. They do hold their value well and modern MBs are easy to sell.

Edited by AltecGreen, 02 November 2011 - 15:17.

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#55 lsmith42

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 15:01

I suggest that everyone answering here adds if he has a Montblanc or not :-)

I do not own a Mont Blanc...

(everything is true on the interwebs, right?)
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#56 leod

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 15:22

Is a particular "Brand" worth the money?

Yes if you're willing to pay for it, that's why you have a choice. any brand is not forcing you to buy their product.
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing

#57 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 15:25

"""""""I really like the 254 and the 344, FP-wise. But the nibs aren't better than those on the pens of other brands from the same period. Both have nibs far superior to the modern 149's."""""""""

I don't have MB's from the 10's-teens, 20's and 30-40's. :huh:

Vintage MB '50-65 are worth the money. :notworthy1: First class nibs. So rated by the MB gang, who chase the 146-9 from then.
Soennecken was the pen MB chased. I have a Soennecken Wet Noodle. So MB had to keep up with the Jones's.

In my top 11 nibs are mostly '50-65 nibs. MB 234 1/2 Deluxe semi-flex KOB from 1955 # 1, :notworthy1: , Pelikan 400NN #2,(A '56 Pelikan set 400NN, BP, MP, etui and that '55 MB that I did not want ( :headsmack: :bonk: ) were € 170 in a life action.) :notworthy1:,140. :notworthy1: Geha 790, :notworthy1: Osmia, and Osmia-Faber Castell. :notworthy1: Even in Steel nibs as good as gold for Osmia; that I have in both.
Vintage '66-75 are almost worth the money. Very close to first class nibs, but not quite pre'66.....Got one from there that time that is very very good, but it's Geha 725, # 3. :notworthy1: What rolled gold trimmed 725 Geha was what Geha chased and caught MB with.

Any MB made after that' 75, is third class. Only got a springy nib if one is lucky. Unless one will put up with waltzing smooth as good enough.

My most expensive pen; a Virginia Woolf, that I got on sale for € 450, is only my # 12, nib; a waltzing nib. The pen might be a bit higher rated because it's dead pretty. My Geha late '50-60's 790's KM a plain looking Pelikan chaser, has a better nib.

Affordable are my Geha, old Pelikans, and Osmia's too.My '50's MB was affordable too. :thumbup:

My Woolf along with an Aurora Verdi, were beaten in the B&M by my Geha 725 my third best nib, my best non-oblique.
I had other nibs at home as good as the semi-flex Aurora. My Pelikan 605 was @ as smooth as my Woolf. But That was one Pretty pen...and my wife was buying me a birthday present. :cloud9:
Odd...some time later it was not 'her' money, but 'ours' that was spent. After Easter I can afford another pen. :rolleyes:

An MB is for those who Can't afford to chase the best pen made, the Soennecken 111/222. Andreas Lambrou said it was the best pen of it's era. That era was Snorkel and 146-9.

Impulse buying...OK I like that MB Woolf, but I could have gotten two Soennecken 111/222 for that. :bonk:

What is money...well to those who don't have much, any top of the line modern pen is too expensive. But at least MB, Aurora and Pelikan put some guts into some of them.
To a man who spends $200 on a bottle of wine from time to time when dining, MB is not expensive.
When one wants to know if one should serve Thunderbird with the fish, and Mad Dog 20-20 with the dog food, a Bic is expensive.
Ripple is a nice desert wine of course. :blink:


I really think out side of Dupont, c/c pens are vastly too expensive.

What I do find expensive is MB repair for € 50-70 we will demean our selves to look at your pen; then tell you what it will cost.

Pelikan is love my customer great and cheap for repairs. Pelikan still has to push quality as it's main point, not showing off status.
Aurora, Conway Stewart make some real nice pens, if one is willing to buy for the same MB level. For folks with out red tabs on their suits. :unsure:

That reminds me, I got to ink my Woolf. It time to see what it does with a nice cheap Pelikan blue black a dry ink.


Would I buy my Woolf again. Yes it's pretty, nibs ok. The nib is my eye to it bling, not across the table, much less across the room.
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Pictures with permission of pentime.com; I'd never be able to get that nib to show and he takes better pictures than me.

I didn't buy it to impress any one. Being retired, I please my self. I bought it because it was real pretty and had a nib as smooth as my steel Cross Townsend, and Pelikan 605, but it was a springy nib. I didn't have a springy nib. I had '90's regular flex nibs; tad more flex than modern, vintage semi-flex & maxi-semi-flex/'flexi'...but no springy nibs.

Four different papers later....it's not a bad nib at all, some times one needs to waltz instead of Foxtrot and Tango all the time. :vbg: "New" ink got to see how it writes. I'd not got around to blue black.

Tomorrow, I'll let you know how it writes with Pelikan blue-black, because like all good blue blacks, one don't know to the next day how it will look in according to Richard, a good blue black dries to a different tone over night.

If I was to come into some money the next pen I'd buy would be that Aurora Verdi, in a B nib. For Modern Aurora has some real fine vintage thin, semi-flex nibs if one asks for one at the factory. :thumbup:

Edited by Bo Bo Olson, 02 November 2011 - 15:30.

Due to Mauricio's improved definition of Super-flex, I no longer use the term Easy Full Flex.

 

Semi-flex is an “almost” flex; not a ‘flex’ nib. It is great for regular writing with a touch of flair. It can give you some fancy; but it is not made for real fancy writing. For bit more of that get a 'flexi'/maxi-semi-flex. Both spread tines 3X.  Those are not "Flex" nibs. 

 

Odd, how many who should know better, compares Japanese F (which equals EF), with Western F, with out a second thought, but do not compare Japanese B with Western B.

 

Wider than Normal does not exist. Wider than Japanese does. Every company has it's very own standard + slop/tolerance. Developed from the users of it's pens only; not the users of other companies pens. The size you grind a nib to, is your standard only. Paper and ink matter to nib width. Thank god for 1/2 sizes or it would be boring.


#58 ethernautrix

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 16:15

Oh for heaven's sake, why do we ever have anything?




Sheesh, this is why we can't have nice things....
I ink; therefore, I am
Fleekair <--French accent.

#59 lsmith42

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 16:16

Oh Kay... I'm tired now...
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#60 RudyR

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Posted 02 November 2011 - 16:27

1. The question has in fact been asked and answered many times on FPN
2. Yes there are clearly MB lovers and MB haters
3. This question usually ends up in a flame battle between the two
4. If it does, it will be shut down
5. 42 is the correct answer to the question "What is the meaning of life the universe and everything"


42, yes that is the answer I was trying to convey. thank your for clearing that up for me.

Yes.... 42... that is the answer to the OP's question.
Fountain Pen is SPY!!